Does Objective Evidence for God Exist?

Toonman comments on Dec 12, 2021:

That is the biggest load of pseudointellectual buttfuckery I've read all day.

Fernapple replies on Dec 13, 2021:

Imagine such an argument used in another sphere of life, say a court of law. " I put it to the court. that the police and the prosecution have repeatedly stated that my client, shot the victim with a revolver. But my client tells me that he does not own a revolver, the device he owns is called a gun. I therefore put it to the court that my client is clearly innocent." I have very little respect for language, its rules or the view that language itself is a source of truth. But I do have more respect for it than to abuse it this much. Redefining words is commonplace and even respected among theists and apologists, more than anywhere else. Generally if you keep bad company, you acquire bad habits.

Does Objective Evidence for God Exist?

hankster comments on Dec 12, 2021:

maybe the question is, " Is there any evidence of evidence for gods existence?"

Fernapple replies on Dec 13, 2021:

@racocn8 It is just animism writ large. The ancient. "Because we can not fully explain where rain comes from, therefore some thinking agent must cause it." Becomes. "Because we can not fully explain all the laws of the universe, therefore god." What is worth taking from this, is a reminder that arguments like this, based on little more than redefining words are commonplace and even respected among theists and apologists, more than anywhere else. ( Perhaps they do not have any good arguments.) So much so that they become almost the accepted norm, in such circles. Which should be enough to warn anyone about the corrosive effect, that theism and apologetics have on the human character, and how destructive to the higher human qualities such as honesty, empathy, and self respect, that even slight contact with religion and apologetics have. If you keep bad company you will acquire bad habits.

Does Objective Evidence for God Exist?

David1955 comments on Dec 12, 2021:

These ideas are where the new age idea of God is the 'universe and everything' has come from. As a result God means everything and nothing. Since the universe exists it then becomes a cheap trick to avoid the question of evidence for God. In the end it's word play.

Fernapple replies on Dec 13, 2021:

If you use god to mean nature, then what word do you use when you mean god ? You start having to qualify every statement with words like "the christian" god or the "theist" god. I intend to start calling my bicycle my car, then if I need to I shall refer to my car as, my big four wheeled car, and my bike as, my small two wheeled car, that should improve understanding. What is worth taking from this, is a reminder that arguments like this one, based on little more than redefining words are commonplace and even respected among theists and apologists, more than anywhere else. ( Perhaps they do not have any good arguments.) So much so that they become almost the accepted norm, in such circles. Which should be enough to warn anyone about the corrosive effect, that theism and apologetics have on the human character, and how destructive to the higher human qualities such as honesty, empathy, and self respect, that even slight contact with religion and apologetics have. If you keep bad company you will acquire bad habits.

My father died at Christmas at age 51.

Fernapple comments on Dec 12, 2021:

That sounds like a wonderful father daughter relationship. You were very lucky. A good relationship like that at the outset, lights up a whole life.

Fernapple replies on Dec 13, 2021:

@LiterateHiker I understand. I had a similar relationship with my mother, though she was not alcholic, just a completely toxic person, who saw belittling others, not merely her son, as her main occupation in life. The one thing that I learned from her therefore, was just how destructive that can be, not just to those you attack but to your own life as well.

Evolution only responds to the current situation, it has no foresight.

skado comments on Dec 12, 2021:

Almost true. "We are therefore most likely completely ill adapted to the new world in which we now live." Not "completely". Substantially. Substantially enough to put us in danger of extinction if we don't use that brain to modify our behavior culturally, which is our uniquely human ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

That is perfectly true. Substantially would be far better. And this is why it is so important to teach critical thinking skills, and turn our backs on old corrupt institutions such as theism. Though that will probably happen anyway by the normal actions of history, it is just a question of soon enough and completely enough.

Seems to me that in the opinion of many on this board, women have Bodily Autonomy when it comes to ...

FearlessFly comments on Dec 11, 2021:

"my body, my choice" does NOT apply to selling your organs . . .

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

@TheMiddleWay If you are comparing apples and oranges the you will discover nuance. It is equating them that is foolish.

Evolution only responds to the current situation, it has no foresight.

hankster comments on Dec 12, 2021:

"we have no defenses against fiction, we are made to be deceived used and manipulated, by anyone with a voice." to consider - seems to me like we have plenty of "fiction defenses". Yet, as vulnerable as we can be in some circumstances, (immaturity, pride for ex.) we are also very capable of ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

Yes we do have defences, but of course we have to learn those. In the context, having "no defenses" I intend to mean only inherited instinctive defenses.

Seems to me that in the opinion of many on this board, women have Bodily Autonomy when it comes to ...

FearlessFly comments on Dec 11, 2021:

"my body, my choice" does NOT apply to selling your organs . . .

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

@TheMiddleWay Understanding comes from putting the hard work in and continuing to do so. Absolutes and simplicity are the fruits of laziness, and their product inhumanity, while wisdom is mainly to be found in nuance. Albert Maysles said, “Tyranny is the deliberate removal of nuance.”

How true is it that religion has done more harm than good in the world ?

anglophone comments on Dec 11, 2021:

Religion does no more harm than the equations of quantum mechanics. People who claim to be religious do both good things and harmful things in the name of their religion. It is helpful to think analytically about such matters.

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

That is true in the same sense that the argument used by the gun lobby is true. That. "Guns never killed anybody, it is people who shoot people." But just as, the usual reply to that is to point out that. "If you want to kill a lot of people, then it is a lot easier with a machine gun than a club. Which is why most mass murders don't carry clubs." So it is also true that while religion never did any harm, it does put a powerful weapon in the hands of those who would do harm, giving them both the means to recruit otheres, and a way to justify the harm they wish to cause. It is generally not too hard to justify good ideas to people, because they can usually see the benefits for themselves. But if you want to sell a really bad idea, which hurts and endangers people, or promotes pointless hate, for that you need a really good source of fake authority, like the word of a god to help you promote it.

