Why don't we have a agnostic church ?

David1955 comments on Jan 21, 2018:

Non believers don't need a church; we need a growing, connected, visible, forthright, global community of people who stand against all enemies of reason, including religions.

Which Wyatt Earp movie do you prefer?

David1955 comments on Jan 21, 2018:

Wyatt Earp is a fascinating character. Ive read a lot about him. Tombstone with K. Russell was in terms of history a load of crap, but a great movie. Russell was too small a guy to play him but who cares. Kilmer was excellent as The Doc.

"If you happen to despise religion as much as I do, I'm asking you to stop being polite and come out...

David1955 comments on Jan 21, 2018:

Your question is US specific, but I think very rich respectable people, I'm hoping there are some left, coming out and promoting atheism or non belief would be a very good . Problem is, very rich usually pretend to like religion. It looks good with "the little people". The PR isn't good if they come out as non religious. Look at Bill Gates, whom I don't care for. Famously said, I might as well believe in God.....Thanks Bill. He never had a principle that didn't have a $. Politicians too, generally. It's one of the last bastions: influential people coming out and promoting the struggle against religion. As for despising religion, I stopped being superficially polite long time ago. I will tell them they have the right to believe in whatever religious nonsense and rubbish they want, but not the right to respect of belief, or the right to tell me I cannot say what I think about it. I agree with you, it's time to stop being polite, at least on the issues.

What kind of phone do you have?

David1955 comments on Jan 21, 2018:

I have Galaxy Note 3 which I will use until it dies. They keep pumping out these new models but I really think it's pump priming consumption. A new gizmo that does little more than the previous model. BTW, I'm an Apple user, have been since the 80s, yes 80s, but I won't use iPhone. They are hideously overpriced, underpowered, locked in due to IOS, poor batteries, and too damned small unless you buy their biggest most expensive one. They line up to buy 'em and I think they are addicted.

"We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed it.

David1955 comments on Jan 21, 2018:

You know, religionists always say this argument is wrong, and yet I have never heard a convincing rebuttal from them. I don't think there is one.

There is no agnostic vs. atheist! The peeve I have...

David1955 comments on Jan 20, 2018:

Excellent response @MichaelSpinler on this subject. I'm a little taken aback by a post that rails against people trying to "educate" others about labels while doing exactly that in the post. This issue has come about from a challenge from agnostics about the site and what it stands for. Having stirred this up, now we have lecture extolling the virtues of not getting hung up on labels. Duh! Well I would have agreed anyway with this before all this got stirred up. As for me I'm not going to be get caught up anymore in webs in the atheist-agnostic debate. I respect agnostics' right to revel in their unknowingness. :-) But @Admin the issue of the definition of this site still remains, even though you like this post, and the title Agnostic.com leads some to consider that this isn't just a domain name choice but a site definition.

When was the last time you had an in-person theological discussion?

David1955 comments on Jan 20, 2018:

A what ? Do you mean face to face discussion with someone about religion? If so, the last detailed one was at a party a few weeks ago with a Reverend Pastor guy. I won.

Ancient Aliens

David1955 comments on Jan 20, 2018:

You all think the show is a joke but you watch it. What does that tell you? Well, clever marketing, but also we humans just love the idea of a big cosmic thingamy to intrigue us. Oh, I'm no better, before you flame me. I've watched a few episodes, but not a lot. It's a hoot. Mostly harmless, unlike ghost talkers and mediums, which I strongly dislike. Oh, you know the moon is hollow, with an alien base inside from which they launch UFOs. They covered that. Just thought I'd mention it.

Any Sam Harris fans?

David1955 comments on Jan 19, 2018:

Huge, enormous, admirer of SH, his books, pods and debates, along with Dawkins an co. To my mind he has one of the most forensically devastating debating styles of anything I have ever seen. He cuts through to the central key point in any debate point and just often leaves religionists floundering. I find the personal attacks on him - that he's racist, bigoted, etc - to be absurd. They fear his arguments so they attack the man. My favourite work of his is Letter to a Christian Nation.

Discussion about the latest site footer It reads "Agnostic.

David1955 comments on Jan 19, 2018:

Looking at all this and some of the assumptions about what atheism is which I think are wrong but obviously it doesn't seem to matter much whatever you say, I am left wondering what the tag line of this site is becoming. "Agnostic.com is a non profit organisation allowing discussion between people no matter what they believe, whether they are a bit religious, medium religious, a lot religious, believe in there is no god, might be a god, iffy one way or another about God, agnostic about some gods, or all gods, take your pick, believe in evidence as the basis for all belief, or not, up to you, so whatever you believe, no worries, secular, supernatural, quasi Supernatural, basically whatever works for you, in an environmental where we'll spend our time arguing amongst ourselves while religions continue to spoil the world, except for my preferred religion or non religion, as the case may be, which is good." In other words, just another social media site. I had hoped for a clear non mysticism espousing based community. @Admin @silvereyes @Coffeo @TheMiddleWay @Sadoi @DavidLaDeau

If ghosts are real, do they have mass?

