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The Spectacular Failure of the Zionist Project

The two-state solution is no longer possible and the only way forward is the struggle for a democratic secular state accommodating both Palestinians and Israelis, writes Stefan Moore.

As a secular Jew raised in a fiercely anti-Zionist family, I grew up viewing the State of Israel as an unfortunate fait accompli and accepting that the two-state solution was probably the best that could be hoped for.

Since then, I have come to the conclusion that the creation of a Jewish state was a catastrophic mistake and that Zionist Israel has relinquished its right to exist.

What good could possibly have come from a project that handed a group of Jewish Europeans a land that for countless centuries was inhabited by Arab Palestinians?

Not only did Palestinians have no say in the creation of a Jewish state on their homeland, but just at the time when other developing countries around the world were finally breaking free from the yoke of colonial rule Palestinians, like Native Americans and Australia’s First Nations people before them, became the victims of European settler colonialism — this time endorsed by a U.N. resolution that neither the Palestinians nor any of the Arab states agreed to or voted for.

[consortiumnews.com]

Countless centuries of relatively peaceful times of Palestinians and Jewish living side by side towards the more modern era into the 1800s. There of course have been many migrations, deportations, and interventions throughout the centuries of dominant control to influence the region. But then came the 20th century as the industrial era was kicking in, and world travel becoming more easy. At some point all the religious strife taught in the Bible and past confrontations had been washed away by common sense and neighborly love. That part god only spoke about while he pitted two societies against one another. These people's would eventually find a sense of comradery.

I remember reading in the 90's as fencing was beginning to be erected of stories of these two people's still proclaiming admiration for their neighbors they would lose. Despite the horrific nature of what had already been happening for decades before as the British lead the way for Zionism to become the now dominant factor. Back then significant numbers of each population were still at odds with the direction the region obviously was going to be dominated by. Is it shame or criminal for what technology has brought onto humanity? Mankind has become like two children fighting over who gets to play with that toy. Toys turned into resources for technological products. Innovation to build and use these technologies have turned into means it's being used against us. The children have taken over the household with more powerful toys than the parents can have. The parents with common sense and love for the world society are locked away and silenced, unable to reach the majority of us to have a real sense of democracy.

{“I think the self-image of Israel as a moral society is something I haven’t seen anywhere else in the world. We are the ‘Chosen People’ (in the Old Testament Jews were chosen by God as his special people). This is part of the Israeli self-identification…(But) basically, the project of Zionism has a problem… You cannot create a safe haven by creating a catastrophe for other people.”}

Congress says you're a bad Jew if you're not a Zionist. How antisemitic is that? Jill Stein. A Jew.

{“The mantra of the ‘two-state solution’ has become an open joke in the corridors of the U.N., both for its utter impossibility in fact, and for its total failure to account for the inalienable human rights of the Palestinian people.”}

A stretch of land approximately 25 miles long and 5 miles wide, give or take in certain areas. Over the past months since Oct, basically the entire area has been turned to rubble. Any remaining structures for the most part are unstable. It's basically unsustainable to support life now in much of it. Water is for the most part undrinkable, dangerous to do so, many remaining have no choice, food is profoundly scarce. People are rotting in the rubble, babies left to decompose in hospitals. People pushed out then bombed when arrived.

{In any event, it is time to acknowledge that the Zionist project has been a spectacular failure and the status quo can no longer be maintained. Israel has become a pariah state in the eyes of most of the world and the winds of change are now howling across the region.}

When Zionism began to considered in the late 19th century in Palestine, the proclaimed father of Zionism, Theodor Herzl's statement was to return to the fatherland and do so as representatives of the western civilization. Along with the western capitalism, the world will be profoundly better when they both finally collapse.

William_Mary 8 Jan 14
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what it all comes down to is $$$$. they're already selling beachfront gaza property & there is natural gas offshore.

1

The analogy of israel to mosquitos or cockroaches in the home has just been made regarding israeli occupation in the middle east. As with the infection in the home there is only one solution.

FrayedBear Level 9 Jan 15, 2024

Cohabitation is always a solution. Just don't let the roaches. mozzies overrun the place 😉
This can be done by not allowing them anywhere near government. What the renaissance was all about and under secular governance (no religious dogma) civilization boomed.
There should be no support for theist states, that's the problem. Especially those that seek expansion.