As requested I will post this one.

MikeInBatonRouge comments on Dec 11, 2021:

I'll celebrate that! P**s off Xtians, and Make the Yul'tide gay!!! http://gayinfluence.blogspot.com/2012/08/yul-brynner.html?m=1

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

Enjoy.

As requested I will post this one.

Triphid comments on Dec 11, 2021:

Well now you have given me a great idea. I will get some 'white-out' and erase the crappy Merry Xmas message in every card, replace it with " Have a Warm and Loving Yule, then post as many as possible to every Godster in town and sign them " from Ulrik Neingott."

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

Good idea. Though you can buy none religious cards from the Humanists association here in the UK, you may be able to as well.

As requested I will post this one.

DenoPenno comments on Dec 11, 2021:

As a single person these days I have nothing to celebrate. As one former gf told me once I could buy myself a present, put it under the tree, and pretend I did not know what tit was until I opened it. No thanks. I'm OK.

Fernapple replies on Dec 12, 2021:

The great thing about living alone is that you can do just what you like all year.

As requested I will post this one.

Tejas comments on Dec 11, 2021:

I mean Hinduism is older than it by at least a thousand years

Fernapple replies on Dec 11, 2021:

@Gwendolyn2018 Sorry I perhaps have a more positive view of Tejases conmment than that, I think that he was just adding a little nuance. But please both of you, don't foget that I posted this under Silly Random and Fun.

As requested I will post this one.

Tejas comments on Dec 11, 2021:

I mean Hinduism is older than it by at least a thousand years

Fernapple replies on Dec 11, 2021:

Yes. I meant the mid winter celebration in general, rather than the North European specifically, though I used that name. But ten out of ten credit to you for raising an interesting point.

Seems to me that in the opinion of many on this board, women have Bodily Autonomy when it comes to ...

FearlessFly comments on Dec 11, 2021:

"my body, my choice" does NOT apply to selling your organs . . .

Fernapple replies on Dec 11, 2021:

@TheMiddleWay It is a stupidly crude slogan, each issue needs to be addressed on its own, you can not compare any two different issues, whether it be selling organs or prostitution. Abortion or vaccine.

As requested I will post this one.

Aaron70 comments on Dec 11, 2021:

Yule burn in hell for that mister....😁

Fernapple replies on Dec 11, 2021:

Always preffered it warm. LOL

As requested I will post this one.

Killtheskyfairy comments on Dec 11, 2021:

Isn’t pissed off their natural state?

Fernapple replies on Dec 11, 2021:

Yes but "really pissed off", is a whole notch higher. LOL

It is the proud boast of women...

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 8, 2021:

Incorrect There are even more if you include the 15 deleted books from the RC Bible, however Esther, Ruth, Deborah, Huldah, Hannah, Sarah, Hagar, Miriam, Anna all recognised as prophets in the KJV Christian bible all are quoted directly as passing on the word of god.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

@snytiger6, @LenHazell53 Yes, but the question is not whether they existed or not, but whether they were the inventions of men or not.

It is the proud boast of women...

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 8, 2021:

Incorrect There are even more if you include the 15 deleted books from the RC Bible, however Esther, Ruth, Deborah, Huldah, Hannah, Sarah, Hagar, Miriam, Anna all recognised as prophets in the KJV Christian bible all are quoted directly as passing on the word of god.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

@snytiger6 Yes, but Ruth though is so clearly a mans, and a highly misogenystic mans creation, it is the one book in the bible which certainly could not have been written by a woman..

Did Art and Religion co-evolve? [agnostic.com] .

hankster comments on Dec 8, 2021:

no. The concept of evolution involves chance and a random nature to its development. whereas religions and art are fabrications with intentions, with plans, in their development. Surely these intentions overlapped in thier purposes and development on occasion, but by design.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

@hankster Thank you for the interesting eymology. Perhaps I should have said that the earlier usage of evolution, I was talking about was purely the scientific usage. As for what skado may say, he has already said it to me, I am quoting to preempt an uncontroled input.

Did Art and Religion co-evolve? [youtu.be] .

Fernapple comments on Dec 8, 2021:

Of course they are the same thing anyway.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

@skado I don't argue with the anthropologists, indeed the anthropologist ( in a broad sense of the word anthropologists ) in the video exactly present that view.

It is the proud boast of women...

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 8, 2021:

Incorrect There are even more if you include the 15 deleted books from the RC Bible, however Esther, Ruth, Deborah, Huldah, Hannah, Sarah, Hagar, Miriam, Anna all recognised as prophets in the KJV Christian bible all are quoted directly as passing on the word of god.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

Yes except that most of the things atributed to those female "prophets," were probably made up, or edited by males. While some of them like Ruth, probably never existed outside of male imaginations.

Did Art and Religion co-evolve? [agnostic.com] .

hankster comments on Dec 8, 2021:

no. The concept of evolution involves chance and a random nature to its development. whereas religions and art are fabrications with intentions, with plans, in their development. Surely these intentions overlapped in thier purposes and development on occasion, but by design.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

You are quite right. A situation "evolved", in which both art and religion became possible and/or needed. From that, the cultural developments that we call art and religion began to be made. People are sometimes too loose in their use of the word evolution. In fact art and religion are are just two features of the phenomena we call culture, and are inseparable parts of that whole. ( Though skado would like to tell you that the word "religion", was originally used by the ancient Romans as a synonym, for our word "culture". Which makes it seem that he has already answered his own question. ) The word evolution originally meant, what we would call embryonic development, and only came to mean change to species genomes at around the time of Darwin. ( More loose usage, though in that case with some justification because there was no existing word. ) A good lesson in why human culture is an untrust worthy source of truth, when even its basic units, words, shift meanings and usages endlessly like quicksand.

Can you spot both bobcats photographed in Wisconsin forest?

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

No. Though I did think that I could see one, so there may be three.

Fernapple replies on Dec 9, 2021:

@dalefvictor Yes that was the one I think I can see.

