I know we'd have threads before about dealbreakers in dating relationships.

Christiep77 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

I am trying to understand the meet up group. Am I assuming correcting that it is about exploring dating and finding the path towards who you are compatable with or something like that? Is listing deal breakers a way of exploring deeper what you are and are and are not looking for as well as ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

I think you are reading all of this correctly, including the purpose of the Meetup group. It meets once a month and the purpose is for the members to learn about themselves as well as about the dating process and also provide support to each other during the dating process. In a nutshell, it sounds to me a lot like a 12-step or recovery support group, only it meets less often than those usually do. Thank you for your encouragement Christie. My main reasons for joining the group are to maybe make a friend or two that I can phone or meet with in between group meetings for support, discussion and maybe hang out with. Secondly, hang out with other group members when they occasionally get together socially to hear a band, etc. Thirdly, learn more about dating from others as well as learn more about what I might do differently with dating. Only about 40-50 people regularly attend the monthly meeting/events and many of them are way younger than me. Also, I'm sure many if not most of them are at least identified Christians, so I'm not looking to date anyone from the group. They are a very small pool of people and, unlike me or our community here on Agnostic, they are likely almost all very mainstream in lifestyle and culture. For example, one woman on a discussion in the Meetup group's site made a comment in response to someone else that "some of us don't believe in sex before marriage". This was after an exchange between me and a young guy about how soon sex usually happens after people meet. Hearing that it felt a bit as if she lived in a different world than me......

I know we'd have threads before about dealbreakers in dating relationships.

MrLizard comments on Apr 5, 2019:

Dealbreakers limit you. But you have every right to identify them and be happy with whom you have a relationship. She overreacted and could have just agreed you two were not a great match. End story.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

Exactly. We had already agreed on that. She just could not go on and accept or validate that my dealbreakers could be as valid, fair and healthy as her own dealbreaker on religion. Who knows what other ones she has? I never found out, but she instead began evangelizing about how I needed to meet with the dating group's leader and get myself straightened out on not having so many, if any, dealbreakers, because she said they were "unrealistic, more likely wishes rather than needs, and based too much on my marriage with my late wife" which she said would never happen like that again, etc. Well, at least she had that last part right...

I know we'd have threads before about dealbreakers in dating relationships.

RobertNappi2 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

If your just looking for hookups...There are NO deal breakers! If your looking long term, there are compatibility issues where deal makers or breakers should be addressed. Find someone with compatible values!

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

I should have clarified. For purposes of this thread, I would like for everyone to stick with the issue of dealbreakers for LTRs. That is the focus of the Meetup group that I have joined and am writing about. Their leader is a dating and relationship coach who founded the group a couple years ago and also has her own business coaching and advising people on dating. I don't think she does matchmaking, but I'm sure she recruits clients from the Meetup group.

I know we'd have threads before about dealbreakers in dating relationships.

HippieChick58 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

I think deal breakers are judgements, and in no way does that make them bad. We use judgement ALL THE TIME. Prehistoric persons had to decide if they could kill that brontosaurus or if they needed to run and hide. When we drive we're judging other drivers, how fast are they going, can I get through ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

Trust me she is not my friend, never was, just a member of the group that I encountered on their Meetup site and began chatting with. She ended the chat by telling me that she would not respond to further messages from me. I told her that when the group has its next meeting on April 20 that I will be there and if she is also that I will be polite and civil as well as not end up gossiping about or badmouthing her to other members of the group. I asked her to extend to me the same courtesies, but I've got a strong feeling that she won't and like most Christian hypocrites, of which she may be one, they usually don't play fair, at least not in my experience. BTW, thanks Paula. You live in Omaha, which is much like Des Moines, so you are familiar with this stuff and these types of people. They are very smug, arrogant members of the majority culture. A real pain to live around....

I know we'd have threads before about dealbreakers in dating relationships.

