As for religion represented in prisons, I doubt if it would ever be possible to get an honest answer to a poll on that. Regardless of their personal beliefs, inmates are going to check the box most likely to reduce their sentence or hasten their parole. Christianity is that box. Under the same circumstances, I'd probably check the Christianity box, too.

@Deb57
Had not thought about that one. Sad, so many hide behind Christianity for convenience of favor.

@Deb57 I am pretty sure that is shy such surveys are done anonymously, so nobody can tell who gave what answer. They know how to eliminate most bias from studies and unless someone is paying for the study with the hopes of a specific result, then studies are usually designed to elicit unbiased answers.

@Deb57, @Castlepaloma Outwardly, yes, they do. However a study can be designed to eliminate bias to illicit more honest answers through anonymity.

@snytiger6 That could still hinge on the level of trust of the inmate as to whether he believed he was protected by a promise of anonymity or non-bias. Paranoia is rampant in prison inmates for a myriad of reasons.

@Deb57 It can be overcome.

That is a good site, to see the difference between ethics and morals.

That is impossible as just by living others are harmed in some way. If not human than other forms of life. A report in the Seattle paper said that basically, the Orca's in our area will go extinct because the one thing we could do to insure their survival, cut down on our consumption of Salmon, we will refuse to do. Every single person on the planet has a negative effect on the environment and even when we die there is still an environmental cost. AKKGator

@JackPedigo Our disagreement is in who should be the beneficiary of our actions. For me it is my life as a human. The environment is a value only insofar as it benifits my life and other humans. It has no value without someone to value it. The same goes for other animals.

@sfvpool To me this question involves the level of one's sense of morals. As I have commented many times my late partner asked her 2nd graders, "what is more important, people or dirt"? We cannot be more important than that which sustains us. We could not survive with mother nature and a myriad of other life forms. Failing to recognize that will mean our extinction.
Beneficiary, hmm. The religious use the carrot and stick morality. If we follow that same creed we are not different then they.

@JackPedigo @SecularHumanist "what is more important, people or dirt?" Important to whom? Like I stated, to value something requires someone to value it, and the same goes for "importance." I am more important to me than dirt. Yes, dirt is value to me for growing food, for holding up the house I live in, and many other things, but without me, it has no value to me. And, since dirt has value to me, I don't remove it from my property and I water my lawn.

You imply that we should be worried about every action we take and how it may harm someone. I disagree. You are using a computer or smart-phone to type your statements, the manufacturing of which may harm someone by your standards, so obviously you don't take your morality seriously. I drive an SUV, and I don't worry about it harming someone, unless I get into an accident. Any minor damage it may cause by its emissions are far outweighed by the value I and other people get from my driving it. Do you want us to go back to living in caves and hunting for food? Of course that would also cause damage to the environment, with the killing of animals.

Like I stated, for me, what is good is what is good for my life and other humans. I am part of the environment of the earth and I care about me first. I don't believe we will destroy "mother earth", a phrase which is interestingly similar to "mother Russia", and if we do, we'll find another way to survive as a species.

You compared my morality to religious morality. Most religious morality is more like the morality you are espousing. Sacrifice is the code of religious morality. Sacrifice to a god or to the meek. My morality is the opposite of sacrifice. I don't believe in sacrificing anything and think that sacrifice is bad. Sacrifice is giving up a value for something of less value, which I try not to do.

. @sfvpool I see a lot of things I supposedly implied and suggested which I did not. When people say things that I supposedly said and then take things personally it tells me it is useless debating. So I won't.

@JackPedigo I'm sorry, my response was to both you and @SecularHumanist. I apologize for implying that you said things you didn't, that wasn't my intention. I didn't have much time when I responded, so I combined my responses. Sorry...

@sfvpool You are right, I didn't read the other comment. Thanks for letting me know.

@SecularHumanist Thanks for your civil response. What you propose as a moral guideline is sacrificing to all sentient beings alive now and in the future, as well as to the biosphere? Why should one do that?