Did Art and Religion co-evolve? [youtu.be] .

Fernapple comments on Dec 8, 2021:

Of course they are the same thing anyway.

Fernapple replies on Dec 8, 2021:

@skado Religion is the use of artistry to indoctrinate, and the belief that art is always a source of truth, is a religious dogma.

SOME MORE NEWS - Simple, Obvious Solutions To Glaring Problems [youtube.com]

Fernapple comments on Dec 8, 2021:

Sadly the British post office which has long had a bank, is now trying to move out of banking services, because with current low interest rates there is little profit in it. This is thanks to M. Thatcher who, "privatized" ( sold it to capitalists) our post office, leaving us as just about the only ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 8, 2021:

@phxbillcee Yep that is what happened here, they just kept the profitable bits and ditched all the public service bits.

OK.

KateOahu comments on Dec 7, 2021:

There is a similar, less elaborate, place in Malta called “Domvs Romana”. It is on the island of Malta, near Rabat. https://www.corinthia.com/palace-hotel-and-spa/discover-malta/ten-incredible-ancient-sites-in-malta/ I also recommend seeing the rest of the sites at the link, if they are ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 8, 2021:

@MsKathleen Much less common in Europe, we have a few but not as many.

OK.

KateOahu comments on Dec 7, 2021:

There is a similar, less elaborate, place in Malta called “Domvs Romana”. It is on the island of Malta, near Rabat. https://www.corinthia.com/palace-hotel-and-spa/discover-malta/ten-incredible-ancient-sites-in-malta/ I also recommend seeing the rest of the sites at the link, if they are ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 8, 2021:

@MsKathleen Well we do only get one chance to see all the wonders of this beautiful planet.

OK.

KateOahu comments on Dec 7, 2021:

There is a similar, less elaborate, place in Malta called “Domvs Romana”. It is on the island of Malta, near Rabat. https://www.corinthia.com/palace-hotel-and-spa/discover-malta/ten-incredible-ancient-sites-in-malta/ I also recommend seeing the rest of the sites at the link, if they are ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

That is lovely. I visited the habour site in Paphos, Cyprus some years ago and took these. The ruins of the old palace are in a spectacular site, on a rocky headland only yards from the waves.

Seems to me that in the opinion of many on this board, women have Bodily Autonomy when it comes to ...

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

Thats very easy, first of all that is a strawman statement about the people on here. Because lambasting someone for making a choice, is not the same thing as saying that they should not have a choice. I for one would defend anyones right to refuse any medical procedure, even at the cost of my, ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@TheMiddleWay The John Lydgate quote did not appear until after I made my last reply. The quote I was refering to in two, was. "Pro-vaccine" does not mean forced vaccination." The risks of abortion are not relevant, since my whole point was that the anology between abortion and vaccines is not a vallid one anyway. The point of the petrol tank mataphore, which is a common one, is that the child does not know that the tank is empty before hand. That is so obvious I hardly though it worth going into detail on. Sorry you clearly are drunk, and I am not going to waste any more time.

Seems to me that in the opinion of many on this board, women have Bodily Autonomy when it comes to ...

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

Thats very easy, first of all that is a strawman statement about the people on here. Because lambasting someone for making a choice, is not the same thing as saying that they should not have a choice. I for one would defend anyones right to refuse any medical procedure, even at the cost of my, ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@TheMiddleWay One. The "should" was intended, may be you missed the "not" before it. Please read carefully. Two. I don't know who you are quoting, but it is not me. Are you drunk ? Three. By that argument. Strictly speaking, the mere status of driving far too fast in your car does not affect anyone else either. The mere status of being the errector dangerous buildings, does not affect anyone else either. etc. But it is an effect to create risk, even if the risk does not cause direct immeadiate harm. The. "Nobody got hurt when I dropped lighted matches into the gas tank, because there was no petrol in there after all." Is a six year old absolutists argument.

Seems to me that in the opinion of many on this board, women have Bodily Autonomy when it comes to ...

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

Thats very easy, first of all that is a strawman statement about the people on here. Because lambasting someone for making a choice, is not the same thing as saying that they should not have a choice. I for one would defend anyones right to refuse any medical procedure, even at the cost of my, ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@TheMiddleWay Yes but your question on abortion yesterday was a really challenging one, which made real demands on thinking. This is not in the same league. Sorry.

I was talking with two Mormon missionaries this weekend.

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

Reduces to one question. Dear believer. Have you ever thought of asking questions ?

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@PeterL No best not waste your time, one question at a time is usually all they can manage to reject answering at any one time. Snowball them and they will just blue screen.

They say the most solemn occasion is coming. So let's think about the holy place.

ASTRALMAX comments on Dec 7, 2021:

I do not think that it is a question of throwing money at child poverty because to date it has not solved what is clearly an ongoing issue. There seems to be vested interests in keeping the population poor in some countries. Vested interests that are fuelled by unfettered greed of the leaders of ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

True a lot of that happens, and most of the motivation is about public image. But the Catholic Church is an exception to that, because of course it has its own infrastructure which is down on the ground already, so that it could, if it wished, deliver aid directly where it is needed, as it does some, but only just enough to keep up that public image again, no more.

Sometimes even a house can tell stories. [youtube.com]

phxbillcee comments on Dec 7, 2021:

I wish there was more to it, but still...

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

There may be more to follow. Watch this space.

“Your destiny is not determined by an outside force, it’s determined by YOU, and you ...

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

Nah.

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@Marionville Yes you can choose to change course when the accidents happen, but then you had to, and you may not be given a choice. And the chances are that if you do make another choice, then that too will be redirected by fate. I did not choose to to not marry until I was nearly forty, but a cancer cell chose that fate for me, and my loved one, and I did not then choose to become a widow at forty three, but another cancer cell decided that for me and took my wife. I chose to be a garden designer and landscaper, but an offer too hard to refuse from a property developer, made me a contractor in the property industry. I did not choose to have to move back in with my parents in my late forties, but the property crash in the eighties sent the developement company bankrupt, and I needed land to start a plant nursery and our married home had none, so I became a nurseryman.

