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I am guilty of being an 'Atheist Troll'. So after getting half a dozen troll comments on a political discussion with an old HS classmate on FB about Founding Fathers and 'Our Christian Nation'. I decided to 'check the source' of the video in question, a right wing fundamentalist site. Wow, I went a little nuts attacking almost every comment, since they were all mostly bs rants about school prayer anyway. I'm getting a few "I'll pray for you's now' but mostly I think I must have pissed off about a thousand nutjobs. Was that wrong?

RobCampbell 7 Feb 23
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29 comments

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11

No, most folks live in a bubble, and social media actually makes that much worse. Now we grow our bubbles larger and can silence a dissenting voice with a click (your ignored)
The end result is a lot of people living in and listening to only people who think, feel, and believe just like they do.
It promotes tribalism and makes it easy for us all to forget our tribe is not the only tribe, and being a member of any tribe does not make that mean your better than any member of another tribe.
Just that your tribe has different notions of things.

For religious folks here in the States, this has become exacerbaited in recent years. They feel that since they can see and hear atcual Atheists, its an invasion and a threat. Living in a bubble with people who think they are under threat is a great way for them to convince themselves that people not like them in one particular facet, are in fact dangerous, when they are not, they just do not agree.

POPPING that Bubble is, I think, an imperitive.
I have a right to exist as much as the next person.
I have a right not to believe as much as anyone has a right to believe.
I am a minority.
IF I allow a majority to talk about me being a threat in private bubbles, they will dehumanize me until I am "other", and hence eaiser to exterminate. At every epoch in history where we see grim horrors like the holocaust, it is that de-humanization which is central. It is that very mental process which Law Enforcement seeks to break in criminals if they have kidnap vitims, as it increases sirvivability.

Therefore Minorities MUST speak out, MUST make themselves and their existence known, must humanize themselves to those bubbles which isolate themselves, both inside and outside social media. It is a survival imperitive.

@Davesnothere Well said, I hadn't thought of activism or even the base aspect of trolling in the terms you have laid out so succinctly. I think you may have just made me a little bit better at being an activist for atheism.

@Davesnothere Love that point mate. If it's good for them to preach and convert, it's good for us. It is hard to try and get someone who has been brought up in a religion or belief to try and change that and get them to see reason/facts. Then again some people who grow up like that see the hypocrisy or the many contradictions of their scriptures and decide to leave, sometimes at the cost of being shunned by there own family or community, however "loving" or "forgiving" their religion is. But your right we do need to speak out more for sure.

Science has come a long way in recent times and I feel that atheism is on the rise. I hope that one day everyone will see and believe the same, then we won't fight over which belief is right.

The sooner we can all see ourselves as equals - one race (human), one caste, one belief, the sooner we can all move forward and prosper.

7

I don't know, I consider it a good day's job well done.

6

Between trolling religion, flat earther's, pro trumper's and anti gun control nuts, it can be quite fun at first. But after a while it's like hitting your head against a brick wall. Some people just don't seem to have logic or reason. By the way prayers didn't help in the church shootings in US, they are definitely not going to help in schools and don't belong there.

5

Good job. Don't let them pass off bullshit without a challenge.

JimG Level 8 Feb 24, 2018

@JimG - Damn right, call em on the bullshit, especially since they rewrite history to suit some pretty warped superstitions and logic.

5

Lol, sounds like you had a good time. How is fun wrong?

@irascible And you are exceptionally good at it!

4

Those who like to tout the Framers as responsible for the establishment of a 'Christian Nation' would likely not have been comfortable with the philosophy of a number of Founding Fathers, such as Franklin, Jefferson, Washington, Madison and Paine, who leaned toward Desim, if not rejecting the traditional view of Christianity entirely. Many of the modern-day Christian fascists responsible for the 'Christian Nation' meme belong to what's known as Dominionism, who believe the United States must be 'restored' to its Christian (or Judeo-Christian, when they're feeling inclusive) roots, and they've succeeded in recruiting Ted Cruz as their champion. Few fit the nutjob description better than these! They conveniently forget that God was omitted from the Constitution, and while seeking to restore prayer to the public schools, they aspire to ignore, if not excise, Article 11 from the Treaty of Tripoli. In light of these views, excluding by the targets of your censure, how could you be judged as wrong?

uh huh! They really tend to go into a total hissy fit when you attempt to give them facts on their scientific ideology over their religious views. And by god, don't dare bring up their experiences with unexplained occurrences we know of today as UFO's. You really get put on the troll list there!