I believe my life belongs to me and I should be the primary focus of it. In my original statement, I wrote, "as long as we don't harm others", by which I meant, and wish I had written, as long as we don't use physical force or coercion against them.

Do not harm is the best and bottom line rule.

I sense Religion dose more harm than good. They are too concerned about war and sex. Plus careless about the natural environment.

@Castlepaloma @jlynn37 is the one to thank for "do no harm". See?? I actually do pay attention to
what (some) other members say. ?

@KKGator Thank you dear friend. I appreciate you.

@jlynn37

Thanks
I always said, do anything you want. As long as it does not harm anyone else.

@Castlepaloma Totally agree.

Those three are my watchwords.

Yes I agree.

Look up the difference between ethics and morals.

@JackPedigo I did.
" - ethics refer to rules provided by an external source, e.g., codes of conduct in workplaces - "

Sounds to me like ethics are not necessarily entwined with religion, which seemed to be the topic at hand.
Can we explain the issue of ethics ... away of religion?

If ethics can refer to rules provided by an external source in a place of work, then there is no question whether ethics can be separated from religion. It's already been done.

Or have I misunderstood something?

@MLinoge The rest of the sentence says "or principles in religions." For clergy and religious workers their religion is also their place of work. I would ask what is work? It would seem work are efforts that people do to obtain some reward and money is only one. Might an (unrealistic) goal of immortality also qualify religion as work?

@JackPedigo "I would ask what is work?"
Is all work religion? Are all workers religious? If not, my point stands.

The goal of immorality qualifies religion as work.......
Sorry. This goes somewhere I can't follow.

Is vegetarianism a moral or ethical issue? I see it as a moral one.

@Bobby9

Who is more hippocrites to those morals than the Christians. For the moral acts of war and prisoners in the US. Where the US Congress is 99℅ judeo/Christians. If they were practicing ethics, they would not be able to give out licences to steal, kill and lie.

@maturin1919

I think the opposite.

Just simplified the 10 commandment morals down to two ethical rules.
Don't harm
Be honest.

Like other stupid morals . Like kill your neighbors if he works on the Sabbath. Like if he is mowing the lawn..

The bible morals claims to be truth and univeral knowledge and taken literally from dark ages? Not even a newspaper can be taken word for word for a number of reasons... political bias, lack of or misinformation, and human error.

The Bible morals are not nearly as solid ethical as the US Constitution in this respect of hundreds years ago vs thousands of years ago.

Thank doG, the word God is not mentioned in the original Constitution.

@maturin1919

Only two cases, you have the right to kill.
In order to eat.
To protect yourself from being killed.
I can't imagine running out of ideas to kill anyone.

The death penalty and wars who kill.. Try to prove to us, killing is wrong. That makes them hippocrites, rather than giving us much better ethical solutions.

@maturin1919

Like a storekeeper killng (got off Scott free) a shoplifters who got shot 6 times as he tried to steal a package of tobacco.

Or killing millions of innocent people over in the middle East over an unproven 11/9 or assuming they have weapons of mass destruction.

Killing will never stop killing or Violence will not stop violences. Countries who don't have the death penalty have far less murderers. Besides it cost more giving them the death penalty. Than to keep them in prison for life.

@maturin1919

You don't have atheist on your list?

Because, many Religious people put atheist worst than rapist . Lol, personally I don't put anyone on my hunting season list.

@maturin1919

In general, I find American Christians queer about atheist. The distrust of atheists is well known, but did you know that atheists are distrusted as much as or possibly a bit more than rapists? When presented with an apparently random person doing illegal and unethical things, few people were willing to identify the person as a Christian, more were willing to identify them as a Muslim, and the most were willing to identify them as a rapist or an atheist.

@maturin1919

I did not say you Strike me as Religious, you put that into your own head. I already knew you are atheist from your profile. You had such a long list for Bobby's kill list, it was so bazaar and funny.

@maturin1919

It's called, irony.

@maturin1919
It's no fun, having to explain it.