“Your destiny is not determined by an outside force, it’s determined by YOU, and you ...

Fernapple comments on Dec 7, 2021:

Nah.

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@Marionville Yes but the parameters are by far the most important thing. And even if you try within your parameters, the next most important thing is random noise. You can plan to restore a vintage car today, and while you are out buying the tools tommorow, a perfectly modern car can run you over and kill you. Life is a long list of random accidents which always change your path, all the more so if you are adventurus and brave, only the dull and weak end their lives doing what they set out to do. And even that is rare.

This is quite an odd thing I think.

Fernapple comments on Nov 30, 2021:

I am pleased to say that I can not remember when I last prayed.

Fernapple replies on Dec 7, 2021:

@SirDaddyGru Yes. Although there are some stats about it. I have read that in hospitals, if critically ill patients are told they are being prayed for, they actually have a slightly worse chance of recovery, it is only a tiny difference but real. So prayer may make things worse. The reason it is thought being, that patients who are told they are being prayed for become depressed because they believe that proves their condition is worse and more desparate.

Another vision of the future.

Barnie2years comments on Dec 6, 2021:

Pandemics have surfaced regularly and periodically throughout history. It occurs in nature very often when certain species are overpopulated. It certainly stands to reason that humans are just another animal and subject to the same laws of nature, even if we have the intelligence to mollify the ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 6, 2021:

It may be so. Though I am told that it is perfectly possible to create a mathematical model, of a virus for example, which is just infectious enough, mutates fast enough and kills slowly enough that it could exterminate everyone.

WARNING: GROANER AHEAD; What did the peanut butter say to the blackberry at the Christmas party?

Fernapple comments on Dec 6, 2021:

No, this must stop. Just pause to consider for a moment. Whatever would your grandmother think, if she knew what you have been doing on line ?

Fernapple replies on Dec 6, 2021:

@Sierra4 Oh, thanks. lol

Can you interpret these pictograms?

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 2, 2021:

1 Sandin' (sanding) block 2 Man overboard 3 I Understand 4 Reading Between the lines 5 Long Underwear 6 Crossroads 7 Down Town 8 Tricycle 9 Split Level 10 Three degrees below Zero 11 Neon Lights 12 Circles under the eyes 13 Big Chair 14 Double dice 15 Touch down 16 five feet ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 6, 2021:

@TheoryNumber3 Oh I would love that, though I think there is a group on unusual words.

Soo how many days to Christmas and does anyone care?

Fernapple comments on Dec 5, 2021:

Yes I do care. Christmas is a boring, time wasting little fart of a pointless holiday, when everything is dead including the transport, there is nowhere you can go to escape all the bad taste anyway, and people try to make you overeat until you feel ill, and the complain at you if you don't. I ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 6, 2021:

@Secretguy Oh, my normal existence is great fun, its just christmas that interupts it.

Nothing divine about gods

FearlessFly comments on Dec 5, 2021:

How does 3000 BCE to 2021 CE add-up to 8000 years ?

Fernapple replies on Dec 5, 2021:

You lost me, who mentioned 8000 years ?

Atheists are viewed as less desirable romantic partners, study finds

Killtheskyfairy comments on Dec 5, 2021:

I can’t love this enough. Great news! The religious will me alone then? I am thrilled! I make no secret of my atheism and complete disgust with the religious but now I’ll step it up a notch or two. I was told by a former boyfriend that men like religious women because most of them are ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 5, 2021:

Yes, if she is religious, it is very easy to say I love you for your faith and closeness to god, and by definition she will believe anything. lol

Nothing divine about gods

Beowulfsfriend comments on Dec 5, 2021:

Isn't it amazing how "the god" (insert name(s) here) waited so patiently for mankind to get into bigger groups before showing up. Proof that god(s) want to be involved in government and governing the masses.

Fernapple replies on Dec 5, 2021:

@hankster Not so sure. Most hunter gatherer societies have, and probably always had, religions based on combinations of animism, spiritualism, worship of the dead, and magic. Gods as such, only start to appear as nation states and city states start to form, they come quite late onto the scene really. That is not an absolute but the general case.

Can you interpret these pictograms?

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 2, 2021:

1 Sandin' (sanding) block 2 Man overboard 3 I Understand 4 Reading Between the lines 5 Long Underwear 6 Crossroads 7 Down Town 8 Tricycle 9 Split Level 10 Three degrees below Zero 11 Neon Lights 12 Circles under the eyes 13 Big Chair 14 Double dice 15 Touch down 16 five feet ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 5, 2021:

@TheoryNumber3 Yes, funny term, I don't know if you use it in America as we do in Britain, to mean none decimal fractions. Its one of those terms like "homework" that you never hear again after you leave school. That sort of usage of vulgar, to mean normal/ordinary rather than rude, is perhaps more common to hear among gardeners and botanists, where vulgar and the latin vulgaris are common plant names.

A lady married her husband's brother after she became a widow.

Fernapple comments on Dec 3, 2021:

I think that it is illegal under Christian law. It seems that the creator god was so confused about genetics, he thought that it counted as incest. How can you design DNA and then get something like that wrong ?

Fernapple replies on Dec 4, 2021:

@AnneWimsey, @Lorajay Here you go, I looked up the actual biblical law, and it is plain that marriage between some "in laws" is forbiden. The incestuous unions prohibited in the Law (some were legitimate at an earlier age in Israel) are those of son and mother, of a man with the wife of his father (Lv 18.8; Dt 27.20) and with the mother of his wife (Dt 27.23), of a man with his granddaughter or his wife's daughter or granddaughter (Lv 18.10, 17), of a man with his sister or half-sister (Lv 18.9; Dt 27.22; see, however, Gn 20.12), of a nephew with his aunt (Lv 18.12–14; cf. Ex 6.20), of a man with his daughter-in-law or with his sister-in-law (Lv 18.15, 16; 20.21); levirate marriage is an exception (Dt 25.5–10). Also forbidden was marriage to two sisters at the same time (Lv 18.18), although formerly it had been allowed (Gn 29.27–28). Penalties for incest were death (Lv 20.11–17), excommunication (Lv 18.29), and being cursed (Dt 27.20, 22–23), e.g., by being childless (Lv 20.21)...