David1955 comments on Jan 19, 2018:

I can imagine the conversation: "I'm a member of a great nonbeliever site called agnostic.com" "Great! What do you talk about?" "Oh, you know, Ghosts. How the might exist. The physics behind them. That sort of thing." "Ahhh.. That's .....interesting" :-)

What's your favorite pizza?

David1955 comments on Jan 19, 2018:

I hope there are no more threads like this. You just get hungry reading it. Now I've got to get a damn pizza tomorrow, Saturday, cause all I can think about is pizza. Thanks a lot. :-) :-).

If ghosts are real, do they have mass?

David1955 comments on Jan 19, 2018:

You know, I love this stuff. Remember watching one of those true ghost story tv shows from the US (sorry, but where else) and there was an expert, I recall he had a degree in ghostiology from a reputable institution I'm sure, as well as a ghost-ometer device that could pick up ghostly vibrations and emanations, with great accuracy, he said, as you could see when the needle went haywire when he pointed it to some place where ghostly things had happened, in particular when figurines had been knocked over by a ghostly visitor. Why do ghosts hate figurines? They always knock those suckers over in the night. I'm telling you I wouldn't have any figurines in my place. Just asking for trouble. And I can't afford a ghost-ometer on my income. So there it is. The 21st Century. Well, for some of us. ????

What's your favorite pizza?

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

Vegetarian only pizza. That way I feel less guilty about eating it because it's healthier. (Don't reply telling me I'm deluded. I know).

If ghosts are real, do they have mass?

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

First, prove they exist. Second, weigh them to answer the question. If you can never do the first, then the second is irrelevant.

Discussion about the latest site footer It reads "Agnostic.

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

I am fine with the tag line as it is too. But honestly, this never ending squabble between calling oneself agnostic or atheist is one of the biggest surprises to me here. It seems really to bother some agnostics, though I don't know why, though atheists like me have no problem with the term agnostic. Whatever the site had been called, or its Tagline defined, someone would have been unhappy about it. I thought this was a site for non-believers, unbelievers in religion, with religionists joining, if they really must, as long as they fit the culture of tolerance. Was I wrong? At times the debate between agnostic and atheist reminds me of Monty Python Life of Brian, and the People's Front of Judea and Judean Peoples Front ( or whatever it was) fighting amongst themselves instead of fighting the Romans. Can we just fight the Romans please?

In one moment I am born, living and taking my last breath.

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

Time might be an illusion but if I don't pay my electricity bill on time and they cut off my power and I can't work or cook food, the illusion becomes pretty bloody real pretty bloody quickly. I guess these New Age feel good profundities just don't work on me.

Can anybody give their views on mediums and faith healers? I think they are despicable.

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

I completely concur with the negative comments made here about faith healers and Mystics and similar. They should be exposed and neutralised. For anyone who is interested, I refer to a very interesting interview from the Richard Dawkins doc Enemies of Reason, with atheist illusionist Derren Brown, who made a special study of who does this, why they do it, how they do it, and why people are susceptible to it. It's reasonably long but very interesting about this stuff from a guy who is in the business but as a honourable illusionist for entertainment.

Had a thought: If we are wrong, we - this community- will all end up in hell together.

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

So, not in doubt in anyone's mind? I thought not. As Richard Carrier once said: If I had to spend an eternity in so called heaven knowing that millions or billions of otherwise good people were suffering in hell for no other reason than they in good conscience could not be believers, or followed the wrong God, then I'd still be in a hell of my own. Why kind of God would it be? A god that doesn't exist.

What is the scariest thing you've ever done.

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

Not sure if scary can mean just dangerous but for me it was 1995, on a motorcycle trip in Thailand. I was living there then, keen to get back to my girl, on return journey, last leg, great new highway, little traffic, wide open area, perfect weather, no police or anything like that to worry about back then, and I opened the thing up to 160k on a straight stretch. Got a speed vibration, then up to 175 kph and steady as a rock. Held it like that for a long time. The straight stretch was amazing. I can still remembering the exhilaration, the world coming at me so fast at that speed, and I felt so peaceful and relaxed, strange to say. I remember it so well. And the bike wasn't flat out, nothing like it. Could easily have pushed 200kph++. But at that speed even on the longest stretch you soon run out of straight road. Never did it again, but glad I did it once.

How do you make a living?

David1955 comments on Jan 18, 2018:

On-line instructor.

How long has everyone been single. For me it's been over 2 years.

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Everyone here is single?

I look at this group as my own little hippie commune.

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Hey, what's happen' man? Oh, that's beautiful baby, I really dig that man....:-) . I wish I had a time machine. I would go back to the 60s of my youth. I belong there. I hate the modern world. Trump, Muslim terrorists, NSA spying on everything, Kim Jong Crazy, China taking over the world, the US in decline, the climate's ruined, the world owned by 0.1%, everybody is permanently depressed... What's to like? Maybe I'll end up in my Twilight Zone episode and go back and stay in the 60s. Yes, yes, I know there was bad s--t going on back then...but still....

