You posted "honest discussion" hope you meant it. In my opinion, when we are young and beautiful and taking advantage of our own youthful attributes (and we all did lest we be hypocrites), we don't think about the decades into our futures when we discover we have aged with wrinkles and sagging bodies. It's at that time of middle-age catharsis that we decide that we should be accepting of people beyond their looks.

You can wish all you want. It is biology. It has always been this way and always will be. Human beings like looking at things of beauty whether it is a painting, a mountain, a car, or another human being. That will never change.

Since high school to the present day I have found that some of the people which society has deemed were the most ugly people and frown on them are some of the nicest people and make great friends.To penalize these people for something they had no control over is plain cruel and this is something that our society needs to correct.The same goes for race relations. I have black,Indian India,iranian who are friends plus a Chinese grand daughter.

Seems to me it is merely denying our nature to be attracted to what we find appealing. Not sure why that is such a negative thing.

I think the real problem is thinking that one person is better than others because of a specific skill or aspect they have. I enjoy looking at beautiful people just like I enjoy looking at butterflies and flowers. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. But if I were to think that they are better people than the short, balding guy or the overweight, wrinkled woman just because they have a better body, that's where it would be a problem. It works with other aspects that we humans value as well, like intelligence, talents like singing and dancing, or the size of a bankroll. When we determine that someone is not valuable because they aren't good looking enough or intelligent enough, and treat them badly because of it, that's where we run into trouble.

Well as long there is capitalism, beauty, fashion and entertainment there will be objectification of bodies. I don’t mind seeing models advertising perfume etc. on the whole, but I do have an issue with abusive objectification (violent porn) and photoshopping everything, and shite like “Housewives of” programs and “ Keeping up with the Kardashians” I am a young at heart generation X-er, but most of my friends are millennials. Airbrushed photos and the social media tendencies to post “my best life” stories and photos, devoid of normality have really fucked with my friends heads.
Beautiful young men and women from aged 30 downwards feeling very dissatisfied with their lives, their relationships, their looks...girlfriends in the 20s are plucked, botoxed, have puffed faces with fillers and extensions and are constantly chasing the unattainable in their lives. No wonder there are weird sub-groups like incels. Their entire reality is an objectification and they cannot cope with crushing insecurity. It’s bad for man and women.

To prepare for her wedding in September, my daughter, Claire, 28, has been taking an intense, Boot Camp Cross-Fit exercise class, five days a week for the past three months.

"Mom, I can do 100 burpees and push ups, but I haven't lost any weight," Claire said unhappily. "I want to be thin like you in my wedding dress."

"Honey, muscle weighs six times more than fat," I replied. "How do your clothes fit? You are fit and healthy. That should be your goal. You have a different body type than your ectomorph mother."

"Look at your engagement photos to see how lovely you look," I suggested. Claire thanked me.

Beauty is only skin deep is old adage but a true one. We can all appreciate beauty, either the beauty of nature or physical beauty in another person. The problem arises when we objectify it in people as you do rightly point out. Someone who is pleasing on the eye draws us to them, however once we get to know another person regardless of how good looking or not they are, it is their personalities that keep us wanting to spend time with them. A beautiful empty shell, void of emotional depth will soon bore us. I don’t think we are going to stop sex and beauty being used to sell commodities any time soon, or ever for that matter, but in our personal lives we can take more time to see what is hidden under the skin and not be prejudiced by first impressions.

This is why I didn't post any photos here for the first six months. I feel like people see my body, and then they automatically, involuntarily stop looking (and therefore fail to "see" my personality, thoughts, etc.) Because what else is there?

I wish it were normal to love and celebrate all the bodies.

I wish sexuality were untethered from shame.

I wish everyone could feel beautiful.

I wish beauty were not a competition, or a zero-sum game.

I wish nudity were untethered from sexuality.