A lady married her husband's brother after she became a widow.

Fernapple comments on Dec 3, 2021:

I think that it is illegal under Christian law. It seems that the creator god was so confused about genetics, he thought that it counted as incest. How can you design DNA and then get something like that wrong ?

Fernapple replies on Dec 4, 2021:

@AnneWimsey Here you go, I looked up the actual biblical law, and it is plain that marriage between some "in laws" is forbiden. The incestuous unions prohibited in the Law (some were legitimate at an earlier age in Israel) are those of son and mother, of a man with the wife of his father (Lv 18.8; Dt 27.20) and with the mother of his wife (Dt 27.23), of a man with his granddaughter or his wife's daughter or granddaughter (Lv 18.10, 17), of a man with his sister or half-sister (Lv 18.9; Dt 27.22; see, however, Gn 20.12), of a nephew with his aunt (Lv 18.12–14; cf. Ex 6.20), of a man with his daughter-in-law or with his sister-in-law (Lv 18.15, 16; 20.21); levirate marriage is an exception (Dt 25.5–10). Also forbidden was marriage to two sisters at the same time (Lv 18.18), although formerly it had been allowed (Gn 29.27–28). Penalties for incest were death (Lv 20.11–17), excommunication (Lv 18.29), and being cursed (Dt 27.20, 22–23), e.g., by being childless (Lv 20.21).

A voice from Atheist Ireland.

Fernapple comments on Dec 3, 2021:

Well that was a short video. LOL

Fernapple replies on Dec 3, 2021:

@twill Also agreed. LOL

Can you interpret these pictograms?

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 2, 2021:

1 Sandin' (sanding) block 2 Man overboard 3 I Understand 4 Reading Between the lines 5 Long Underwear 6 Crossroads 7 Down Town 8 Tricycle 9 Split Level 10 Three degrees below Zero 11 Neon Lights 12 Circles under the eyes 13 Big Chair 14 Double dice 15 Touch down 16 five feet ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 3, 2021:

@TheoryNumber3 Yes though the / or forward slash, is often used as a sub for the horizontal line in vulgar fractions, so I thought that "over himself" was a better bet on the original.

Can you interpret these pictograms?

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 2, 2021:

1 Sandin' (sanding) block 2 Man overboard 3 I Understand 4 Reading Between the lines 5 Long Underwear 6 Crossroads 7 Down Town 8 Tricycle 9 Split Level 10 Three degrees below Zero 11 Neon Lights 12 Circles under the eyes 13 Big Chair 14 Double dice 15 Touch down 16 five feet ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 3, 2021:

@MsKathleen Yes I only got that one after a prompt.

Who would have thought cells are sooo complicated.

Fernapple comments on Dec 2, 2021:

False colours of course, but does it say what part of the body the cell came from ?

Fernapple replies on Dec 3, 2021:

@JackPedigo Beautiful work of art though.

Can you interpret these pictograms?

LenHazell53 comments on Dec 2, 2021:

1 Sandin' (sanding) block 2 Man overboard 3 I Understand 4 Reading Between the lines 5 Long Underwear 6 Crossroads 7 Down Town 8 Tricycle 9 Split Level 10 Three degrees below Zero 11 Neon Lights 12 Circles under the eyes 13 Big Chair 14 Double dice 15 Touch down 16 five feet ...

Fernapple replies on Dec 3, 2021:

Love 19 Glance in the mirror, did not get that one, but I got 18 as He's over himself, rather than "beside". And Fearlessfly below has 23 as "See through blouse".

Watch: Far-right anti-vaxx pastor just can’t understand why there are no ‘big democrats’ who ...

WayneDalton comments on Dec 2, 2021:

Is he seriously that clueless?

Fernapple replies on Dec 3, 2021:

Or does he just think his paying audience are that clueless ?

I’m thinking about writing some music for the Christian market.

Fernapple comments on Dec 2, 2021:

I think your gift is for writing memes for atheists, I would stick to that.

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

@mischl Only in very strange Christian circles. LOL

Got our first snow this week, on the cottages across the road and in the field behind.

JackPedigo comments on Dec 2, 2021:

Wow, a good amount. So far we have not even had a freeze. What is your latitude?

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

53.5 about the same as Labrador Canada, though the maritime clime means we are a lot milder, just dark gloomy and wet.

Got our first snow this week, on the cottages across the road and in the field behind.

glennlab comments on Dec 2, 2021:

It's nice to look at, but just the thought of the cold that comes with it makes my bones hurt.

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

Me too, and there are months yet to go. I really think that warmth and sun, are the most important things in life.

What IS your problem?!

Fernapple comments on Mar 27, 2021:

The secret of life and happiness is appreciation. The truly happy are those who can value the things they have seen before.

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

@LadyLinK No not really, the person who appreciates little or nothing will be unhappy, even in a palace garden surrounded by lovers, the person who can appreciate many things will find happiness alone on the barest desert island.

Got our first snow this week, on the cottages across the road and in the field behind.

RussRAB comments on Dec 2, 2021:

Today's forecasted high here where I live is 77 degrees F. I have rose buds about ready to open.

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

Envy.

Ants vomit into each other's mouths to form social bonds: [livescience.com]

KateOahu comments on Dec 1, 2021:

Ew.

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

So do bees. Then we harvest their collective vomit and spread it on slices of bread for breakfast....

We're losing a whole generation of young men to video games.

Moravian comments on Dec 2, 2021:

I don't know who first coined the phrase "virtual reality" but it is so far removed from reality that it is laughable.