How did God create the sun on the 4th day?

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

A religionist would say, "God's idea of a day is a mystery and unknowable to us and is a matter of faith." See, problem solved. :-)

Some times I wish I believed in a god, so I'd have someone to get pissed at.

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Yes. John Lennon wrote in a song, "God is a concept by which we measure our pain." I think this is truly insightful. God or equivalent is something we can create to have an external reference to vent our frustration and anger. It's a natural thing for specks like us on a ball in space to do, to point "up" and either literally or figuratively shake our fist in frustration, to blame, or to look for salvation or something else. Religionists do this and believe it's true. That's their delusion. A true atheist can't; we know it's a falsehood, and knowing this it cannot bring any solace. I think that makes us realists. Yes, God is a CONCEPT by which we measure our pain. A human concept. And, paraphrasing Lennon, God is also a concept by which we define our ignorance. That's why humans, when they didn't understand something, would say "God did it" until science showed otherwise. The tragedy is that many people still think like this.

The World's Newest Major Religion: No Religion

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

It's true the religion is, generally speaking, on the decline in western countries, but in the third world it's a different matter. And Christianity is looking there for its expansion plans. We focus a lot on religion in our countries, but it's what religions are doing in the developing world, away from the publicity, away from the media, away from scrutiny, that bothers me. I don't think this is discussed enough. I'm doing some research now and will post on this in time. This includes the Catholic Church and evangelists.

Did the historical Jesus exist?

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Can I just point out to the community I've seen this poster before, and I'm pretty sure it was in a Google Community Group on Atheism which I signed on very briefly until I read a lot of verbose texting by, I'm fairly certain JohnSmith, with his emphatic assertions that Jesus really existed and don't you say otherwise! I recognise the same text. I recognise the same put downs of Richard Carrier in particular. I think the terms bees in bonnets and hobby horses might apply. Now, if I'm right, he's come here. Make of that what you will, but that's my recollection. I'm going to stay out of this web. Got better things to do and posters to read. FYI

Am I the only one on the planet who prefers reading to movies?

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Yeah I'm watching fewer movies these days, but maybe more quality tv series. I think the movie format might be beginning the journey to its end. Only beginning. The whole big blockbuster superhero thing just bores me witless. Not many movies really appeal now. I have a particular dislike of movies by HWood about "true stories" and "real events". They are always crap. I have a strong history focus, and when they make these so-called true story movies I know they're rubbish, especially when I know the history and facts. I'll take a well made documentary or history book any day. Now Tarrantino is making a movie about Manson. Spare us! I know this history very very well, and I can just imagine the bloodbath he'll create. He should stick to revisionist history entertainment. Like a lot of movies I probably will just not see it. I ignore a lot of movies these days, and I can stream anything I want, if I wish.

Have you had 9 lives or less ? What's your story ?

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

I used to be Shirley McLaine

I can't believe it-made it to Level 8!!!!!

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Are we seeing an aristocracy evolving here......the 1.0% ers.. Careful @sassygirl3869. Never forget where you came from.... :-)

Did the historical Jesus exist?

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Do you know, I have noticed this before. Non believers who nevertheless believe in a historical Jesus are more passionate and obsessive than believers who naturally believe that Jesus existed. No, no, the mythicists are all full of crap.... Of course he existed....they say...well he wasn't God but he was real.. he was...he was...he was..!!! Because there is so little evidence, the subject is still debated. Richard Carrier (no doubt the poster will dismiss him) has said that Jesus may have existed, but his view is on balance there's not enough evidence to say so. I agree. The passion of the "nonbeliever - Jesus was real!" brigade is becoming irritating to me. They remind me of religionists, actually.

A Story that Grew in the Telling The source evidence that exists that purports to show that ...

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

I think it was Richard Carrier who once noted that people who come back from the dead are either ghosts or zombies. Which one was Jesus, I wonder? My guess is zombie. Jesus the walking dead. @gearl I agree with you below.

I can't believe it-made it to Level 8!!!!!

David1955 comments on Jan 17, 2018:

Some of us from S H countries can only dream. (Well done)

I can't seam to ignore religious comments

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

My advice is, clarify in your own mind why you are not a believer; consider the reasons and think about them carefully; then consider all the counter arguments that religionists make, and why you don't accept them. When you do that, you can or should be in a position to respond to religionists views, and explain why you reject them. You can only make your own position as clear and logical as possible. The rest is up to them.

To those of you familiar with atheism's "Four Horsemen" I pose a question.

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

Yes, Lawrence Krauss. And I would like the horsemen thing replaced by horse people. There are a lot of very active women in the atheist movement, look at Richard Dawkins site for example, but the leading activists Dawkins etc are thought of a group of men. It gets criticised for that. I would like to see that change. I also have to say that, despite the obvious sadness of his death, that Hitchens was my least favourite horseman. Liked his views on religion, but not his politics.