I have always admired the physical beauty of women. I think they are the most beautiful objects on planet Earth. I’m sure women feel the same about men. Beauty comes in all shapes and sizes and it’s up to the beholder what they think is beautiful. I have my shortcomings and never was a model and never will me. As I have said plenty of times, I’m no Brad Pitt.

I believe it's natural for people of either sex to find physically attractive members of the opposite sex enjoyable to look at and more sexually attractive. But I also believe that a person's physical attractiveness is very little of who that person is. For a man to care only about a woman's looks is shallow. There is so much more to a woman, or a man for that matter, than physical appearance. Who the person really is -- the inner aspects of who or what a woman/man is -- these things are what are really important. And it is true that physical beauty is way overstressed in American society today.

At the same time. we are all sexual beings, and I think it's only natural for people to find some people more attractive sexually than others based in part on physical attractiveness. But there is vastly more to us than are looks, and qualities such as intelligence, kindness, a sense of humor, can also make a person very desirable as a whole human being. There's a lot more to attractiveness or desirability than just sexual attraction or desire.

Last night I attended "The Full Monty" musical at the Performing Art Center in Wenatchee.

"The Full Monty" was hilarious, touching, thought-provoking and brave. Watching actors courageously get naked on stage got me thinking about body hate.

The men had a wide range of body types, from obese to thin. One shockingly thin man appeared to have muscle-wasting disease. But boy, could he sing and dance!

When the male actors got naked, I was surprised to see hanging abdominal flesh and rolls of fat around their middles. This got me thinking about my distorted, negative view of my body and expectations of perfection.

"These days, any sign of body imperfection, particularly being overweight, will bring down the wrath of society - that is, the Internet," wrote Todd Leopold in "Why We Can't Stop Body-Shaming" on CNN.

[cnn.com]

I agree. Hollywood has done that. Most people don't fit into (their) Idea of whats beautiful. Look at most of the (beautiful) actors and actresses. We have all seen pics of them in everyday life. Not all prettied up. They just are like you and me. Just in a higher tax bracket. We just buy what they are selling. A fantasy. That's for the most part what what it is. Just a story. CSI, most if not all real CSI folks are just normal folks in lab coats and glasses intelligent, educated people. Not sexy goth girl with big boobs.

I notice beautiful people when I they’re around, but I make a conscious effort to glance rather than stare. I certainly don’t let anyone know that I’m checking someone out. I don’t know if that’s objectifying or just enjoying the scenery.

Sexual attraction is the basis of human survival, isn't it? We'll probably never get past the ''pretty girl selling flowers'' person at the farmers' market...she's always going to sell more than a 90-year-old troll. The REAL challenge is, as individuals AND as groups, achieving the maturity to look past a crooked nose, acne or obesity, overcoming our tendency to fawn over simple beauty.

Most people are biologically drawn towards physical beauty (everyone's specific definition could be different but there are physical traits that are more widely accepted as beautiful or attractive for men and women). Like KateZilla mentioned "sex sells," and I don't believe that will ever go away. Hopefully (but not anytime soon), we as a society will continue to evolve to begin seeing others beyond physical beauty, as in getting first impressions based on who a person is instead of physical looks.

I agree with you. I understand that men are visual, that they just need to see a scantily clothed woman and he gets turned on, of course not all men. It seems very primitive to me that we try to entice men with women in bikinis to sell products. A woman should be revered and not looked at like a piece of meat. Lusting after her body may do it for the short term, but that doesn't leave anything left for the long term. Get to know the woman on a personal level, learn about her deepest hopes, dreams, and fears. Get to know her mind. Using women to push a product just adds to the inequality of women. Women are people too and should be treated as such.

Conversely, it should be the same for men. While women tend to be more feeling, they do enjoy a good piece of eye candy like the guys do. But is it necessary to reduce a man to a piece of meat as well? We have a long way to go to move away from this primitive thinking, but it is so ingrained in our DNA that it will be a very hard process to overcome. However, in the process, we will become closer as a society and better off for it.