Fernapple replies on Dec 2, 2021:

Yes, just like "reality TV " though unlike that it is slightly qualified by the word "virtual".

How Sex Workers Operate in the Mormon Capital of the World | Hemant Mehta | Friendly Atheist | ...

AnneWimsey comments on Nov 30, 2021:

And why couldn't a sex worker attend church? Mary Magdalene?

Fernapple replies on Dec 1, 2021:

@AnneWimsey Very true, and I was working on the idea, that you were using her as an archetype. But thought I would add my boring two pence worth for the benefit of others who may be reading, and interests sake if you are having a dull day.

One Way We Can Know That God Exists

barjoe comments on Nov 30, 2021:

The invisible man

Fernapple replies on Dec 1, 2021:

@David1955 That sums it well.

How Sex Workers Operate in the Mormon Capital of the World | Hemant Mehta | Friendly Atheist | ...

AnneWimsey comments on Nov 30, 2021:

And why couldn't a sex worker attend church? Mary Magdalene?

Fernapple replies on Dec 1, 2021:

@AnneWimsey True. But I am not saying that there was no evidence she was not a sex worker, only that the evidence that she was, as with all else we think we know about her, is almost certainly fake. The bible itself actually tells us litttle or nothing about her, and the legends about her later life, are just legends. As to how she supported herself we simply don't know, she could have been living with her family, we don't even know that she was single, she could have been married, some people even think that she was the wife of Jesus, the fact is, we don't really know if she even existed. The common assumption that she was a sex worker, is just a proof of how deeply the churches unsupported, and often late, assumptions, are bedded into our culture. Like the widely held beliefs that there were only four gospels, or that the Magi were kings, none of it supported, even by the highly doubtful biblical accounts.

How Sex Workers Operate in the Mormon Capital of the World | Hemant Mehta | Friendly Atheist | ...

AnneWimsey comments on Nov 30, 2021:

And why couldn't a sex worker attend church? Mary Magdalene?

Fernapple replies on Nov 30, 2021:

Agree with your statement. But there is actually no good reason to believe that M.M. was a sex worker. That idea did not take shape until the middle ages, and was probably created by church leaders as part of a campaign to belittle the contribution made by women in the early church, making M.M. a forgiven sinner rather than an early witness, and even equating her with the woman taken in adultery. Which is another story invented at about the same time, being probably the last major addition to the bible not found in any early versions.

What were you thankful for this Thanksgiving?

Fernapple comments on Nov 29, 2021:

Happy you are safe and well after your drive. But you should go more slowly in the wet, especially as you get more mature. Some people, like my father, never get that, and the older he got, the faster he went, it was terrifying. Your reactions and skills do go down with age even if you do not notice...

Fernapple replies on Nov 29, 2021:

@Paganlyl I am giving driving instruction, not to be hostile, but because having been on this site for a long while, it would concern me deeply if something unfortunate were to happen to Literate.

What were you thankful for this Thanksgiving?

Fernapple comments on Nov 29, 2021:

Happy you are safe and well after your drive. But you should go more slowly in the wet, especially as you get more mature. Some people, like my father, never get that, and the older he got, the faster he went, it was terrifying. Your reactions and skills do go down with age even if you do not notice...

Fernapple replies on Nov 29, 2021:

@LiterateHiker Well then you should have slowed more. You don't hydroplane at a crawl.

They say Satan is god's son. What kind of DNA does this serial killing "invisible man" god have?

David1955 comments on Nov 28, 2021:

Son? I thought he was a 'fallen angel'? Isn't that the mythology? Not that I care at all.

Fernapple replies on Nov 29, 2021:

The Bible actually has very little to say about Satan or his origins, he just sort of developed bit by bit as it went on. Indeed, in the first place he may just be, like much of the bible, a mistranslation, since the earliest references are to "a satan", in other words a member of a class of angels called satans, because the word means roughly, "advocates for the prosecution". And there is nothing in the bible which says he was not a good servant, since he, or they, carry out gods commands perfectly, the idea of a rebel angel and of hell, only seem to develop later in Roman Catholic/Orthodox theology long after biblical times.

So none of us believe we have a creator but anyone have ideas away from evolution as well?

Fernapple comments on Nov 27, 2021:

Things are either made by a creator, or by a natural process. There is no third alternative, it either involved intelligence in its making or it did not. Even if you believe in the universe as an illusion, extreme solipsism, (Or the matrix if you like. ) an agent, either a natural process or and ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 28, 2021:

@Word We can not see anything, that is the point.

So none of us believe we have a creator but anyone have ideas away from evolution as well?

Fernapple comments on Nov 27, 2021:

Things are either made by a creator, or by a natural process. There is no third alternative, it either involved intelligence in its making or it did not. Even if you believe in the universe as an illusion, extreme solipsism, (Or the matrix if you like. ) an agent, either a natural process or and ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 28, 2021:

@Word No I think that the term "directed evolution" as normally used, refers to an external probably supernatural intelligence. Though it is certainly true that intelligence and genetic evolution, will probably have effects on one another in naturally occuring feed back loops, but that is not included in the normal , or my in this case, definition of "directed evolution".

From some not fun facts : Dogs like squeaky toys because it mimics the sound of their dying ...

KateOahu comments on Nov 26, 2021:

Is any of this true?

Fernapple replies on Nov 27, 2021:

In the UK it was, and probably still is quite legal to mail people, a couple of people, including a feminist activist, tried to get to see the prime minister by mailing themselve to him. Hitler was nominated for the Nobel prize, the peace prize no less, in 1939, by a Swedish polititian, but keep in mind that that is only nominated, not awarded.

What happens if you are sent on a very different path by evolution.

Diaco comments on Nov 26, 2021:

Such a cute creature! 😍

Fernapple replies on Nov 26, 2021:

Yep. I thought so too.

Happy Thanksgiving Everybody! We have a lot to be thankful for.