I believe in GOD.

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

Talk about trying to have the best of both worlds. If I thought like that I'd have cognitive dissonance. What then, in your view, is the link between your God and human beings. Obviously it's not religion, as you have discounted that. So what is it?

Greetings.

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

Wherever I hear someone say something like, I'm not religious but.... I believe in a higher power....I believe in something after death....I believe in a higher spiritual level....etc I kind of think it's like someone saying, l don't drink, but every Saturday night I go out and get drunk.... Well, one night a week will do it. No disrespect, friend, I guess it's ok keep the options open. Like @tsjames I don't agree however.

I've been thinking a lot about death recently and what I would like to happen with my remains when I...

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

If I could I would have my remains put into a rocket and shot into the Sun. I've never forgotten that Uncle Carl Sagan told us we are star stuff, and I'd like to be recycled that way. Bit difficult, I know.

I've had a lot of people think because I'm an atheist that I have no morals.

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

If people think an atheist is a bad person or immoral due to that then their opinion is worthless and they are irrelevant.

What is your favorite kind of dog ?

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

None. I like cats. Only cats. I find dogs annoying. Sorry, I know you dog owners will hate me.

If you could live anywhere in the world except your homeland, where would that be?

David1955 comments on Jan 16, 2018:

Thailand. I used to live and work there. I've never felt more at home than when I was there. Unfortunately I can't live there at the moment. I like not being in a Christian country.

Do you block the trolls around here?

David1955 comments on Jan 15, 2018:

Can I just add that in addition to trolls, fully commented on here by others, there's the issue of a trend of posters who I don't think have an interest in higher ideas really at all. Now I'm the last one who wants to censor posting, and I've said so, and we can all raise lighter or humorous issues from time to time. But I would be sad to see the promise of this excellent initiative, which I'm sure all serious posters respect and would wish for better things, be lost as it becomes a sort of FaceBook MiniMe. Please no.

Hello all you thinkers out there.

David1955 comments on Jan 15, 2018:

I like your definition of Gods...its down there on my list, oh I'm sure they'd not be missed..... :-). Welcome. I think @Hominid is mistaken: you've got to bring your own booze. :-)

Besides religion, what's an example of magical thinking?

David1955 comments on Jan 15, 2018:

I desperately wanted to add something, but the good folks got it covered. So I'll just say all the below. Wait, there is something...fortune telling..specifically divining bird poop stains on statues, as per the ancient Roman skill. :-)

I've been studying religious philosophy for more then 20 years now from modern to ancient from ...

David1955 comments on Jan 15, 2018:

So, since I doubt very many if anyone here believes in the devil, evil before the devil was created (your term) religious dark matter that separates our two dimensions, whatever that means, not to mention "a higher power", I'm wondering what you hope to learn here from a community overwhelmingly of religious non believers?

What is your opinion about Alexa?

David1955 comments on Jan 15, 2018:

I wanted to get Alexa, but stupid Amazon made it very difficult here in Australia to get. So I'm a Google Home guy. It's amazing how quickly I have gotten used to AI in the house. I've got 2. Haven't got to turn on lights and so on, but music, Chromecast, etc,,,I'm doing it all now. Apple have missed the boat. Amazon lost the initiative on the world stage and they'll regret it.

Watching V for Vendetta again.

David1955 comments on Jan 15, 2018:

Remember remember, the 5th of November... I adore this movie. Watch it every November. Brings out my inner anarchist.

Why Religion is Outdated in the 21st Century - Lawrence Krauss - YouTube

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

I think Lawrence Krauss is the true inheritor of the Carl Sagan role model. (Some people say Neil Degrass Tyson, but I don't agree) Krauss is wonderful.

Hello Everyone! I am new here and just wanted to say hi!

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

Have they taught you the secret handshake yet? .....Joking......Welcome :-)

What We All Have in Common

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

I don't know why people have a problem getting this, about diversity, really. I got it back in the 60s as a kid watching Star Trek, thanks to Roddenberry

Is christianity truely monotheistic?

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

Dr Richard Carrier, atheist, Jesus Mythicist, once said Christianity is a complex mixture of prophecy (from pre Jesus period) history, some real and lot bad, theology and mythology, and teasing out the truth and facts require great intellectual rigour. Christians generally don't do that. And it evolved adding different elements, like the Jesus story in the 4th Century, and I think Satan wasn't added until a century or two after that. I'd have to check that, but this would surprise Christians I'm sure. Now the Virgin Mary story came much later, and she's been turning up in French toast and alike ever since. Also let's not forget that at the the time of the canonisation of Jesus, 4th Century, there were all these different Christian groups with various versions of who and what Jesus was. Well they were hunted down and dealt with by the Christians. Bart Erhman's last book, How Jesus Became God, goes into that in detail. Take any point in Christian history. It's not a nice story. And it still isn't.

Who is Going to Pay for the Assanine Wall?