@puff So you would happily increase your chances of malaria, Ross River fever, dengue fever to name but a few mosquito bourne illnesses & on the other salmonella, staphylococcus and streptococcus. The cockroach can also harbour viruses such as the polio virus. There is no option of happy cohabitation.

@FrayedBear and yet we have for eons.

@puff where & who?
You & the ex? 😁😉

@FrayedBear Humans and vermin. At uni learnt that we would never rid Australia of rabbits/ cane toads etc. All we can do is control their numbers to manageable levels.
Is Israel capable of cohabitation with Palestinians? Christians? Muslims? Atheists? Or do they seek a kibbutz country only for Jews? It seems they are the ones seeking a "final solution" to Palestinians to me, more so than Arab states against Israel.
Theist government is the problem, remove Zionists from power. Don't think Arabs/ Persians/ Turks/ Africans etc want to exterminate Jews, they just wish to excise the cancer of Zionism. They will have my support.

@puff "they just wish to excise the cancer of Zionism" - that is no different to the common aspiration world wide in 1939 apart from Germany, Italy, & Spain. The USA sat on the fence playing the situation for its economic benefit.

@FrayedBear I mean Zionism as in those who adhere to having a Jewish state or "Land of Israel" to the exclusion of all others.........because their god said so.

@puff from memory a larger number of Jews do not believe their god made any such instruction. That's why more live outside the middle east than in Israel.

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Just got home from Tasmania, an option considered for a Jewish homeland for Zionists before settling on Palestine.
Israel is the last colony attempting the last genocide of the indigenous population. The final chapter of white supremacy. Zionists are just the latest sociopaths in a long line of European colonial sociopaths, hiding behind religious zealotry (nothing new there) so as to seize land as their own, displacing those who happen to reside there. They are occupiers of stolen land. Their only supporters are others who occupy land..............................and Narau.
You have a right to resist occupation
As an occupier, you cannot claim self defense from resistance to being occupied by you. May make you feel better claiming self defense, but not based in any legal or moral reality.
I'm surprised that any here support a theist state aka the Jewish state aka Israel. Do they feel the same about the Vatican? Iran?
Zionists have played the victim card very successfully from the world's guilt over the Holocaust. Those days are now over because of the Gaza slaughter, comparable to what Nazi's did to the Warsaw Ghetto. I also tend to lean towards Israel as a state not surviving this.

Still "Trump Trump Trump" is the devil incarnate in the states.
Meanwhile Biden leaves $800 mil worth of kit to the Taliban after fighting them for 20 years in Afghanistan, ferments' Ukraine into another slaughter by scuttling a negotiated peace only months into the war, blows up Nord Stream and enables genocide.......................................yet Trump is the dangerous one to "democracy!!!"

The US of A may well go down the same path as Israel if it continues under Biden. I wish the people well, but won't miss either ideologically driven state governance they are now after they fall.

puff Level 8 Jan 15, 2024

Well said.

Trump essentially collaborated in supporting and funding Ukraine's genocide campaign for 4 years when few people were taking notice of it. Continued the same foreign policies with Israel for 4 years while atrocities continued in Gaza. Trump partners himself with the very type of nationalist and fascist here in the US for their support and funding that we see in both of those arenas. He's just another finger on the fascist hand around the throat's of innocent world citizens. To attempt to make him out as a lesser evil is in itself a disturbing analysis! He's simply another member of the system betraying society with deceptive narratives and context! The evidence is not only in his history, but also within his betrayal of those who foolishly supported and funded him. The fact that many still do is simply an example of how easy many can be foolishly drawn into supporting and funding the rest of the failed 2 party system in which he operates from. A system that still benefitted from his presidency and has allowed him to continue to advance his part of the unethical ideology they all serve, despite knowing its uncivilized inhumanity.

@William_Mary Trump is not president, Biden is (figure heading anyway). His presidency will be remembered as one of chaos by historians. Trump is hated so much by the status quo it is fun to watch them lose their shit over him. But history will judge Biden as worse I predict. A re-run of 2020 is a bit sad eg is the US so bereft of political talent this is the best option? Trump Vs Biden again? I know Trump loves Israel but would he tolerate this genocide? No more than Biden is if he did. It's a fascist system entrenched in the US now but that system hates Trump, hate so much that I hope he wins just to piss them off, shake them out of arrogant hubris..