Fernapple comments on Nov 25, 2021:

Most of the positive stuff on the site is in the groups, it is true, the front page tends to be news and views, which are rarely positive. But today was a bright winters day and I had friends over for a game of petangue, then we had mince pies and wine afterwards. That was positive, but sadly ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 25, 2021:

@Storm1752 French form of bowls.

I get the feeling, increasingly, that Christianity, especially evangelical, is a death cult.

David1955 comments on Nov 24, 2021:

Christianity has always been a death cult -- a Bronze Age messianic, apocalyptic, dead and rising God death cult. Evangelical Christianity is merely a loop back to this religion's fundamental regressive themes, combining with reactionary conservatism, in contrast with and in reaction to the ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 25, 2021:

Religion provides the means to justify, the things like ultra conservatism, which you can not justify by logic and evidence. That is the main reason for it appeal.

“I can’t give you a sure-fire formula for success, but I can give you a formula for failure:...

Fernapple comments on Nov 24, 2021:

Yes but it is a challenge.

Fernapple replies on Nov 24, 2021:

@Pralina1 Thank you for your faith in me.

Police misidentifying drivers’ ethnicity when writing tickets, to avoid the appearance of racial ...

Fernapple comments on Nov 24, 2021:

Why is it even required on a ticket, we do not do descriptions of the driver in the UK ?

Fernapple replies on Nov 24, 2021:

@Matias Yes, lets hope it fails to catch on though.

Now is the time to buy your delight?

Fernapple comments on Nov 24, 2021:

Just what you need in charge of the economy, someone who relies on prayers to keep the currency afloat.

Fernapple replies on Nov 24, 2021:

@FrayedBear You know me so well. LOL

“I can’t give you a sure-fire formula for success, but I can give you a formula for failure:...

Fernapple comments on Nov 24, 2021:

Yes but it is a challenge.

Fernapple replies on Nov 24, 2021:

@Marionville Yes I know. The problem resonates with me just now. I help to run the village sports club. (By default because I never was much of a sportsman, just doing it for the community. ) Two of the prominant members have had a falling out, which will not be good for the club as a whole. They are both in their own way really good and well intentioned men, who work hard for the club, so I am forced to try and think of ways to patch things up and smooth things over. I know that it is almost impossible, and that there is a real danger of getting it wrong and making things worse, but do I have a choice. I think not. Best just rise to the challenge, and take the storms on the nose, I think.

Do you think retro-style is returning back?

Willow_Wisp comments on Nov 23, 2021:

Styles never go away, they just get ignored until someone decides to bring it back because it works for them. For example Betty Page resurrecting the Cleopatra hair style. Betty owned it like Johnny Cash owned Hurt by Nine Inch Nails. Few women could ever pull it off, but it was totally Betty. Rap ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 24, 2021:

Oh I would love to be in one of those, "funny Walmart people photos." Its near the top of my bucket list.

Deep sigh! Autumn Window - Alexander Volkov

KateOahu comments on Nov 23, 2021:

I looked him up. He has a number of lovely windows. https://www.alexandervolkovfineart.com/portfolio/regular-limited-editions/

Fernapple replies on Nov 24, 2021:

Lovely paintings. Thank you for posting about him.

Religion IQ?

Fernapple comments on Nov 23, 2021:

Is an IQ rating a good measure of real world working intelligence anyway ? In my opinion no. Real world working intelligence includes many qualities which go far beyond pencil and paper puzzle solving, such as setting high standards of truth, caring enough not to accept second rate answers, not ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 23, 2021:

@MsKathleen Yes that is probably true, although the only IQ test that I am familiar with, is that of MENSA which deliberately avoides knowledge based questions for that reason. But of course knowledge can indirectly help with nearly all problem solving, however abstract the puzzles may be, so it is probably impossible to remove the bias in reality.

How non-peer reviewed science makes it to the populous.

Fernapple comments on Nov 22, 2021:

Could not endure the grammar, was the article written by a ten year old ?

Fernapple replies on Nov 23, 2021:

@Gwendolyn2018 I remember reading an article by, I think Richard Dawkins, some while ago now. In which he said that there is a convention in some , mainly American universities, where some students and a few second rate, (his opinion) academics feel that to have papers taken seriously they have to write them in unintelligible "science paper speak", which serves no purpose , but in the minds of naive students, is supposed to impress their peers. He made the point that in his case it does just the opposite. Good plain English please.

How non-peer reviewed science makes it to the populous.

Fernapple comments on Nov 22, 2021:

Could not endure the grammar, was the article written by a ten year old ?

Fernapple replies on Nov 23, 2021:

@JackPedigo It seems to have moved on anyway. I went back to try and give it a second go, but it had gone. If the author knows that it is ephemeral, he may just have cut and pasted from a paper.

"I never barked when out of season, I never bit without a reason; I n'er insulted weaker brother,...

Fernapple comments on Nov 23, 2021:

And here is Byron on a Newfoundland dog's grave. Enjoy. Oh man! thou feeble tenant of an hour, Debas'd by slavery, or corrupt by power, Who knows thee well, must quit thee with disgust, Degraded mass of animated dust! Thy love is lust, thy friendship all a cheat, Thy tongue hypocrisy, thy ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 23, 2021:

@AnonySchmoose I liked the similar sentiments, given especially that Byron and Burns are in many ways polar opposites, who would probably have loathed one another had they met.

How non-peer reviewed science makes it to the populous.

Fernapple comments on Nov 22, 2021:

Could not endure the grammar, was the article written by a ten year old ?

Fernapple replies on Nov 23, 2021:

@Gwendolyn2018 It is very like the output of drunks writing in haste late at night.

What is your definition of stupidity?

Fernapple comments on Nov 22, 2021:

It may not exist at all. Just as there is no such thing as dark, only a lack of light, and no such thing as cold only a lack of heat, so there may be, no such thing as stupid only too little thinking.