CaroleKay comments on Apr 5, 2019:

I don't get why you are wasting your time with a believer.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

I wasn't. I ran into her on a discussion thread of the Meetup group, same as you and me here. She suggested early on in the chat that she would be interested in having coffee as friends to discuss the dating process as fellow group members, since we had already talked about our diff on religion and she said she couldn't date Agnostic. I was never trying to date her or even suggest it once I heard she was a strong believer. This Meetup group is secular, not church-connected or Christian, tho most of its members probably are that, is my guess. She changed her tune quickly and hostile once I disagreed with her about dealbreakers, even tho she was very secure about her own dealbreaker on not dating non-believers. She didn't like being accused of hypocrisy.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Freethinkingxx comments on Apr 2, 2019:

That kind of sucks, especially since I know many women, including myself, who are into bald men. Especially if you go all in and shave it clean! TMI?! LOL

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

@Janiesuper Agnostic is not a general population site and it is full of people like me that are not part of mainstream society or culture, because, simply by being non-believers they fall into only about 2-3% of the general population, an even lower % than gay and lesbian people. This site is perfect for connecting me with similar folks when it comes to non-religion and alternative culture and lifestyle, but it doesn't help me find anyone local to date because in my area the % of people like us on Agnostic is probably even lower that 2-3% of the single population, if even that. Pretty bleak. Just have to plod on and hope to meet the needle in the haystack. You may well succeed, if only because you are 15 years younger than me and still working, so you have more and bigger networks and opportunities than me. I'm still too young to meet women at the senior center or the retirement home yet, lol.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Freethinkingxx comments on Apr 2, 2019:

That kind of sucks, especially since I know many women, including myself, who are into bald men. Especially if you go all in and shave it clean! TMI?! LOL

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 5, 2019:

@Janiesuper I have no doubt that many profiles are fake, but they are easy to spot, so I just blow by them. And I do often run across profiles from women who are obviously on free memberships for a short trial period that end up never even reading, much less replying to my messages. Then the profile either shows its been inactive for quite a while or becomes unavailable. That's the sequence with the free memberships. And, like I said before, the profiles really don't matter that much in who gets interested in chatting with you on the site. As one woman told me, " I look at the photos and see if they do anything for me as far as attraction. I read the essay and see if there is anything particularly offensive like the guy being a Trump supporter or a hunter, etc. and I also look for anything really interesting or clever said in the essay, including something I really like. Lastly, I see how many common interests we have. Beyond that, the profile doesn't matter that much if he checks out ok on those parts, then I'll reply to him". I have to say that my process is probably way more thorough than that, but I bet most men are different. I check for not only those things she mentioned, but also for any clues that the woman is different in any ways that are likely to be a dealbreaker for me or her. I've been at this so long, it's become pretty obvious which issues keep coming up that are problems and I don't want to bother with messaging someone that does not seem likely to be a mutual match.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Freethinkingxx comments on Apr 2, 2019:

That kind of sucks, especially since I know many women, including myself, who are into bald men. Especially if you go all in and shave it clean! TMI?! LOL

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 4, 2019:

@Janiesuper It may be a very old asthetic, but it is still a big issue with many women in my area on Batch. Before the recent removal of the profile traits I mentioned from Batch, many, but not most, of the women's profiles did not include bald among the hair type traits they were looking for in the traits checklist section. Maybe it's regional. You live in NM, maybe Alb. is more hip than Des Moines, I wouldn't doubt that. I don't doubt that most women my age in Des Moines are still stuck in the 80s culturally.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 3, 2019:

I empathize with you, Tom....I'm not being naive....just trying to be supportive. I've pretty much given up the chase....going through a phase of enjoying being by myself.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 3, 2019:

Too bad the Des Moines UU church is not full of guys like you, because then I would enjoy going there instead of dreading it.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 1, 2019:

You mention baldness as a feature that's been removed...which could be an interesting plus for bald men! Apparently their admins have found that demanding "having hair" is too superficial...so go with it! If it comes up in a conversation don't hide it....but I'm guessing once you're face to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 3, 2019:

@Robecology You are naive Rob. I am not kidding about this. The first thing they ask you when they meet you is what your job is. If I answered retired, which I am, they would then ask what type of work did you do before you retired? They really do care about sizing you up immediately according to whether you fit into their financial and professional class or not. When I was a member of that church back in the early 90s, the church directory actually listed the member's employer (at least for most members that were working) and usually also their work number. They have since gotten rid of that, but the attitude remains. I can't count the number of times I have met someone there during the coffee time after services where I was asked about my employment and the other person then literally turned and walked away from me almost immediately because I had failed their test of whether I was in their class or not. BTW, most people there dress very casual and not that nice.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 1, 2019:

You mention baldness as a feature that's been removed...which could be an interesting plus for bald men! Apparently their admins have found that demanding "having hair" is too superficial...so go with it! If it comes up in a conversation don't hide it....but I'm guessing once you're face to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 3, 2019:

@Robecology I have no problem with the Unitarian churches themselves as far as beliefs or their set of principles. Almost everybody at the one in Des Moines, my area, is either Humanist, Agnostic, or Atheist as far as beliefs. They don't buy into Hell or Heaven or God as far as I've noticed. My beef with them has for some time been their classism, snobbery, and cliquishness as a mainstream part of their culture as a congregation. In other words, the inhospitable and unaccepting attitude of many of the members, esp. the male members. They don't care if you are gay, trans., black, HIspanic, etc, but if you want to fit in and feel welcome and included, you'd better have a college degree and make over at least 75 K in a job that is a profession rather than just some menial service job. Get the picture? For 15 years my late wife and I lived about a half hour north of where I am now in a college town that had a Unitarian church. Their congregation had a different culture than the one in Des Moines because as a college town it had more turnover with the university of student and faculty members of the church. Many of them did not have much money or high status jobs, so by necessity the group was less classist and open to different types of people as far as employment and income. Not surprisingly, that group was always more accepting and welcoming to me than the Des Moines church. But the problem with going there is that I am the wrong age to meet someone to date there. The students are too young for me and the faculty are too old and mostly retired. It is also a much smaller congregation than the one in Des Moines and the minister is not that interesting to listen to. They also have very few social events or activities for adults.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 1, 2019:

You mention baldness as a feature that's been removed...which could be an interesting plus for bald men! Apparently their admins have found that demanding "having hair" is too superficial...so go with it! If it comes up in a conversation don't hide it....but I'm guessing once you're face to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 3, 2019:

@Robecology Twice I have tried to reply and have lost the page, must have had too long of a comment. Rob, thanks for being supportive, but I really feel I have no choice about using Batch or something like it. IRL just does not present enough regular opportunities to meet women and anyway I just don't have much in the way of confidence and skills when it comes to meeting women in public or at events. Batch at least has a deeper pool of women for me to approach that seem to be single and looking, vs, IRL you can only guess and assume which women at a place are available and interested/looking. Plus, you already have some info to go on about their compatibility vs. IRl you have just their looks and maybe some idea of a common interest if you see them at an event. At least at any time on Batch there is a pool of several hundred women my age in my area when I do a mutual match search. I don't want to wait several more years on my own to meet someone and IRL by itself is not going to do it. I may soon swallow my disgust and go back to the local Unitarian church where there are some women my age. Agnostic is a dead end for me as in over two years on here I have yet to meet anyone in person and no new women my age have joined in over 2 years in my area. I am also going to try a Meetup.com group for singles who are looking to date that is led by a dating and relationship coach. Hopefully I can make a friend or two there that is interested in talking or meeting regularly to discuss the dating battles as all of my friends are married and either don't get what it's like or just aren't interested in hearing about the struggle. That group only meets once a month so what I need is a friend or two from it that wants to be like a 12-step sponsor with each other so we can frequently talk about and support each other with the process.

"Medicine, law, business, engineering, these are noble pursuits and necessary to sustain life.

TomMcGiverin comments on Apr 3, 2019:

Look where it got him at the end of the movie. Sad, but inspiring movie.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 3, 2019:

@bleurowz I dunno, American society today seems just as materialistic as then.