I love irony and would love to see this happen to Israel. If they insist in claiming Gaza, creating the Zionist wet dream "Land of Israel", then Hezbollah will eventually engage. By all accounts Hezbollah will take and hold Northern Israel if this occurs; the Galilee. So if this happens, tell the Zionists "Fine, you can have Gaza. We will resettle those Palestinian refugees into Northern Israel, now part of Lebanon. A big FU Zionists!!!" That outcome would be deliciously ironic.

@puff I learned from previous discussions with you that you're an artist at twisting narratives and rewriting and or erasing history to fit a delusional reality. The one you created above voids any factual history left behind in regards to Trump leading to multiple chaotic conjectures. It voids the foundations of the history that has already happened and in a case or two is a repeat of the obvious which exposes the insanities of present issues we've faced for decades. Both in the US and other western societies.

It's a mirroring example of when our 2 party supporters in the US commit the social crimes of recognizing the unethical practices and crimes of the party they oppose but will ignore when their own party commits or is collaborate in the same crimes and unethical practices. Including any politician and especially presidents.

I assure you I don't need to be reminded of who is the current president. Obviously you need to be reminded of the actions and policies of Trump when he was the president. The state of our country and how he conducted foreign policies during his presidency. The fact that he's no longer the current president doesn't erase that history. And when one attempts to do so, they are exposed of either ignoring the past or complacent within the actions.

Our political systemic nature in the US is of a construct where each president over at least the past 5 decades has been one to move the country to the right. It's a pattern that is easily noticeable for those who have been paying close attention to. It's the very exposure that both parties are working in unison. As the revolving door of presidencies occur the country has moved further to the right with each of them. Each one sets a stage so that the next can move us further to the right. As the ruling class capitalism has failed on multiple levels during multiple periods of extreme measures, it has lead to the inevitable exposure of their fascist tendencies. In which any sane intelligent person who is properly observing the results from presidency to presidency can today no longer deny our involvement of crimes and unethical inhumane actions around the world. And on our own who have been sent abroad to support their criminal systemic wars. Where fascist natured actions and genocides are present in all accounts on all levels of the definitions.

PERIOD

@William_Mary Nord Stream and weaponising SWIFT changed everything forever PERIOD.
America showed its true stand over self to all. And now genocide in Gaza where the US not only stands alone in their support of (besides some piss ant countries like Nauru) but also actively enable by vetoing ceasefires or the new PC term, "pauses" at the UN.

I don't think Americans understand how much standing they have lost in the world since Biden got in.
Afghanistan pissed of many eg Australians who fought and died there also.......for what? The emancipation of women? Democracy and Freedom? Revenge? Big fail however you look at it.
Then enabling a war in Ukraine which is already lost. Nord Stream. Now Operation "Genocide Gaza" where the mighty US Navy battlegroup is unwilling to engage the big bad Houti's.
America has been shown to be not half as good or able as they thought they were (same Israeli IDF) and the world see's this very clearly. All this loss of face in 3 years and still one to go.

Biden has been a train wreak for America internationally. Even Australia bailed out on sending a warship to the Red Sea when we said we would. We usually eagerly enquire "How high?" when our Imperial masters say "Jump!". Now we feel able to reject your demands; that's how much standing the US has lost. Blind obedient support of Israel's genocide is not raising US standing either.

@puff you're a lost cause puff! Your endless bellowing of correlating history that's lacking from your argument again only speaks more of the delusional reality you're obviously indoctrinated into. The only other answer would be that you're mentally disturbed to a point you're unable to remember history and well on your way to being like Biden, mentally handicapped.

And fuck you, you Caitlin Johnstone want a be. Run my country into the ground like yours is any fucking better? I'd say you need to revisit your own countries history to recognize how it has resembled ours and all of Europe's history in its handling of natives and its move to a statehood, its collaboration with western governments, but you can't remember history within your obvious short term memory mental illness. My country didn't lead yours on its way to becoming a genocidal murdering construct. If history serves me right, I believe that honor goes to Britain.

Whin to me/us about those you lost in war that your country chose to take part in? Are you fucking serious!?! I'm not going to waste my time any longer deciphering through your lapse of history again in that above. Your tunnel vision of a false delusional reality is well beyond my psychological help. If you think the world has reached this point due to the past 3 years, you need a padded room.

Don't concentrate on only the finger. Or you'll miss all the heavenly glory around and beyond it.