@pnullifidian the Freedom From Religion Foundation in the US is doing a great job at trying to separate church from state matters i.e. prayers ten commandments statues removed from schools. Unfortunately as an outsider looking in it looks like christian values are trying to be established and having christian fundamentalists in high positions within the GOP does not look promising for the US.

4

Sounds perfectly ok to me.

3

Not wrong, and it might change some things... or not. It's hard to say with this type of thinking. If these people could be reasoned with, they wouldn't believe that silliness in the first place. Still, we do have to start calling lies out when we see them. For far too long we've allowed people to hold their beliefs "sacred" just because they have them. But it really is at a point where we've got to let them know that we know they're lying.

I've always like the Jon Stewart approach. He was funny, gently mocked them, and ultimately brought them to the place where they ended up making his point... even while trying to defend their own. But his brilliance also comes from an insane amount of practice.

3

You guys crack me up!! Thanks for the supportive comments!!

3

Absolutely go for it , nut jobs need a little cracking ....I love it

@dogsareus56 Hey welcome to the community! And thanks for the comment hehe...

3

You're sick like me. 😉

3

Lol! I've done the same thing. Somebody I walked down a hallway with 45yrs ago holds no sway with me and my present reality. And when the 'I'll pray for you' nonsense starts showing up I simply reply that they should stick their prayers up their fecking asses because I can't use them. At the end of the day, that's -YOUR- gawd you're so scared of. -YOU- go to hell.

2

The claim our nation was built on christianity was a propaganda movement started in the late 40's to early 50's. It was an effort put forth with the help of the church. I once had a better article on the birth of this disgrace to our country, but it's locked up in a lap top that went bad on me in which I can't find now. But here's another one fairly close to it.

[alternet.org]

It was a battle against Communism, or so they claim. Put god on our paper money and in the pledge of allegiance. I’m not sure what that has to do with anything in a real fight against Communism, but there ya go.

@Vickylyn the cry of communism is a tool to scare the masses. It works. If you had read the article it was clearly stated it was a war against FDR's policies that were working. The term communism was a tool to use on their followers to draw them in out of fear.

Exactly my point! @William_Mary

2

It's ok we all get there at one point or in some way. Doesn't make us a bad person it just makes us human. Now you learned from your mistake and you can grow as a person... Or go back trolling whichever works bro.

2

I feel your pain.
The problem is human gullibility and the greed that exploits it.
The website you visited is probably a business, emitting propaganda and selling the attention of the gullible for advertising dollars. Attention (good or bad) makes them money. When you engage them like you did, you're just supporting somebody's horrible business model. They are con artists.
It's a whole unsavory operation, like high-pressure call-center telemarking.
That's the greed end of it.

Their marks are people like your old HS classmate (who sounds exactly like a particular old HS classmate of mine). People who have underdeveloped critical thinking skills. People who haven't learned to approach problems with a useful balance of reason and compassion. Which can be anybody. If you think you're never gullible, then I know at least one of your one intellectual blind spots. By "intellectual blind spot", I mean a topic where someone will accept new information without asking "is that really true". Everyone has them. You can fool all of the people some of the time. The greedy just want to know what to say to make the marks let their guard down.

That's the gullibility end of it.

Bad attention helps propagandists because it makes the gullible double down on the narrative. The gullible aren't trying to be right. What they actually seek is validation from their tribe (just like, right here right now I'm actually seeking validation from this tribe). So when you try to bring a reasonable conversation to the party, some jerk just turns the bad music up louder. And they all bob their heads in unison.

