I just watched Soylent Green on TV last night. I'm a lot more disturbed by it now then I was when I first watched it in the '70s. It's about overpopulation and how humans are nothing more than a cancer growing on the skin of the Earth. The environment was destroyed with the oceans so toxic not even plankton could grow.
When it happens -- not if -- insane religious belief will be the major cause. How the heck can a Good Book tell people "be fruitful and multiply" and make all the babies they can? Islam teaches that Allah blesses you for every baby you bring into the world. The world population when I first saw the movie was around 4 billion. Now, as I write this, the population approaches 8 billion.
If you never saw the movie try watching it to get a glimpse of what awaits us if ignorant religious fanatics continue to control the world's governments.
I personally think that the biggest contributor to the destruction of this planet and it's environment is unregulated capitalism and the greed it produces.
The actual movie did kind of point that out in a roundabout way. And I agree.
@OldMetalHead Finally! A voice of reason in this insane thread. Soylent Green is a (good) movie. But it's just a movie. Heston made a bunch of'em back then. Omega Man is another dystopian sci-fi flick I really enjoyed. The repeated commentary in this thread calling Human beings a cancer is far more dehumanizing than anything. One commenter said we should have a global population of 2B tops. Seriously? Humans are conscious beings. We have beaten the odds and used our rational, creative minds to improve our lives. Virtually all of that improvement is due to Capitalism by the way, regulated or not. Capitalism is what raises the standard of living of everyone. It provides you with everything you want or need. Nothing disgusts me more than people who bitch and moan about the evils of Capitalism from their smartphones while eating a $2 hamburger living in a home filled with an array of technology and convenience, all provided by Capitalism. With that said, I completely agree with you that crony capitalism is the real issue. It is grossly misunderstood, if people are aware of it at all.
@IAMGROOT What about the destructive effects of Capitalism on the environment. Do fish-factory boats sailing into the Gulf of Mexico improve things? To my mind this is capitalism gone berserk.
@Unpretentious LOL! No, not much of a burger (I was thinking fast food). My point was inexpensive food is the result of Capitalism.
@Aristippus Nobody ever said Capitalism was perfect, but it is not the evil thing it is made out to be. And there is no better "system" for creating opportunity for wealth and benefiting others at the same time.
I think humans are the virus. Carona is the earth using its immune system.
Interesting thought. We also might have started the virus by the ways we slaughter animals and it is all for profit. It is horrific.
@DenoPenno Check out Terence's video. We need a new operating system.
@Aristippus
"Well, it's dumb".. love me some McKenna.
Comforting to know that us Boomers will likely experience the sweet embrace of death before Soylent Green becomes a documentary, tho we are well on our way there already..
Who knows maybe God send us Covid to take care of the problem, being sarcastic here.
Actually, we are a virus. The earth will kill us one way or another. Just a matter of time. Unless we become humans 2.0 as discussed in the book Homo Deus.
Yep, once every century or so, the earth does a purge. COVID is the present purge. Humans have not been kind to the earth, so the earth tried to get rid of some of us. If only the idiots could be purged, that would be good. But purges kill the smart as well as the stupid.
Homo Dues is a good book, indeed!
So is his "Sapiens."
@SKH78 The purge I am referring to will be the permanent one. It could be a pandemic like we've never seen, a biological agent produced by a terrorist, a nuclear was, whatever. Species like ours do not stick around forever, especially if they are destroying the host.
@BirdMan1 I prefer Homo vacuous
@Mitch07102 Keep an eye on global warming, and methane released from formerly frozen tundra.
@BirdMan1 Yep. And the long-dormant pathogens this may release in addition to the climate effects.
The shit is gong to hit the fan, and it is far to late to do a thing about it . . . . our starship is doomed, humans are doomed, but it is nothing out of the ordinary for mother nature, who has seen many a species die out, go extinct . . . . for mother nature, it is even boring to think about, and compassion is just part of the foolishness of the human mind.
Extinction has occurred five times in the history of the planet. But thought has only evolved once and it took four billion years. George Carlen said the same thing as you. But it's a different ballgame now.
Viruses and natural disasters are going to take care of what humans can't. Population control. Nature has periods in which the attempt is made but goes too far, of course. Those are called extinction events. I think we are upon one but maybe evolution has learned how to control itself? You know, find a middle.
The movie lists the date as 2022 (As I recall; I re-watched it recently.). So maybe it was one or two decades ahead. The movie suggested that the ecosystem had collapsed, and we do seem to be on our way. We would need a pandemic with >99% fatality to survive our own lust and consumption, so the scenario may well be realistic in its ugliness. More likely, desperation will precipitate some version of WWIII. Notably, they used bulldozers instead of tear gas. Those scenes are all too familiar right now!
The Earth will go on, and recover after we're gone. It'll take a while like it did with the dinosaurs. Maybe the next intelligent species will take the hint from what we leave behind? Or not. Like "Contact", the salient question to ask the aliens is "How did you do it? How did you survive your technological adolescence?"
Ideally, we'd see something like what "Children of Men" depicts, where we all go sterile.
Thanks for such a well-written and intelligent response to my post. Here's a very apt and pertinent video you might like that deals with this issue. In younger days I was so impressed by Terence McKenna that I dedicated my book to him and even made him a character in the story.
My main character Cynthia does psilocybin and enters a more privative state of mind.