@William_Mary Working as a geologist I think geological time and am enjoying watching the demise of European dominance on the global stage. European includes those countries colonised to resemble European society rather than the ones indigenous to the colonised country. Australia, USA........Israel.
It's time and the world senses it. I think my major problem is I am a pessimist so I always think the worse. But ironically, I don't get depressed at all as the worse hardly ever happens and if it does, I am mentally prepared for it. The 2 party system us Western English speaking countries have is just the same shit different wrappers more and more as I get older.
We have heard all the pessimistic foretelling of what Trump will do since he was elected. He is basically portrayed as Hitler incarnate who will destroy society and the world. Now as a pessimist I understand that view well and am a great advocate of watch what they do rather than listen to what they say. Well guess what? Reality Biden is fucking worse than potential Trump. I cannot see Trump approving the destruction of Nord Stream. Biden did, even boasting before the fact.

The USA is a military industrial complex that lives for conflict. That means an important role of any potus is to temper this lust for violence. The "deep state" don't like Trump but love Biden.
Trump is somewhat psycho I have no doubt as he displays many symptoms, one being vanity. He wants to make a name for himself, but he wishes to make a name as a peace maker and increase business. This scares the crappers out of all the pigs with their snouts in the military trough.

You may think I'm a lost cause which is no problem to me, I think the USA is a lost cause. But US foreign policy is a concern. Basically, Trump means less US military BS o/s than any other choice offered by the 2 party system, so will be glad when he wins in a landslide. I believe that not because I want it to happen but because Biden and by extension the modern Democratic party are that bad in reality. Can't be rewarded with another term.

Re our countries histories they are both ones of colonisation, like much of the world. The point is who supports this crap in 2024? Genocide Joe Biden, not unable to temper the "complex", but unwilling and even encourages it. It's almost like he's playing catchup from the lost Trump years for his controllers.

@William_Mary What are your views on this as an American? My views as an Australian? Easy, rip up the Patriot Act.

Cracks me up there are moves to remove him from any ballot and now, moves to undermine a Commander in Chief of the military. Officers may be on board doing that, not sure about the rank and file. Both these things but Jan 6th was insurrectionist. Hypocrisy sure is entertaining at times.

@puff I'm sure the deep state loves him for setting up bases around Syria's oil fields so that they can steal oil from them. Trump had his 4 years to disengaged all of the deep states agendas. That didn't work out like he said though did it? He actually expanded all of them and helped to further turn Russia into a false enemy. He's a liar on a blatant level above all the rest. He incited fascist violence during his first campaign which spread around our entire country, and the Jan 6th insurrection. He set the tone for Biden to take the war in Ukraine to a more disastrous level. Profoundly important history that escapes your opinion development. Is that by choice or complacency?

@William_Mary Listen to Col Douglas McGregor who was in the Trump WH as advisor. Trump wanted out of Syria and gave the order, it was ignored. And the only time all officialdom applauded him was when missiles strikes Syria, sent illegally by the usual suspects who ignore the UN; UK, US and France. Trump also did not approved a planned attack on Iran set up by Pompeo and Bolton. All this info is available.
Not saying Trump is a saint, just saying he will temper the violence more than any other in the race, besides RFK Jr. My only point here is as I said above so I will cut and paste again

"Reality Biden is fucking worse than potential Trump."

Trump engaged Nth Korea and was successful. Know what the deal was agreed Nth and Sth? To demilitarise the border and nuclear program when US forces fuck off. Didn't happen obviously. The US would still be in Afghanistan if not for Trump, planning the next "surge" needed to complete the job. The exit was a shambles, mad giving up that airbase to use Kabul airport. Biden left many behind and hugely damaged the US morale.

You are somewhat blinded by TDS as Biden is equally as guilty of your many identified flaws in him eg "He incited fascist violence". So does genocide Joe who seems unable to negotiate and parley in times of conflict.
"He's a liar on a blatant level above all the rest.". Heard the one how Joe's dead father had to go fix his Kibbutz 10 years ago after Oct 7th? The denial of knowledge of son's business dealings and coverup of his laptop?
(I do enjoy being devil's advocate 😉 )

They are two undesirable candidates. Confident Biden won't contest and putting money on Michelle Obama entering. Hope she gets truly humiliated if that happens.
It is the system that is fascist in the US (get rid of the Patriot Act) and the democrats control it atm and seek to retain that control through any means. They are getting desperate. Look at Nicci Haleys resounding endorsement from the major "donors"?

