Agnostic.com

8 2

Almost all the boys/men who were involved in the mass shootings in America’s schools were brought up without a father. Maybe we should be addressing that problem instead of going after the guns which will likely solve almost nothing. The desperate cry of America's boys
[foxnews.com]

Trajan61 8 Feb 18
Share

Enjoy being online again!

Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.

Create your free account

8 comments

Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.

0

Honestly Fox News, really? How is this even considered to be a creditable source? A brief search traces this story back to a right wing fake news site called Bull Elephant.com.
A further search finds that there is very little correlation for the factor between even school shooters. The highest correlation to be found is that they had a domineering mother or father in there lives, were socially awkward and likely abused.
Good effort to deflect the conversation away from gun control.

I supposed your one of those who thinks CNN and MSNBC are reliable sources. Fox News is the number one news channel in America!

@Trajan61 No I am not but, either of them is far more truthful. I am surprise that you can't see the story for what it is; an attempt to change the narrative from blaming lax gun laws to the more right wing christian palatable line of failure of the American family. It also surprise my that you cannot look up the source of a story or test the validity of that story by investigating the truth of the statements within. The fact that For News is the number one news channel in America is a real statement on the failure of the American education system.

Almost all the higher educated successful businessmen I know are strong Trump supporters so what are you talking about. Most of the Obama supporters I know are the ones looking for a government handout.

@Trajan61 You mean most self interest motivated greed individual obsessed with wealth, why would you think they wouldn't support the Orange Clown. You mean Obama supporters like Warren Buffet?

0

I'm not convinced lack of a father figure is the issue (and certainly not the only issue, or even the one most likely to be a main cause in this instance), more the lack of positive male role models in general - for boys who do have fathers and those who don't alike.

Jnei Level 8 Feb 20, 2018

It’s a disturbing fact that almost all the mass shooters were all brought up without a father.

0

Except that having a good father is no guarantee that there will be no mental illness, no unsavory influences from other sources. I've heard of a psychopathic child MURDERING their father.

In any case no one is going after "the guns", only certain guns, certain users, in certain contexts. I don't understand why there's such a need to see slippery slopes where they don't exist. Or to see guns as something more than what they are: something for target practice, hunting, and rarely, for self-defense. For those you can still have your . 357 Magnum and 30.06 and your shell re-loader.

As for the argument that guns are some sort of guarantee of freedom ... there are lots of stable democratic republics where even many of the police don't have guns, much less the public.

Lastly ... we already have mentoring / big brother types of programs, and anti-poverty and drug rehabilitation programs that have positive knock-on effects for responsible fathering.

0

Touchy subject. As a single mom of a male child, I'd say that yes a good father would be the best possible scenario. Simply because of like following like; A tree grows from trees, etc. Now lacking a "good father" figure, you're left with mom, foster home, streets, community. Community working with mom sounds best out of that batch.

Then there's the "perfect 1950s family" with a male and female raising one male child and one female child. But then there's usually hell behind the walls that the rest of us do not see. You don't know someone fully until you've lived with them.

Further we can discuss mental issues. Is a psychopath born or raised? or is it a combination thereof?

There are a lot of factors that go beyond simple "gun control" and way beyond "thoughts and prayers". I think this issue should be broken down to its basics to find a conclusion, but how do we get there when we can't agree on something so small as the definition of a family.

2

I thought about this a few years ago. The main reason I can see for this is a lack of a good male role model. I agree that women can be good role models too however the difference is that boys aspire to be men and girls aspire to be women. It's the same reason why boys like watching male super heroes and girls like watching female super heroes.

Good male role models become a target for boys to aspire to become. Now that we are slowly phasing out male teachers, any male role model that boys used to have in school is disappearing. They will still be needed in subjects like maths, physics, chemistry and engineering because there just aren't enough female teachers with those types of degrees. This will change soon.

Thanks to modern feminism wanting "equality" we are at the point where more women are graduating school, college, university, etc. Education is generally geared towards women and that's fine. The problem is the phasing out of men.

My school realized this was a problem and did something about it. They talked to the parents committee about how they could start turning boys into men and girls into women by selecting a role model of the same gender for them. Parents would ask their friends, relatives, etc if they would like to mentor their children for 3 years up until the final year of school. This way they would have someone to talk to about their problems and aspirations, someone to confide in. I think this was absolutely brilliant because in Australia it is quite common for parents to get divorced for multiple reasons. On the weekends, students would go out with their mentor to do activities. Gardening, cooking, sailing, shooting, cycling, flying, motorbike riding, camping, etc. Literally anything and everything that the mentor could do to have a good time with their student.

To this day, 5 years after I left that school, I still talk to my mentor and I'm planning on seeing him again in the holidays. He made me want to learn more and travel the world, he was extremely intelligent and also very kindhearted. He listened to everything I had to say and answered every question I had to ask. He shaped who I am today and I am grateful for that.

This is what people don't understand. If we took a logical engineering approach and looked at what some schools with such programs were doing, you could reduce the chances of a shooting immensely. Just provide role models. This is up to the parents and the schools. Do they want to try and prevent a shooting or just cry and scream when the inevitable occurs again.

Sure teachers don't get fantastic salaries but they need to realize, the system is broken and needs to be fixed to produce men, not psychopathic little boys. It's only fair that school helps to educate children both inside and outside of the classroom.

Great reply!

@Trajan61 Thanks. There are some things that my school did which were suspect and the new principal was dodgy as hell. But that program did me and many others a lot of good, especially for my friends who's parents were divorced.

0

Bring my husband back (from death), and we'll be fine, thanks.

Zster Level 8 Feb 19, 2018
0

"...Indeed, there is a direct correlation between boys who grow up with absent fathers and boys who drop out of school, who drink, who do drugs, who become delinquent and who wind up in prison.

And who kill their classmates."
(Bolding Mine)

As you know, correlation does not necessarily imply causation.

Does that mean that every boy who grows up without a father is capable of mass murder?

What about boys who grow up with shitty full-time fathers who smack them around every day?

What about boys who grew up in a happy two parent family? Those boys have testosterone too.

What is the proposed solution? Force fathers to be there full time? Put the kids in a home and hope for the best?

So far, the thing I've picked up from this story is that it dodges the obvious questions that are being asked now, and every time this nightmare happens.

Why is it possible for civilians to even buy military grade weapons?

Because it's their right under The Second Amendment?
Not according to the 4th US Circuit Court of Appeals.

[nbcnews.com]

How long are we going to let the corrupt so-called leaders in Washington ignore this problem and continue to offer "thoughts and prayers" rather than real solutions?

You and I will have to respectfully disagree on that one.

@Trajan61 Okay.

1

What are we going to do? A man cannot be made to spend time with someone they don't want to see and a woman cannot be forced to terminate just because a man doesn't want to be a father.

Write Comment
You can include a link to this post in your posts and comments by including the text q:26173
Agnostic does not evaluate or guarantee the accuracy of any content. Read full disclaimer.