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

I'd say it will be the American tax payers, or the people in the US, or American citizens, or from money acquired by your government through taxation. One of those certainly.

When/how did you realise you were an atheist?

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

I never not knew it. I got to an age when I was able to articulate it., in my teens.

Conservatives are generally against a welfare state, but it also seems like the majority of ...

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

They...don't...care....Individual welfare - bad! Corporate welfare.....good! Even Adam Smith, the so-called father of capitalist free market economics, wrote the unrestrained capitalism will destroy itself it too successful. Modern conservatism, actually reactionary conservatism has more in common with religion than economics or political science. Faith.

Hello, all. happy to be amoungst like-minded individuals. :)

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

We are like-minded except for all the things that we don't think alike. :-). If you know what I mean.... Welcome.

Getting pissed at a church sevice?

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

I haven't had the colourful experiences that some have had, just dragged to Catholic Church on Sundays, but I have to say I do not like and have never liked being in churches. I go now only for B, D and M s. There is something I loathe about churches. No, not fear of God. It's the feeling like I'm in the Bronze Age; dudes in silly hates and costumes, and all the looking "up" at God. Looking where? There is no up, just a ball in space and we are on it. It's just creepy. Some love all the churchy pantomime, but I loathe it and can't wait to leave to rejoin the 21st Century. I think I find it child-like. And I don't like childish behaviour.

What do you have faith in?

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

This is a loaded question. The word faith is used in 2 ways. The first is a synonym for hope or trust. You can have faith that people will do the right thing. It's based on some evidence or assessment that what you have faith in will occur. I think this is the meaning of your question. The second meaning of faith is belief in something in the total absence of evidence because you just "believe" that it is true. That's how religions use it. As for me, I avoid the word completely.

Dumb Religious News Stories No.

David1955 comments on Jan 14, 2018:

Ever noticed that whenever a group or industry commissions a poll about themselves, the poll results are always positive? A Meat industry commissioned poll says meat is so good, you should eat it 5 times a day. A sugar industry commissioned poll finds sugar is the best thing you can eat. Dairy industry poll....yes, dairy is the best thing you can have. Apparently the same holds true of religious polls. I wish someone would spare us from these damn polls!

If you don't believe in God , and feel that man made religion is just a vain attempt to tell some ...

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

Posters here have covered all the points that I would make, so I won't rehash. I will say that one of the biggest divides in this community, though conducted cordially, is between agnostics and atheists. Note the phrase in the post - agnostic as opposed to atheist. (I know it's not meant to mean opposition). But this divide has really surprised me. Agnostics really often seem to have a real problem with the word atheism. But atheists, like me, have no problem with someone choosing agnostic. It seems to me that agnostics think that atheism is presumptuous or arrogant in some way. One poster told me he thought it was insane (his word) to be atheist, and just as bad as being a theist. Yet to me atheist is just a logical deduction. I don't believe a cosmic duck made the universe. I'm a Acosmicduckist. I don't believe, due to no evidence, that a God made the universe. I'm an atheist. New evidence, maybe my view would change. Not sure why some agnostics have a problem with this.

More Dawkins moments... [youtube.com]

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

I often think that Dawkins could put up his feet, enjoy some kind of retirement, I'm sure he's financially comfortable, and yet there he is going around the world, including here in Australia from time to time, spearheading, with others, the atheist movement, and taking endless crap from detractors. His passion and determination to neutralise religious nonsense is inspiring. Certainly has been for me. I'm not one to think about meeting celebrities or famous people, but I would like to meet and thank Richard Dawkins.

Does the Universe have to make sense?

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

I think the cosmologists and theoretical physicists like Krause and Degrass Tyson are right when they say the universe may or may have purpose, we just don't know. It's foolishly human to assume that it does, or that it should conform to our expectations. Religions make this mistake.

Apparently in 2013 Oprah made the comment that Athists cannot feel awe and wonder.

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

It's a religious believer prejudice I've heard before. Atheists and non believers might look for evidence and science and skepticism, but they lack a spiritual side, a sense of wonder and awe. Baloney! I agree with what others have said here on that. As for Oprah, she's good at what she does, and good luck to her, but on that show of hers she had a lot nonsense and twaddle that pandered to her market. She is not suitable as a Presidential candidate. She might support someone who is, like Bernie, and help that way. She couldn't handle a political environment and I suspect she's smart enough to know that.

Where do you draw the line between run-of-the-mill Bible Thumpers and Cults?

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

Love the fact that so many here say exactly what I think too: Cult = small unpopular religion. Religion = large popular cult. Before Christianity became a theologised religion it was a Jesus Cult, and there various versions of it. They all start off the same way.

Should we give religious believers a little more slack?

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

Depends what is meant by slack. Religious extremists, no slack. Genuine people who have a religion but are tolerant and progressive, yes. Religious organisations that take money from people, support reactionary policies, teach superstitious nonsense to children instead of critical thinking, cover up appalling deeds by their members and do all they can to thwart human progress, absolutely no slack whatsoever.