It's a "thought virus". The propagandists want to target a specific demographic. They profile FB users based on what they post, repost and comment. (FB has lots of handy tools to help advertisers do that). From the profiles they figure out where their intellectual blind spots are.
Memes that talk about "low controversy" topics like animal abuse are basically loss-leaders to get the known marks to convince other gullibles in their social network to self-identify. Any user who likes/reposts an angry meme about a cat mutilation four years ago (I call it 'indignation porn ' ) is a candidate for deeper profiling, and later maybe to pass on a meme expressing The Big Lie. They even analyze the mark's social network to gauge their level of influence on others, in search of the alpha influencers. Once you're caught in the net, you become a deputy fisher. Like a muli-level marketing scheme.

The world is full of deception. The greedy will always try to exploit the gullible. Our only hope is to encourage the people in our lives to be skeptical about the credibility of information coming in, where it's coming from, and what the source's agenda might be.

Critical reasoning is the only inoculation against thought viruses.

@JimBen Point taken!

2

As long as you were telling the truth, and enjoyed yourself, it's not wrong.

1

Not wrong in my book. Keep up the good work! I have noticed that throwing facts into an irrational discussion bothers quite a few people.

1

I'm all for attacking peoples ideas, especially when it's stated as a fact as opposed to a belief. Trolling is different in my opinion, it's gaining psychological enjoyment from the pain or humiliation of others, and I don't support that. I'm admittedly a hypocrite because I have been guilty of it myself, but I own that, and I'm doing my best not to be that because, in the end, it's more damaging to me than it is to the person I'm attacking.

1

Not at all. The thousand nut jobs are wrong though.

1

Not at all
Playing Don Quixote can be fun
You can speak the truth, but you can’t change a true believer
So level your lance and tally ho ... CHARGE!!!

1

Good for you.

1

I don't think it was wrong, just a waste of your time. It's fun alright, but have you really accomplished anything?

Ok, you did. Trolling is a way of showing the younger generation how stupid these folks are, but does it work in only one direction? I mean, there are lots of religious dumbasses thinking they're trolling atheism too... is there any way to tell who is more efficient at it? I honestly don't know.

@hlfsousa I would have agreed with you before reading Davesnothere's comment, but even pissing off a bunch of 'believing nutjobs' is in all actuallity an accomplishment of sorts. I prefer to try unemotional, scientific, logic and reasoning, but sometimes you just gotta get it out of ya I guess (referring to myself). As to the second question 'who is more effecient' well I think that would be our team, hands down.

@RobCampbell It took me way longer than it should to write my original comment because I really have no position on whether trolling is a good thing or not. I think @Davesnothere is on spot too, and how to pop that filter bubble has been in my head day and night for at least a year. We must speak up and make ourselves known (whatever "we" are) but my questioning is more in the direction of how we should do that in order to get the best results.

I was talking to an acquaintance a couple of weeks ago and she came up with an analogy that I really liked: the system of passing on beliefs is like a production line; she thought that we will get better results by making changes to the start of the line, that is, by engaging young people. But the people working in the production line are the "old" folks, so we have to get past them. So if we are able to reach out to older adults (40+), change would be faster as a whole, but that is freaking hard. Or we just troll them, expect the younger generations to be better educated and wait for the loonies to die out.

Or we can just have a good laugh and forget about it, which I intend to do tomorrow at some pub.

@hlfsousa It all depends on circumstance, on the web or in life. I prefer SE if I have time and it is a small group or one on one.
IF it is a street preacher spouting fear and hate, I prefer to confront using the Bible until they are flabberghasted with me, and their "love shows".
In the one I am trying to actually make somone think, in the other I am also speaking to the audiance, not the street preacher. I am altering the preformance to show folks there is nothing to fear but fear itself.

@Davesnothere I totally agree, but once someone sees you trolling, SE becomes that much more difficult with that person. In a way, they don't seem complementary. Is that your experience, or how do you avoid It?

1

Was it wrong? If you weren't several thousand miles away, I'd shake your hand.

1

That sounds like a good time to me.

1

If it made you feel better, then it's all good, 😀

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