I'm not a dresser and if I see something in a second hand store or on sale at a Flea Market I have no problem. Never owned Air Jordans, Cowboy Boots or had my body pierced for pins or earrings. I do not go to a barber, or dye my hair or wear a rug.
That is how I look at people, and want them to look at me.
Now go and think about Doctors, Lawyers, Priests and Politicians who all use every tool of the trade to make you feel that you are not of the same texture because they are into this for the long haul. A Monks Cowl, a Nuns Habit, a Yarmulka or Kippot, a Muslim Burka or Hijab. Lets not forget Kate and Meghans Hats . They sell newspapers and Clothing based on this hype but I was never impressed or deceived by any of it. I still wear my Army Field Jacket that I've had for 45 years.

Long, long ago, it was discovered that sex sells. An unfortunate byproduct of this is that objectification you're describing. I think it's possible to keep things in-perspective, however, and take that sexy salespitch for what it is and deal honestly with people. The reality is that we ALL consider appearance to some degree (when seeking a romantic partner). I think anyone who says otherwise is not being honest.

There's definitely too much emphasis on physical beauty and perfection in our society. Sadly it's used so much to sell stuff. Advertising bombards us with messages that we're not good enough until we buy this product or that product that's supposed to improve or enhance us in some way. I thought I was really ugly when I was younger and thus unworthy of anyone's love and attention, simply because I didn't fit the physical "norm" in terms of my size and shape, and thankfully as I've gotten older I've come to appreciate more and more who I am. I still see a lot of people though who are very critical of the way they look -- not just young people where it's always more prevalent, but people of all ages.

Objectification is, as you pointed out so well, a two way practice. I relate it to producer/consumerism, as we are in a society dominated by desire for 'stuff'; for toys.

In more civilized, so-called primitive societies the value stuff was in usefulness, not accumulation as a diversion. Stuff is differentiated from other humans and adornment is minimal and more individually expressive stuff. The difference I'm trying to illustrate is that people don't become stuff; or at least didn't until males began dominating and 'guiding' religious and social values. Then the race for stuff was on! People became stuff in terms of conquest and slavery, female and children ownership and accumulation. Male entitlement to the product 'stuff' of their labors also dawned.

Objectification is everywhere because stuff has actually become more valuable than people, so we try desperately to increase our social 'market value' by becoming more like stuff artificially, instead of more like our 'worthless selves'.

Anyone believing that people are more valued under the laws protecting us ought to look at criminal penalties for crimes against persons compared to crimes against property; save murder.
People will be put away a lot longer for taking our stuff than for 'touching our junk'...

I'd just spent my entire morning writing my seminary term paper on the greatest challenge facing society today, and possible solutions that may come about as the result of the evolution of human consciousness, when I saw. this post. While contemplating the undeniable and inevitable death of religion, and the possible replacements for religion as the opiates of society(actual opiates are the most obvious replacements) it occurred to me that the worship of physical appearance fits nicely with modern Celebrity Worship. The ideas you described in the last paragraph are consistent with a recently emerging level of understanding that is being labeled by Evolutionary Consciousness proponents as Integral Consciousness. This new elevated level of consciousness is currently only exhibited in less than 5% of the worlds population. Because it can take decades for societies to evolve as a whole, individual patience might be required in order to avoid depression over our society's current state of superficial amorality.

I think Martin Luther King's notion about judging (though the word has taken on a negative connotation) people by the "content of their character" is far more productive.

I like an educated person to talk to. Those who are in one gear can only talk about a few things gets boring. I like to see pretty women but then wonder if they can hold a conversation beyond all the crap they want. Then they start degrading others gets pretty stupid real fast. So seeing your profile name I would think you like to fish. Then would ask what type of fish do you usally go for. What method, bait trailing or jigging.

It's gonna keep happening because sex sells. Whether people's views on it change is something else. They are now encouraging large women in ads and photo shoots for instance--it will become more varied but it's not going away