When I first told someone I was an Atheist they said I didn’t seem like an Atheist. ?????? Lol

David1955 comments on Jan 13, 2018:

You know, those jokes about atheists eating babies or whatever are amusing, but what concerns me is when I come across polls that show how many people still associate atheists with immoral people, untrustworthy, lacking credibility and so on, and it's crazy that this is the case. We know that many politicians won't admit to being atheist because it may be a negative with voters. There's work to be done to correct this negative correlation. Even a guy as direct and forthright as Bernie Sanders, who is thought to be a non believer, isn't forthright about that. That's not a criticism; it's understandable.

Atheist, unfortunately, is a word with extreme negative connotations for many people, try saying you...

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

I don't care less about getting less of an emotional reaction. Quite the contrary. I agree with Dr Richard Carrier who said in an interview that it's time to take religions on. If we don't do it in this century then I fear it will be too late.

What are some of the best books?

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

Sam Harris Letter to a Christian Nation. A perfect treatise. I just wish the Christian Nation would read it. Also a personal favourite, perhaps less well known, is Mathew McCormick Atheism and the Case Against Christ (2012). The focus is far wider than just the Christ myth, and is very interesting analysis of religion from many angles.

What are some of the best books?

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

Sam Harris Letter to a Christian Nation. A perfect treatise. I just wish the Christian Nation would read it.

We all know the types, that believe God intervenes when something wonderful happens, some kind of ...

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

A really fundamental question. There are two points here. The first is the inconsistency between God being responsible for anything good, but not responsible for anything bad. Theists always seems to come back to one answer: it's God's plan, it's beyond our comprehension, it's a mystery etc, That's their way of avoiding thinking about it. The second question is about God not just not preventing bad, but doing it himself. Look at the bible. God's consent of murder, rape, enslavement and retribution. So many atheists have pointed this out. Read Dawkins. How can this be? Because monotheists create their God then put him outside of the moral and sin framework that he apparently created. He is not subject to it. So, if we murder, rape, and enslave, we are guilty of sins, and also human crimes. But if God does it, that's OK. God is always good, they say. God cannot be other then good. Whatever he does is always good. He is Goodness. Not only absurd and a contradiction, but dangerous. If whatever God does it good, even if bad, then it's good. If religionist zealots follow God's Will, and do bad, that's OK because the cosmic diplomatic immunity that He has flows on to them. All religious atrocities, including modern terrorist thinking, is based on this false reasoning. It stems from a God concept. It follows inevitably.

What type of coffee is your favorite?

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

The old fashioned coffee brewer on the stove. None of this high tech coffee gadgetry for me. And Blue Mountain coffee.

What's Going On.... Bernie Sanders

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

I'm a big admirer. Many outside the US are. 2016, he was robbed! I only wish he were 20 years younger. I intend nothing ageist about that. I wish him full steam ahead. But there are some realities about ageing that can't be ignored. I wish he had a protege, someone following in his footsteps, utterly genuine, like him. Perhaps someone will emerge. But that Democratic Party there.. It looks rotten from the top down. The Clintons have left it an empty shell.

Why are agnostics still on the fence about Jesus?

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

I think agnosticism is about belief or otherwise in God. I don't see the agnostic position on that, though I respect their right. Ask an agnostic: Do you believe the universe was created by a Cosmic Duck? Is the universe a Cosmic Egg, and we cosmic ducklings? No? No possibility that that is true? Congratulations, you're a A-Cosmic-Duck-ist. Same thing with God. It's just a word. Sounds from our brain. Instead of the word God we might say, Hairyknucklehead. In churches they might say, Oh Hairyknucklehead we ask for your blessing..... May Hairyknucklehead forgive you... God is just a word. People are frightened by it. Ignorant people from primitive times said it a lot, so it has more meaning. No it doesn't. So, just in case there's a God, I'll say agnostic, some people say. If I am wrong he wont be so pissed off at me. Really? There's no proof of Hairyknucklehead, there's no proof of a Cosmic Duck, and no proof of God. No difference. If anyone has any proof of these, give me a call. On the question of Jesus, it's not so much agnosticism, but whether you believe he existed at all, and, if he did, was he Son of God. The first is about historical evidence. It is debated. The second has nothing to do with evidence but non-reason based faith. Believers don't care about the history.

What does “Spiritual Atheist” mean? Isn’t it a contradiction?

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

Carl Sagan used to say he had a spiritual feeling looking up at the Cosmos. His credentials were impeccable. If you disconnect the word spiritual from supernatural and use it mean a sense of wonder about the universe and our world, then there's no problem. If you say you are an atheist but run around with phoney spiritual gurus or whatever, then you do have a problem. Personally, I don't like the word and don't use it because of its connection to religion and new age mumbo jumbo. But that's me.

Donald, actually the "shithole" is about two inches below your nose.

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

Watching Mr Mark Shields on the US PBS NewsHour a while back I think he referred to him as President Potty Mouth. That's about right.

