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Descartes' Presuppositions

Who can tell me what is wrong with the following famous claim?

"I think, therefore I am."

JudgeHolden 4 Aug 12
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1

Rene Descartes walks into a McDonald's, orders a Big Mac and fries.
The server asks "Would you like a drink with that?".
Descartes responds "I think not", and instantly vanishes.

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These kinds of "discussions" are extremely exasperating to me.

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"I think, therefore I think" is a reasonable proposition.

So we need another proposition that gets us from thinking to being, such as "I think, therefore I must be".

But that is the claim we are testing, so the argument is circular.

Or, as Ambrose Bierce observed, "Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum" -- I think that I think, therefore I think that I am.

But seriously, the implication is that if thinking is occurring, there must be a thinker.

@cmadler If a thought exists, it exists, but how does it bring something else (a thing that thinks) into being?

@Gareth A thought doesn't bring a thinker into existence. It's not causative; it's a logical supposition. If a thought exists, that implies the existence of a thinker.

@cmadler My question was rhetorical. Descartes was attempting to avoid suppositions. That's the problem.

@Gareth The supposition is "I think". The conclusion is "If I think, then I exist as a thinker."

@cmadler No. "I think" is the premiss. You can't form an conclusion from a single premiss. Descartes violates the principles of formal logic by sneaking in a suppressed premiss, which is the conclusion itself. That was the point in my original post.

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Sounds reasonable to me. Hats off to the man for noticing.

3

Cogito Ergo Sum

Enlighten me!

Je pense que.... it is funny how later intellectuals traverse the trappings of earlier minds who lived an entirely different Social Dynamic. The funny thing is Rene Descarte was a Mathematical Genius as well as a Renowned Philosopher. These critics do not compare to the mental faculty of this being. Was he a believer, yes, just like everyone else who was socially conditioned from birth to believe in the judaic deity yahweh.

Secondly, Descarte was involed with a secret society. I am not sure if it was Rosicrucian or Masonic. Those orders do not believe in the God concept as the common christians do.

.....Je suis.

as above so below...

I find those other arguments petty.

The verb to think is an action that is in cognizance of differential states of being, irregardless of the Latin pronoun "ego", "I, I myself". Whatever Spirit/Psyche/Consciousness is possessive of the "corpore praesens," body present.

The act of being conscious does not mean the state of being is conscious of the Self or Self Cognizant. The early philosophers, plato, socrates, ect...spoke of the lower conscious beings. Those who were not of Spiritus Animus. The Common Consciousness vs the Illuminated Consciousness.

Etre Level 7 Aug 13, 2018

Much apreciate... always despised the "Ignorance of Youth". The little they can relate to previous eras but want to pass judgement. In my youth I was reminded by my grandmother time and time again that we are born Ignorants and only Time and Experience will make you Wise.

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I know a lot of people who am, but don't think.

6

well to my mind most of the population DON'T think but their existence can't be disputed because the fuckers keep getting in my way!

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