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Person vs deeds

How far should we divorce the artist or any other endeavor from the man or woman behind it? Is it sometimes a question time before the misdeeds seem irrelevant compared to their achievements. Is it okay to enjoy Wagner but not Kevin Spacey? Can we forgive Gauguin for running out on his wife and children because of his art.? How about Mrs Martin Luther KIng jr`s habit of walking into doors? So many great things have been done by absolute shits or worse. Where do we draw the line? How much licence do we give an artist?
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273kelvin 8 May 3
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I enjoy Woody Allen...still, but it does feel a little dirty knowing that his kids hate his guts and wondering what the reasons are behind that.
I've always loved Kevin Spacey and was sad to find out what an abject creep he really is.

Some certainly deserved to lose their careers.

Is there a kind of pc snobbery about this? I don`t mean Spacey or Allen but there was a UK footballer did 3 months for sexual assault. She was drunk, came up to his hotel room and had a threesome. Now (last I heard) he was appealing his conviction (I was drunk too) but no club would hire him. Then we have Boy George, did time for chaining a rent boy to a radiator for days. Welcomed back into the BBC and all is forgiven

@273kelvin not sure about PC snobbery. I do think there are heinous enough acts that those proven guilty DESERVE to lose their careers. See Michael Vick & his dog fighting history. He should be panhandling somewhere in the middle of death valley, not making $$$$.

@273kelvin Wasn't Gary Glitter a pedophile? Yes I think these people deserve to lose everything.

@Qualia I am not defending anyone here but what about all thise under age groupies in the 60s and 70s yet bands like the Stones get to do half-time at the superbowl

@Qualia Even if the crime is not that heinous, I hear Lance Armstrong is commentating on Sky sports

@273kelvin Point taken.... sigh

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I'm a forgiving person usually. It really depends on the artist and the deed done.

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Its not just an artiste is it? they are just the ones in the public eye and probably just as representative of the population at large- My husband got tired and left me and his two children when they were 3 and 4 years old to go to Germany to work with 'the lads' I think we give the same licence to everyone. No one likes a cheat whether they are famous or not but doesnt stop them being a good singer actor whatever .

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Some excellent responses here but what of Wagner? Where his anti-semitism is an integral part of his art? I am no opera fan so I would not cry any big salty tears if I never heard him again but for many years his work was banned in Israel.

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Fascinating topic, with all the previously admired artists that have publicly fallen lately. Louis CK and Al Franken disappointed me the most. I think everyone has to separate the art from the individual to some extent, but finding where to draw the line is tricky and very personal to all of us. I know people who have been the victim of being drugged and molested personally who still found an occasion to enjoy the Cosby show since all this came out. Who am I to point out the obvious? She knows he’s personally abhorrent but that doesn’t mean everything he was ever apart of is suddenly valueless. It’s his reputation as a human alone that’s been devalued.

The uncomfortable truth is that geniuses are often terrible people. Terrible people sometimes do great things and great people conversely do terrible things. If you can compartmentalize and enjoy the art without supporting the unsavory actions of its creator, go for it unapologetically. If you can’t, then discard the art and look for great things created by better people. The only notable difference is going to be that you haven’t found out about the disagreeable parts of that artists life yet, but whatever gets you through the night. If we have to approve of the personal life of every artist before enjoying their work, or the politics of every company to consume their goods, we’re gonna have a mighty short/lame list of options left. I didn’t personally like Cosby enough that I’ll be able to keep watching him despite what he did, but there are others I’ll make exceptions for I’m sure, and no one should be judged on what they can or can’t get past. Art is it’s own entity though. The artist matters up to a point but sometimes an idea is just so powerful that we can’t judge it based on whose head it chose to come into the world through.

I'm not convinced Franken wasn't a casualty of opportunity by those who were looking for any reason to knock off his halo, on both sides. He set the bar for public service REALLY high, actually EARNED his paycheck.

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I think that a work of art ought to be judged on it own merits. separate from the faults or the merits of the artist who created it.

At the same time I also think that we ought not to support those who have transgressed against others such as many of those the #metoo have uncovered.

I loved Chinatown, but I have no liking for Roman Polanski and his ilk. Perhaps you are right about time. Wait until these people are dead before enjoying their work...it is a difficult question.

cava Level 7 May 3, 2018
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Each individual will decide that for themselves. I can appreciate the art or the result of someone's work without any admiration for the person.

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The law doesn’t punish the person. The law punishes the act. Once the punishment phase is finished, whatever remains is opinion and gossip. In a free society everyone is entitled to their opinion, both us and the people who don’t agree with us. As a result, if someone is revolted or sublimated into unsurpassable joy by Gaugin or whoever, that’s their right. It’s OUR right.

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