@Aristippus I have those tools on hand, but life changes have been too troubling to indulge. It was fun to see the shaman with the Ayahuasca stalk. I got a 12" cutting about 16 years ago. It grew up into a dying apricot tree, and when the tree finally died, the vine had a ready made trellis. Two years ago, the trunk finally toppled, so I designed a tensile structure prototype for the vine to grow up into again. I'm training the tendrils now, but have put a sail over the structure for shade. You can see the Ayahuasca in the center left of the attached picture.
"I'll have to disagree with you on this. Human overpopulation has already caused the sixth major extinction in the history of the world -- the first in 65 million years. Half the vertebrates alive when I was born during WWII are now extinct. Fragmentation of habitat is cited as the major cause."
Environmental imperatives aren't served by ridiculous claims that "Half the vertebrates alive when I was born during WWII are now extinct" as you will be unable to corroborate your contention. Your "Fragmentation of habitat is cited as the major cause" doesn't gel with your "insane religious belief will be the major cause" of the destruction of the environment so have you decided to ditch the "insane religious belief" hyperbole?
I saw that film years ago and today I view it the same way you do.
Thanks.
You are dead - on right. have you seen koyaanisquatsi?
No, but how about some info on this.
Should be TWO billion, tops.
Two billion?
Around there. The guideline should be, how much human life can the Earth support without being depleted and used up?
I'd guess around a billion.
Take Haiti. It's the western third of the island of Columbus' Hispaniola. Today the population is around ten million, but the fish and arable land can only support one million. That means Haitians have to rely on foreign aid by being beggars.
Saw it, gloom prediction
We need a change of consciousness.
The value of human life was well illustrated by the street cleaning "crews" near the beginning. But I think that thought-provoking movies like this have lost some of their impact with the impact of big-budget apocalyptic movies since. A few soldiers vs a Death Star doesn't really compare well!! Another one you might like is "No Blade of Grass": not a great movie technically, but thematically worth the view.
I need to see this movie.
For some reason population control has been a taboo subject for the movies. Only one or two others, yet it remains an extremely important subject. The future of the world is at stake.
I watched it last night too. Scary thing to think that this may become a reality one day.
To tell the truth I'm glad I'm in the 70s. I feel sorry for today's children and teenagers. Maybe that's why they're so neurotic and escapist.
At my age the idea of technological cannibalism does not phase me. I doubt the religious/political order of things will ever allow peace in my life time. I'm sure they (religious fanatics) will find some justification of it somewhere in there fables in the same way they find justification in killing masses in war.
Im not as worried about overpopulation as I am about inefficient use and waste of resources and careless destruction of the environment. If we instead focused on efficiency, close the loopbrecycling, and took care of our environment, then, with a bit of innovation overpopulation would not even be an issue.
The destruction of the environment is the main result of overpopulation ,so how can you not be worried about it .
@HarrySlick not being prepared is the issue here. I firmly believe scince and engineering can more than just solve the problems, but actually make the environment better.
If we don't invest and follow the science to understand our effects on the enviroment and implement corrective measures then thats not an overpopulation issue! Thats a following-through issue. It would be incorrect to blame overpopulation as that cause of the problem.
We have the solutions or should be developing them but we sure aren't implementing them: nuclear power; carbon extraction; synthetic meats; universal healthcare, housing, and basic needs; colonizing space; colonizing the oceans or the air, free education, telecommuting work, delivery, hydoponic vertical farmingn We see tiny pockets of these technologies but have almost negligible dollars investing these.
Let take carbon emissions for example, I feel its the height of stupidy to expect 8 billion people and a handful of selfinterested corporations and governments to change. They too busy surviving to pay attention to reducing the carbon footprint. Aint gonna happen. Assume they will do the worst now plan to mitigate the effects through carbon extraction. And lo, NASA finally puts out a $2 miillion carbon extration prize to get attention to this type of solution, one that requires no fundamental change in behavior. 10 years late and a pitiful prize amount but progress, I guess.
Only science and technology will solve environmental issues. Social, corporate and governmental change will never be enough, and relying on it will be an assured disaster. Only Science can save us.
I think I disagree here. To maintain your position you should at least state the point where birth control has to kick in. Surely population growth can't do on forever. Catholic sages suggest the total should reach 50 billion. Doesn't anybody ever ask, "What For?" I guess they figure the more clasped hand praying to God the more pleased He is.
@Aristippus im not sure how birth control fits it. I'm just talking about the conceptal problems of overpopulation is really a problem of proper use and protection resources and technology.
Birth control is part of that trchnology sure, and one can say it reduces the population some. However at the same time one should also admit advanced pediatrics and medicine and psyhciatry saves a lot of lives of those who likely would have died without passing their genes, thus significantly raising the population.
Consider making living in space as easy as living on earth. Consider making entering earths orbit safe and easy. Now space is quite big. Remember all of the material of the people of the Earth came from only its surface. The entire surface material of earth not fill space completely. So I feel space colonization is the solution for over population.
And life on Earth will be allowed to return to its old random self.
It's a bit of a stretch mark to pin the diaper on the conception that " ... insane religious belief will be the major cause."
I'll have to disagree with you on this. Human overpopulation has already caused the sixth major extinction in the history of the world -- the first in 65 million years. Half the vertebrates alive when I was born during WWII are now extinct. Fragmentation of habitat is cited as the major cause.
Overpopulation?. whatchu mean overpopulation?
& Soylent Green may as well've been written and directed by John of Patmos.
@nyrdybyrd I wrote a short story about this guy once. How would you like to go through like with the name John the Divine? The leather apron wearing slave master on the island said, "Why do I get all the nuts?"