Well, der Donald has figured some things out.

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

He had better not visit here in Australia. Even the conservatives here think he's a nut job, though they're tactful about it. Only a few loonies on the further Right like him, or used to. Many at least pretended to be polite to GW Bush when he visited years ago. I'm not sure even that pretense could be maintained with Trump, apart from key Government officials. I think there was even a petition by some politicians and supporters specifically asking that he not be invited. Now when Obama visited the reception was genuinely warm.

This isn't really a question.

David1955 comments on Jan 12, 2018:

Hope they don't use the old drug dealers trick of getting us hooked and then say, now you have to pay $500 bucks a year to stay here.... What!? Noooo!?.... I'm joking I'm joking... I'm as grateful and delighted to find and use this site as everybody else. This won't interest you much but I read references to Facebook users, or ex users, and so on, and the truth is I have never used FB, I don't do Twitter, or other social media. I'm very technological and watch the impact of these media, but I don't do them. It's never been my thing. Nor chat sites, or anything similar. So to connect with this site, and the community, is really exceptional for me. It fills a gap that I hadn't realised I really wanted: reaching a group of non believers, to use a general term, and exchange about all manner of subjects. I'm really grateful for that. I try to be as tolerant as possible, even if people have very different views. If they really have those views, then I respect that, and take the issues on point. The only posters I have a problem with, and it's a small number, are those who post provocative things, whether they believe them or not, just to get a rise out of the group. Trolling, I guess. It's just pointless. Anyway, I just wanted to add these points.

Neoliberalism, how we got into this mess. [theguardian.com]

David1955 comments on Jan 11, 2018:

Excellent. This is the ideology that has contaminated and corrupted politics, economics, social policy for nearly 40 years. The worst of it is, the political parties on the left cannot free themselves from it and cling to its myths, and wonder why they are so unpopular. Putting on my historian hat, NL will be damned by the judgement of history. I have said before that this ideology has allowed a global weaponised capitalism to evolve, with all of the problems we can see every day.

What song would you want played for your funeral?

David1955 comments on Jan 11, 2018:

Well I have specified a Burt Lancaster funeral for me - that's one with no fuss. But, theoretically, the song I would have is George Harrison, ANY ROAD (WILL GET YOU THERE). "I keep travelling around the bend There is no beginning, there is no end It wasn't born and it never dies There are no edges, there is no sides Oh yeah, you just don't win It's so far out the way out is in Bow to God and call him sir And if you don't know where your going Any road will take you there." Case you wondering, George doesn't mean God, God, he means, well the whole big universe mystery thing. Oh and @HeyHiHullo I think they offed Mama Cass in London in 1974. She knew too much. Great singer.

I'm really liking this site.

David1955 comments on Jan 11, 2018:

Welcome. I don't suppose the magic crystals thing works with lottery tickets, does it? That would be great. :-)

Any one found love here?

David1955 comments on Jan 11, 2018:

I'd be happy just to make a good friend, so keeping the goals modest. But for the "young ones" (spoken in an old dude voice) I wish them every success.

If God was a real being, how would you see him as being?

David1955 comments on Jan 11, 2018:

Don't wish to be pedantic, but a God isn't a being, I don't think, otherwise it wouldn't be a God. So, whatever form it would take to appear before beings like us would be an assumed appearance for that purpose. So it wouldn't BE anything permanent that we might speculate on. It seems to me.

To combat "trolls and baiting", can we have a "dislike" button?

David1955 comments on Jan 11, 2018:

All I want to say is, if there is a "Dislike" button, I won't use it. If I like a post or comment a lot I indicate it, sometimes I add a comment. It's a conscious decision to do that. If I have an issue with a comment or post then I will add a comment to that effect. But I'm not going to go through ticking dislike and just that. A dislike should include a comment. So I won't use it. Others may have a different view, but that's mine. Thanks.

"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich." Napoleon Bonaparte LOL :-)

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

Channeling my inner Robespierre I wondering if this is another good reason to get rid of religion. No, well of course we all believe in peaceful change. Which is fine except we know from history that a lot progress in the human condition has come about through insurrection, revolution and struggle. Personally I don't think that's over.

Does religion interest you?

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

I think religion, as a construct, is a left over from our species childhood when we sought supernatural explanations for what we couldn't explain.. We should outgrow it. Some of the moral, ethical and philosophical issues that are included as part of religious discourse should be considered in a post religious reason based world. Many will think that idealistic. But I agree with Gene Roddenberry of Star Trek fame who said he thought the human species would only begin to achieve its potential if we had three things: a fair economic system; a fair social justice system; and finally a world where religion had been left behind.

Something that has been becoming more and more clear to me lately is that our society,the way we ...

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

Interesting. So it seems we're socially isolated, technologically dependant, economically and financially exploited, politically alienated, morally ambiguous, emotionally disconnected from family and society, psychologically stressed, perpetually fearful and scared, and chronically unfulfilled and unhappy. Actually, we are exactly where 21 Century capitalism wants us to be: isolated, marginalised and manipulable. And the irony is people with religions, despite pretensions, are no better off. Press and push them, and they're no more consoled than anyone else, certainly no more than non believers. It doesn't even give them that, anymore. That's why most of them never or seldom go to church.