Fernapple replies on Nov 22, 2021:

@Matias, @p-nullifidian The cause and effects would be very important and the definition much less so. But since a definition is a immaterial human cultural construct, and genetics a material part of nature, they exist in almost completely different magisteria anyway.

What is your definition of stupidity?

Fernapple comments on Nov 22, 2021:

It may not exist at all. Just as there is no such thing as dark, only a lack of light, and no such thing as cold only a lack of heat, so there may be, no such thing as stupid only too little thinking.

Fernapple replies on Nov 22, 2021:

@Matias Yes darkness can be an lack of light, you can produce a photon of light, can you find a particle of dark ? As to your other questions. No to the first, yes to the second, to the third death does not exist, and no to the last one.

This comment was posted Online by anonymous poster.

Moravian comments on Nov 22, 2021:

We do need children, just not too many. Someone has to look after us in our dotage.

Fernapple replies on Nov 22, 2021:

No , there is the option of actively choosing death before we reach our dotage. And that also assumes that our children will survive, long enough, to be there in our dotage.

Moving outside the religious norms of past generations has brought us here:

Spongebob comments on Nov 21, 2021:

Who defines what "more ethical" means?

Fernapple replies on Nov 22, 2021:

Becoming more ethical and defining more ethical , are perhaps one and the same.

Freethought is a philosophical position that holds that ideas and opinions should be based on ...

mischl comments on Nov 21, 2021:

Ryo1, no name, no photo, no gender. Are you a troll?

Fernapple replies on Nov 22, 2021:

@Buck No he's from Devon, a small country almost attached to England, which thinks that it is independant. (Think Newfoundlanders.) (They are very inbred, which could account for the ears. )

I love to cuddle up with a good book or preferably with a woman who has read one. 😁😉

hankster comments on Nov 21, 2021:

both.

Fernapple replies on Nov 21, 2021:

@hankster Well don't get mapel syrup on the pillows.

I love to cuddle up with a good book or preferably with a woman who has read one. 😁😉

hankster comments on Nov 21, 2021:

both.

Fernapple replies on Nov 21, 2021:

Greedy. Besides at your time of life, how can you concentrate ?

We Live By a Unit of Time That Doesn’t Make Sense The seven-day week has survived for ...

Fernapple comments on Nov 21, 2021:

Its simple. Go for twenty eight day months. Then every month starts on the same day, and nobody ever needs to buy another calender. You then have thirteen months in a year which is three hundred and sixty four days, so you make new years day a public holiday which is not given a week day ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 21, 2021:

@Diaco Thats why I said. "in leap years you have two of them"

I encourage everyone to trade up your weapons for web puns.

Fernapple comments on Nov 20, 2021:

Groan.

Fernapple replies on Nov 20, 2021:

@Willow_Wisp Love you too.

is the universe 13.8 billion years old no matter what direction we're detecting?

David1955 comments on Nov 19, 2021:

Yes, and don't stop until you get to the restaurant at the edge of the universe. Questions like yours, and what does the universe expand into? are the kind of questions which, as they used to say in the 60s, "really blows my mind, man!"

Fernapple replies on Nov 20, 2021:

@hankster It may not have an edge anyway, because some cosmology says that space is so bent that if you keep going far enough in an unbending line, you will eventually arive back where you started.

My wife just completed a 40-week body building routine... It's a baby boy, weighing 7 pounds!

Fernapple comments on Nov 19, 2021:

Now you will be body building, while your brain melts though lack of sleep. Enjoy and congratulations.

Fernapple replies on Nov 20, 2021:

@Lilac-JadeCanada Yep, I read Sticks48 below after I posted, but thought that I would let it stand.

Schnitzel (meat in breadcrumbs) 😆

Fernapple comments on Nov 19, 2021:

Muesli and melon. Its breakfast time here in the UK.

Fernapple replies on Nov 19, 2021:

@Ryo1 Well there are a lot of people here, not all of them come from a country bordering on the UK.

Do you dance to this when you do your housework?

Paul4747 comments on Nov 19, 2021:

Who does housework? If I can still see carpet somewhere in the place, it's all good.

Fernapple replies on Nov 19, 2021:

Oh, I remember, there used to be a carpet in my house too.

Come to Britain.

Fernapple comments on Nov 17, 2021:

It is worth pointing out, that this is a Christian group doing the survey, and that the stats are only about Christians for the most part. So it is not the British population as a whole, since it ignores the large percentages of other faiths and none believers. It it hard to tell with some of the ...

Fernapple replies on Nov 17, 2021:

@Ryo1 Yes. I think that it is interesting that in the stats. (From Wiki.) over 7% are given as, "not stated". It could be, that an awful lot of those could be none religious, which would push, no religion, up to nearly a third.

Why not evolution?

Diagoras comments on Nov 16, 2021:

Couldn't an argument be made that anything humans do is a result of evolution? I think the same tribalism is what leads non believers to denial about the topic. Within most species typical and atypical behaviors can be found. Why would we be any different?

Fernapple replies on Nov 16, 2021:

The important point is that. "Religions were invented by criminals to control people and take their money." and, religions being "most likely adaptive". Are not in contradiction. My desire for large high cal. meals, is adaptive for life on the African savanna, where good meals were hard to come by. That adaption does not mean that today it is not criminal, for powerful food manufacturers to produce and market large amounts of junk food designed to be addictive, to an already obese population. We have come a long way from the centre of Africa where our adaptive traits evolved, and what was once an advantage may now be a disadvantage. While the adaptive desire for large meals does not specify any particular diet, either, so that all of the diets offered today around the world, may not be healthy, or contain only wild African game and roots. So it does not follow that today's religions have to be useful or adaptive, just because the early religions were. While the fact that there is hardly a single thing held by today's religions in common, proves that they have all moved very far for what they were originally. I would say therefore that the main reason that most sceptics do not credit religions with origins in evolution, if that is indeed the case that they don't, though reading these replies I have doubts, is that they simply do not know about some very obscure science which has very little bearing on their real interests, and does not really conflict with their views.