I have another discussion topic Id like to propose. I feel like this is something many people do not consider. We all are aware that traditional american values dictate that we should have freedom of religion. you should be free to believe whatever you like and hold any opinion you like. Freedom of speech i think ties into this intrinsically. Now before you call me a communist... just wait.... haha. lets analyze that thought process. Our thoughts and opinions are our own and we expect that we have the inherent human right to believe whatever we choose. But that is also an old traditional view generally speaking. As we have seen in recent history that people largely behave according to what they believe. and sometimes these beliefs become perverted and bastardized in many cases as we see with many extremists from many different religious backgrounds. and this is not even a new thing really when you consider that more wars and death in this world can be attributed to religious belief than anything else. I think we have to at some point ask ourselves a very uncomfortable question. that question is, Are all beliefs truly equal? To give a hypothetical example that I have found difficult to refute, If I were to point a gun directly at you and I hold the value and belief that you should die, Should that belief be considered acceptable or equal? This makes the traditional values that america was founded on seem sort of hypocritical especially when you look at all the global conflict going on today. Clearly most people are not a fan of extremist groups like ISIS, yet we are expected to have respect for all people beliefs equally. So it is slightly self-defeating. a paradox of sorts. We say we should have "freedom of belief" yet we go to war with people that hold a different belief than us because it could bring us harm. and I think personally that is the line that needs to be drawn in the sand. My opinion is that you should be free to believe anything you like as long as it does not bring harm to others. But this is not the traditional ideology most people preach. So what does everyone think? Should we still adhere to the outdated traditional ways of thinking or recognize the fact that all beliefs simply can not be equal because they have real effects in the physical world?
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Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.I think the first amendment gives us the right to believe whatever we want. It doesn't say that we have to respect other people's beliefs. Respecting other people and respecting their beliefs are two completely different things. Bill Maher had a confrontation on his show between Sam Harris and Ben Affleck where Affleck pretty much said that we need to respect Islam and Harris said that he could respect Muslims without respecting their religion. I believe we can respect Christians and still be vocal in our disrespect for their beliefs.
If a belief does bring harm to others there are laws that protect us from it. If no law exists then we have to advocate getting one passed. Right now this administration is doing everything to overturn the separation of church and state. That would harm everybody and I will do whatever I can to try to get us back on course. I believe the foundation the founders laid is not really outdated but a lot of people seem hell-bent trying to destroy it. Government has reached a crossroads and thinking people need to steer it back on course. What we have isn’t bad but it can always stand improvement. It’ll need a whole lot in the next few years.
gearl
Level 8
Dec 10, 2017
0
@SilverDollarJedi I agree that education is the answer but how is that brought about? We have an education secretary that promotes home-schooling and for all practical purposes would destroy the public school system. How can you otherwise control what people think? How can we get a secular schools system back. What is your solution?
Beliefs are equal only under the law. And since I cannot read your mind it would be ridiculous to try to legislate belief. But action can be legislated. Clearly all action is not equal under the law. --- You will think and believe what you will. The law is not allowed to hinder you from expressing and discussing those thoughts and beliefs. But when your actions violate the rights of others the law is meant to stop you. I see no contradiction there.
TommyMeador
Level 7
Dec 10, 2017
0
You finally made a good point in your last two sentences. I think the key is in the education systems. Not in force or legislation. You are free to believe and think what you will. But your freedom of action is limited by law, including the act of speech. It is not legal to convince another to commit a crime. I am free to believe that someone should die, but the law is structured so as to dissuade me from acting on that belief. Freedom is messy. But it's the best idea we have.
People preach all kinds of craycray, but that’s protected by the law... which, by the way, pretty much agrees with your statement that... “you should be free to believe anything you like as long as it does not bring harm to others.”
skado
Level 9
Dec 10, 2017
3
It is indeed a troubling thought. I don't know the answer to the world's larger problems, other than to try to learn the most uncontaminated truth about them I can. And that's a never-ending project, so I try to pace myself, and focus mostly on improving what little I do have some control over. One of those things is how I let bad news effect my daily mood or focus. It isn't deflected by force of will though. It just takes practice. Deliberate, regular practice. (not obsessive, just deliberate)
I try to educate myself, stay healthy, stay politically engaged, build strong relationships with people, and create something that's useful to my fellow humans. There's always the chance the world won't fly apart at the seams. But if it does, I'll not be caught flat-footed.
I don't think there's any precedent in our legal system for controlling how people think. That's supposed to be worked out politically.
I support freedom of belief and freedom of speech fully, until the speech is an imminent threat to the safety of others (e.g., inciting riot). I think as soon as there's legal or even social censorship otherwise, it drives the more extreme views underground where they grow and fester until they erupt and take action. There is, I think, effectiveness in peer pressure, but only when there's a free exchange of ideas. I figure military action should never be pre-emptive, never trying to destroy an ideology through force, as that exacerbates radicalization, and we should focus our military efforts on direct defense.
resserts
Level 8
Dec 10, 2017
2
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