I am the eldest son of a Austrian father and German mother and I have two younger sisters.

callmedubious comments on Apr 2, 2019:

i had a similar experience with my sister when my mother died. ppl can be weasels even siblings.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 3, 2019:

My late wife's sister tried to cheat my wife out of her share of their mother's home after their mother died. Marge was not going to pay my wife her share after the house was sold and when my wife called her to ask when Marge would be sending her the money, Marge told my wife " I wasn't going to pay you because you don't need the money, you already have a lot of it" . My wife had to hire a lawyer from across the country where Marge lives and threaten to sue her, as the mother's will said that the house went to both of them equally. Marge then caved and agreed to pay, but my wife was generous and forgiving enough to let her pay it back over two years in an annuity. I would not have been so forgiving, but my wife had no other immediate family left. Neither of us trusted Marge with any money after that.

Gracie is beggggging for food.

TomMcGiverin comments on Apr 2, 2019:

Why not just one bowl? She obviously is not going to end up just skin and bones...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

@GinaKay One bowl for more than one cat can sometimes be problematic. I knew a neighbor cat that would get very neurotic and anxious during the winter from being kept inside all the time. So he would compensate every winter by pushing the other cats away from the food and eating all of it himself like a pig. He always put on a lot of winter fat...He was very spoiled and privileged compared to the other cats and he knew it.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Chooseluv comments on Apr 2, 2019:

If it means anything, I'm a hairstylist and I don't care about dating men that are bald or balding. I still find the guys sexy it really doesn't matter to me.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

@Chooseluv It's better if the other person's profile contains the info you want to begin with, rather than having to message them and ask questions, esp. since 90% of my initial messages to women on Batch go unanswered, so asking the woman for info that isn't in their profile is usually a waste of time. As for photo images, you're right. All a profile really needs is one close up head shot and one full body shot that is not too far away. Most profiles contain one of each of these types, as well as a few others.

Gracie is beggggging for food.

SeaGreenEyez comments on Apr 2, 2019:

Cats are just funny. We had one that took 1 kibble from his bowl, dropped it in the water bowl, then eat. Every ... single ... time ... same drill. OCD much? ?

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

Why wouldn't some cats be as OCD as many hoomans? There must be pet meds for that...I know I've seen cats that are as neurotic as most humans.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 1, 2019:

You mention baldness as a feature that's been removed...which could be an interesting plus for bald men! Apparently their admins have found that demanding "having hair" is too superficial...so go with it! If it comes up in a conversation don't hide it....but I'm guessing once you're face to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

@A2Jennifer Yeah, all the paid dating sites seem to use billing practices that try to trick people into renewing and paying for another membership. They figure most people won't fight it or stay on top of their renewal period enough to cancel in time before the auto renewal. Like I said today in my new comment on top of the thread, it's all about the money to them rather than customer service or actually wanting you to find a partner.

Update on my last post In case you havent read it, basically i had a potential opportunity to ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Apr 2, 2019:

I dunno, I personally would feel weird about trying to meet up with her on the trail. Odds are you would have to go back several times to show up when she was there. I say go back to the restaurant and try again. Life is short, it's worth the risk. Good luck.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

@bloodypoptart That could work out too, but you seemed to say that this waitress seemed to be interested in you...

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Chooseluv comments on Apr 2, 2019:

If it means anything, I'm a hairstylist and I don't care about dating men that are bald or balding. I still find the guys sexy it really doesn't matter to me.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

I appreciate your opinion. My point is more about the paid site taking away the info on profiles that helps members better select who is more compatible and also indicate what they are looking for in a partner. The site can't force its members to provide any more about themselves than the member wants to (such as requiring them to have at least one photo that is a full body shot or even a photo at all) or even make them be honest in their profile info, but they can at least try to provide profile formats that allow for as much useful info as possible for those members that want to share it or use it in their search. Maybe it's like a friend of mine told me when I shared about this news with him. He told me the paid sites don't want you to actually find a partner on their site because once you do, they lose you as a paying customer. Doesn't sound that overly cynical to me. They want your money, not for you to quit needing them.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Booklover comments on Apr 2, 2019:

I understand what you are saying about lack of information. I'm a fat person and what's the point of writing someone who can't stand fat women even if everything else is a perfect match. I said as much to the admin of No Harmony and they said something along the lines of they couldn't tell about ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

That's my point, and thank you. I would rather know up front which women don't want a bald man and who is open to it so I don't waste my time and effort messaging the women who aren't. Same situation as you. I would think paid sites that cared about customer service would want to provide more info in the profiles for other members to use rather than less.... The admin. of No Harmony was being a typical disingenuous corporate weasel in saying they "couldn't tell about looks" or whatever the hell he was saying. He knows damn well that looks are very important to most people on dating sites or they wouldn't strongly urge or even require them for their members to provide in profiles.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Freethinkingxx comments on Apr 2, 2019:

That kind of sucks, especially since I know many women, including myself, who are into bald men. Especially if you go all in and shave it clean! TMI?! LOL

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

I think the women on Agnostic are more open-minded about baldness with men, esp. women who are my age or older, than most women in the general population. That is probably because this community is more open-minded, less conformist, and less superficial than most folks. Probably because we are also more intellectual than most. But I stand by my % in the post, that about 40% of women my age who are on the paid site do want only men with hair on their head. As far as my own attitude about my baldness, it's really more a combination of confidence, as azzow2 said, and my strong stubbornness to be honest and authentic about myself, including how I look. I would rather be open and honest about how I look and being bald than try to hide behind wearing ballcaps and combing over or growing out my hair on the sides. I see that as not only fooling no one, but also showing underconfidence and trying to be inauthentic. People may not like me, but they will know me for who I am and will never accuse me of being phony. And I am very proud of that and feel it is unique in a good way. Too bad you live out there, lol...

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Deiter comments on Apr 1, 2019:

Money always cures baldness. Or, some other blinding trait like *cooking* or *fixes cars* or *abs that can grate cheese.* I’m sure you can come up with something.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

@Deiter Thank you Deiter. In all seriousness, despite the group's digression into humor about baldness, your opinion and empathy count a lot with me.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

ShadowAmicus comments on Apr 2, 2019:

I think you are getting too wrapped up in the baldness issue. I shave my head, by choice, and some women hate it (or me) - others really like it ..(but don't know much about me). I don't expect the ladies options include do you shave? or options of bald, brazillian, landing strip etc - which is ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

I hear you. It's just that in online dating, vs. offline encounters when you first meet in person instead of thru a profile on a screen, is that baldness is just another item that plays into the big online sorting process that may, but usually doesn't, lead to an exchange of messages or a phone call where the mental compatibility then does come into play. Until then, the mental really doesn't matter when the other person is just looking at pics and some other info....

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Apr 1, 2019:

What about the other traits of income level or occupational category? Would you want to know what the person was looking for in those trait categories? As well as what income level they were at?

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 2, 2019:

@IrishTxJudy Of course, with all of these traits, people can lie and, except for the photos, you have no way of seeing anything to contradict what they choose to share about themselves. Still, I think most people are fairly honest, at least here in Iowa, in how they answer the trait items in the profile, where they just click on buttons to select categories. And even if they lie about themselves in that category selection, what matters more to me and most people is getting the most info possible about what they are looking for, which is info you never get if you just meet someone face to face to start with instead of thru a profile. I hear all of you that are basically saying, "I am who I am and if they aren't looking for or interested in me, it's no loss, their loss, etc." I get that. I just don't want to waste my time reaching out to women that are not my type if I can avoid that thru some info that used to be available until now on Batch. They are clearly not customer-friendly or service oriented.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

mischl comments on Apr 1, 2019:

As a former user of Rhymes-with-Batch, I had problems trying to determine body type. I'm especially not attractive to heavier women. Can't help it, I'm wired that way. After several more attempts with other dating sites, I've given it up. I'm concentrating on my work and, only as a last resort, ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

@UUNJ As for the member themselves, the body type categories are pretty unimportant and most people just select About Average for themselves. The photos are what really matter and tell others what their body type is, as long as at least one of them is a full body shot. But the site still lists in the profile what body types the member is interested in dating and this is useful to know so you don't message someone like, say, Literate Hiker who would want athletic and toned, for example, which is one of the categories, if you are overweight and in bad shape.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

WonderWartHog99 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

# Arg, me bucko. Some heads are blessed. The rest are are covered with hair.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

Funny guy you are, WW...