Is religion necessary in the world?

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

First sentence answer: Better. Third sentence answer: No. Fourth sentence answer: Have you found any correlation between very religious countries and people kept "in line" I haven't. Fifth sentence answer: No, it's an unnecessary distraction.

What canceled T.V, shows you wish you knew the future of?

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

They cancelled DARK MATTER late last year, and I still haven't gotten over it. Signed every petition. Loved that show. Networks are the pits.

Do agnostics have common ground with these characteristics?

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

I prefer the more global term "progressives" rather than the American term "Liberals" but I know what you mean. I'd expect a backlash from some of the more conservative folk here though, including some Trump admirers, so be ready for that.

I've been a dedicated atheist for 9 years now.

David1955 comments on Jan 10, 2018:

It's very understandable to have such thoughts, being mortal beings. I wouldn't criticise anyone for hoping that. In my own case I prefer not to entertain such ideas because it makes me feel better. I like to remain rooted in reality.

What if you are wrong and there IS a god

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

What if theists are wrong and find there is a god but it's not their God? Oops. Well, when you choose one God from about 3,000 invented human gods, let's face it, the odds aren't good.

Why do guys like tits?

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

Harvey Weinstein hasn't join us, has he?

Are you an atheist, but believe in aliens (as in extraterrestrials)?

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

Despite my atheist credentials I see no reason why one cannot keep an open mind on this issue. Aliens are not gods or angels, but presumably beings or life form that might reach here. I do agree with the late great Carl Sagan that UFOism can be where science and religion intersect.He didn't mean that in a complimentary sense. He meant you have the impetus of religion, wondrous things coming down from above to be worshipped, and science meaning the universe. So the strictest application of evidence must apply, and please spare us the Steven Spielberg aliens crap. Some of the UFO people are far from crazies wearing aluminium hats to keep the Martian death rays of their head. They watch satellite feeds, and other sources carefully, are very well informed about events that might be misconstrued as aliens, look for explanations of things that are sighted, and use technology to closely examine material sent to them. My personal recommendation is Secure Team on YouTube. The guy impresses me with his work. He's heading towards 1.5 million subscribers. That's impressive.

Anyone else as surprised as I am that there are so many Atheist Republicans on here?

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

Interesting thread here. Without commenting on others, I can only say that I could never support a political party that is closely linked to fundamentalist religions and policies. Without attacking individuals I do think there is question to ask about how people reconcile their political views with their views on religion. One further point: I don't think I have read any supporter of the Republican Party say here that they support the policies of this party but reject it's close association with Christian extremists. Maybe I missed that. I

Whats the worst argument you have ever heard for the existence of god

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

I remember Richard Dawkins recounting an email from some drippy religionist who said of course God exists and evolution was nonsense because without His influence our heads wouldn't be on our shoulders but under our armpits. Yeah, I mean, you know...

Is religion detrimental to every day politics?

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

Religion is detrimental to everyday everything. It's a contaminant.

The Next Democratic Presidential Candidate?

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

I'm not an American, but he's really liked by progressives outside of the US. I love the guy.

Should you be fully able to defend your atheism/ agnosticism ?

David1955 comments on Jan 9, 2018:

I'll tell you what I think. From my experience religionists, in the face of confident, thoughtful atheists, retreat and withdraw as fast as their theological legs can carry them. There are exceptions. But espousing religionists are a bit like a virus: they look for weakness and exploit it. They will try to spread it if they find a weakened or vulnerable host. Confronted by direct very forward non believers they usually know better and demure. A couple of up-front arguments and they have somewhere else they need to be. See that with door knocking evangelists if you tell them straight. Mention a bit of history, theology, or an opinion about religious practise, and the discussion doesn't last long. I repeat, they look for vulnerable people. The analogy of religion as a virus is quite apt, in my view.

Is Agnostic.com a left wing echo chamber?

David1955 comments on Jan 8, 2018:

There is a certain type of poster here who likes to throw cats amongst the pigeons. Hence this question. I won't comment further on nihilism and Marxism; others have covered that false link, nothing to add. The political spectrum is covered here, I don't think any criticism can be made about a left wing chamber.

If we all met together in the real world, what would happen?

David1955 comments on Jan 8, 2018:

Interesting responses. I think it would very interesting, but I was wondering if you could all be trusted to behave at night. You would behave at night, wouldn't you? :-). @PeppermintDreads - you could only bring your dogs if they're atheist dogs. My favourite comment goes to @Varn - that we'd bicker but at a higher level. That's kind of how it is here.

The single most important thing you need to know about Trump.

David1955 comments on Jan 8, 2018:

Yes, I'm no psychologist, but I have always thought he was too. No one can lie like he does, without guilt or awareness, and not be one.