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To all those watching the UK brexit celebrations, both for and against - now you understand how the former colonies felt.

Petter 9 Jan 31
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1

Farage spent plenty of years campaigning for the UK to leave the EU, and was insulting and childish towards our friends in Europe. He could be run over by a bus tomorrow, but there will still be a European Movement, now 70 years old, to campaign for as long as it takes to get us back in. Make the most of it Petter. We'll be back.

We will be back.

Red_Cat Level 7 Feb 2, 2020

A la Schwartzenegger? 🤣😅

2

Not at all. The UK was not "colonised by Europe, unless if you mean when England was invaded by the Normans.
The UK was a senior partner in the EU and leaving will probably hurt the EU as much as the UK'
I agree with Marionville that this is a very sad day.
This was driven by self serving politicians promoting narrow nationalism and Xenophobia and every time I see the smug face of Farage on TV I feel sick.

Moravian Level 8 Feb 1, 2020

@Moravian @Marionville. You represent one side of Brexit, just as many people in the old colonies did not wish to cut their links to the mother country.
Look at the celebrations and you can see people supporting the other side of Brexit.
Don't only think British colonies - other nations also had colonies. Gibraltar is one that is determined to remain tied to Britain, but not ALL Gibraltarians feel the same.
This is the point I was making. I was physically present in two ex-colonies at their moment of independence, and was avidly in favour of it, but many of my friends were not.

@Petter The coming together of old allies, foes, others after WW2 was a joining of equals with the purpose of uniting an often war-torn Europe. Equals, no matter who won the war, or lost it.

This was totally different to one nation colonising another by conquest, often taking the host's natural resources in the process.

Several leading politicians and commentators from various EU countries, have said in interviews that they are very sad to see a strong member of the community depart. They all have added that both parties will be weaker as a consequence. That is what I see and hear on the TV channels available in the UK.

There is no joy, except among those who wish to destroy what has been built up over, I think, 47 years of UK membership of the EU. It is so much easier to destroy than to create. And gloating is cheaper than magnanimity.

I am part of The European Movement, and will now devote the rest of my life to getting the UK to re-apply for membership of the EU. It has already started:

[europeanmovement.co.uk]

@Red_Cat I have friends and family who voted to leave and the only treason I can get from them is that the EU changed from a trade coalition to a political union. I think anyone with half a brain is aware of that and it was to the benefit of all of Europe. I feel angry and sad today and will have a close look at the movement you mention

@Red_Cat You miss my point. I'm pointing out that the feelings on both sides of Brexit reflect the feelings of both sides on ending a colonial relationship. Gibraltar, for example, has a majority adamantly against not being under British control.

@Petter You wrote: "To all those watching the UK brexit celebrations, both for and against - now you understand how the former colonies felt." If I missed the point you were making, perhaps it was a point not well made. For example, when somebody says or writes, "...now you know how it feels..." there is an element of "Told you so" or gloating. That is common parlance where I come from and where I now live.

It is presumptuous of you to assume that people with strongly held views are not capable of simultaneously understanding, if not empathising with others who hold different views. You need not bother to assume the role of teacher with me.

@Red_Cat There was no element of gloating. Merely a plea for understanding. Too often I get nothing but blind condemnation for having been a colonial.

@Petter Perhaps it would have been better to write this in your Original Post: Too often I get nothing but blind condemnation for having been a colonial.

That could have been followed by reasons why you do not deserve to be condemned. There is a whole different and interesting conversation to be had around that, rather than assume the rest of us do not understand brexiters.

2

Not really!

JackPedigo Level 9 Jan 31, 2020
1

You have no idea how sad I am at this mistake we’re making tonight. There will be no celebrations from me. And no...I don’t understand, if you mean they were glad to see the back of us. I should think it more likely that the EU feel that way!

It was euphoria at being masters of themselves, mixed with apprehension about the future.
Is there not a degree of parallel emotion amongst a large proportion of the UK population right now

@Petter Certainly I’m unhappy...because I think the benefits we got from being an EU member far outweighed the disadvantages. I am dismayed at the vulgarity and downright contempt of Farage and his cohort of Brexit MEPs when they waved union flags and gloated at the European Parliament yesterday. They are the sort of jingoistic little Englanders that I believe show Britain up in an extremely bad light and that I hate to be associated with. I’m ashamed of them and the fact they and their doctrine of isolationism and going it alone managed to persuade the majority to vote to leave the EU. They have an arrogance, completely misplaced, because they believe that the British are better than everyone else, especially Johnny Foreigner on mainland Europe. I can only speak for myself of course and don’t know how others feel, but I do think the expectations and optimism which Boris has built up around fantastic trade deals, especially with USA ,will leave a large number of people disillusioned and angry at being hoodwinked by him.

@Marionville You certainly understand one side of the colonial debate. The other side was boisterously happy! See the resemblance?
If you then follow the early post-colonial history you will see attitudes changing, ON BOTH SIDES.

@Petter Time will tell one that one.

@Marionville Which is exactly what happened in many ex colonies, and is still happening. Remember, Canada, India and Australia are ex-colonies. So are Somalia, Algeria and Brazil.

@Petter I really don’t need the history lesson..I’m aware of Britain’s colonial past along with that of other European nations and their empires. I can also see why you believe the comparison in us leaving the EU is apt. Yes, perhaps to a certain degree it is, but Britain was never a colony of the EU, they never imposed imperial rule over us, we were equal partners in all decision making and in fact helped to shape and influence the EU rules. We didn’t have to fight the EU to leave, in fact the original member states put up more of a fight when we originally tried to join, making it much harder to get into it than it was to leave it. The only fighting we’ve been doing has been amongst ourselves in the UK, it has left us a deeply divided country.

@Marionville I know all that. I know Britain wasn't colonised - although it was (and still is) bound to toe the line in many matters. It had, in effect, lost sovereignty to a central, external authority.
My post's point concerns the differing EMOTIONS felt by the populations of those lands.
Many people in England, fed "politically correct" garbage by usually left wing apologists, never understood the mixed feelings in countries as they gained independent sovereignty.
I felt it first hand. Tanganyika was not a colony, it was a UN mandated Territory. Uganda was a protectorate. Kenya was a mix. A protectorate in the wide coastal strip, and a colony in the interior. I lived in all of them, both before and after independence.
I can assure you the emotions were very similar to what I am seeing now regarding Brexit.
I hope this helps people understand the colonial past. After all, swathes of Canada were created by American "remainers", who migrated North in order to remain part of Britain.

2

Interesting how occupation and retreat unfolds over the millennia.

Britain did well over the Roman withdrawal but Rwanda turned into a blood bath after the Belgians went away.

I wonder how UK will now fare in a global trading market with no product to offer and a buffoon at the rudder.

“Watch out for the rocks, helmsman!”

Geoffrey51 Level 8 Jan 31, 2020

East Africa transitioned well. The Belgian Congo disastrously.
India had an insurmountable problem - religion.
The "fudge" solution was to create Pakistan, an ongoing problem for India.

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