@puff you must have missed where Trump bragged about taking the oil. You make this too easy! You're incapable of keeping up with me in all regards. And you refuse to see it or learn from me. And now you're attempting to preach to me about the correlations of both of these ass hats. How pathetic. I'll quit now before I allow you to drag me down to your level. Whatever you have can be catchy and I don't want any of it.

@William_Mary F'n TDS sufferers. Every time you dare criticise the response is always.................Trump.
Defend Biden. Come on, tell me how him and his democrats are so much better. Don't care about internal politics in the US eg as long as I've been alive abortion has been a go to issue for democrats who failed to ratify Roe Vs Wade in Congress, enshrining it in law when they had plenty of oppourtunity when controlling both houses and the presidency. Such an important issue isn't it? Then all the wankers bleating about bodily autonomy, then demanding all take an unproven medicine or they will be discriminated against. Same people, f'n idiots with no firm principal.
Democrat blind supporters are so full of crap. Go on point out exactly how Biden has been more advantageous than Trump. I would like to see the long list. And I need proof so no Russia collusion bollocks sprouted by TDS sufferers.
forget the list. Just one will do.

@puff this will be my last response to your ignorant ass ever. Apparently, you're incapable of comprehending what you read. Which is another indication of why you're seemingly so gullible towards being lead astray and become fixated on the delusional reality you're stuck in. I mean seriously, the only other explanation is that you're purposely complacent or have some other sick agenda going on here. I'm done with it.

I don't defend Biden. Never have and never will. I don't defend or support either of the 2 establishment party's or any of their representatives. I don't support any sense of the current capitalist structure, especially in the US off my back. The construct to me is an organized crime syndicate ran by the international ruling class. For the life of me, the life in you, how in the hell can you possibly miss that!?!

I know you've been in my group outside of this group. Have you never taken the time to collectively observe the intent of the groups name and narrative of its agenda? Which would be a high indication of the type of person I am in most regards, and my political views and how I reach my opinion development. It's an obvious message of dissent against all aspects of the delusional reality most are engulfed in and the structures that participate in keeping them there. And Biden is as much a target as Trump is. The democratic party as much as the republican party. And all the MSCMs down to the MSMs that echo them. Which carries abroad to all western governments for their participation in the same worldly crimes.

Do you tend to walk down dark allies without any thought that there might be danger ahead and do so unprepared mentally? Stick your hand into moving parts without considering it might not be wise? How can you possibly go this long and fail to recognize how my comments that go with the articles I post as being only supportive to a form of dissent? I use news sources that are primarily constructs of dissenting views of western government activities and their medias that are negatively harming all levels of our societies and the world abroad.

And you'll never sell me on the side of that, that you've obviously been indoctrinated to in regards to comparing Trump to Biden. In which I can't get you to recognize that both are virtually the same. They're simply 2 different sides of the same coin. In which you refuse to use the history which vastly backs my argument. You've actually made it a point to twist it and void what is needed to make yours. Fox news might have an opening for you.

@William_Mary You still think Jan 6th was an insurrection (US spook agencies don't, only democrats/ media) and I don't recall Trump inciting the violence during BLM/ Seatle/ his term, it was others Then you bring up Fox as they are the only biased channel, unlike CNN/ MNSBC (why not mention them?). But the big one, mention Biden and the automatic counter is Trump.
Many intelligent people have TDS and you are one of them. Willing to corrupt your institutions to ensure he can't play the game. Like Covid, Trump is a hazard but nowhere near as bad as we get told and it is not him that does the damage, it is the response to him. MAGA supporters are election deniers say those who chanted 'not my president' for 4 years. Anyway regardless of party or potus, all know the US is Israel's bitch. The US is in decline, rapid decline with Biden. He is the most corrupt president you have had, hands down. Trump will get in because the other option is a worse choice and be rewarding the last 4 years.
Can't wait until the US burns Australia, which the US always does eventually to all 'allies', so we finally cut ties and we can join BRICS and ASEAN where we belong. Any coercive powers used in the past will be gone as the $USD will revert to a national currency next crash.
You post about the failure of the Israel experiment. The American one has run it's course as well. The system is fascist and loves war so won't be missed when it implodes as Israel also seems intent on doing.

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