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

azzow2 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

At least you have confidence and can be open with it. Some try and hide it and it looks worse than ever. I have been fortunate so far to keep my hair.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

Thank you for calling me confident rather than defensive about being bald. Some people just can't say anything to me without being critical.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

UUNJ comments on Apr 1, 2019:

I never realized there was a Match option for “bald.” I’ve dated guys with and without hair—the only one that freaks me out is the weird nearly-bald comb-over. I suggest you not lose sleep over it. Online dating is a numbers game—contact the women who appeal to you and post your best ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

Already done, results are still very poor.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 1, 2019:

You mention baldness as a feature that's been removed...which could be an interesting plus for bald men! Apparently their admins have found that demanding "having hair" is too superficial...so go with it! If it comes up in a conversation don't hide it....but I'm guessing once you're face to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

@A2Jennifer Just leads to more hassle for men and women with men wasting more time on uninterested women than they would and women getting more messages than they would. Since women don't do much messaging on paid sites, this would not really affect you as much as men. Jennifer, I've been on Batch for a year and half, so I figured out long ago that 90% of my messages go unanswered. I don't take it personally, but it is still very discouraging and demoralizing. Anyone who says different is either rationalizing or lying.

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Stephanie99 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

I care about the person, not his hair. Someone who is defensive because he is bald could be a problem though.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

Still had to make a judgement that I was defensive. Can you ever be less than critical of me? Nice to know you are always consistent Stephanie. Always supportive. Glad you are a minority that's accepting about baldness, wish you could have left it at that. Time for your block, Stephanie...

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Deiter comments on Apr 1, 2019:

Money always cures baldness. Or, some other blinding trait like *cooking* or *fixes cars* or *abs that can grate cheese.* I’m sure you can come up with something.

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

Wish I had that kind of money or some other blinding trait but I don't Deiter. I just have a good and loyal heart, but that's not going to get me very far in the online sorting process....those traits don't come out or into play until someone decides to give you a chance with them for a while.....

The paid dating site I'm on-rhymes with Batch-just removed 4 traits from its checklist of member ...

Robecology comments on Apr 1, 2019:

You mention baldness as a feature that's been removed...which could be an interesting plus for bald men! Apparently their admins have found that demanding "having hair" is too superficial...so go with it! If it comes up in a conversation don't hide it....but I'm guessing once you're face to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

My whole beef about it is that altho women could always tell from the guy's profile if he was bald from the pics, the man used to be able to see the woman's profile and read in her traits list if she was open to dating bald men. Now the man can only guess if she is or just go ahead and waste time messaging her hoping she is open to that. And also women who don't want to date bald men will get more unwanted messages. Ah, the arrogance of corporate America. The rep that replied to my e-mail said they had gotten customer feedback before doing this, but I really doubt it. The face to face, BTW, is very rare and also delayed when it does happen, at least for average-looking men....

Croby Stills and Nash made some awesome music. What are your favorite tunes? I have so many.

DharmaBum50 comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I like the ones with Young added to the mix, and my fave of those is "Ohio." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1PrUU2S_iw

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

That album cover by Joni Mitchell is so cool!

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I had my only LTR with my late wife who was 16 years older than me. We were together 22 years, married for 20. It was the best years of my adult life. Neither of us had kids or were very close to our families. We liked most of the same things and had a very healthy balance of friends and time ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

@Stephanie99 We rarely seem to agree on anything, but maybe so here. As Literate Hiker recently said on this forum, most divorced people or at least many of them, are leftovers. There may be very good reasons they got divorced that were mostly due to their own faults or problems involving their ability to do relationships. With widowed people there may be less of those issues with someone you meet, with two exceptions that I can think of right off. One, is a widowed person who is not over their grief and or is still looking for a clone of their late spouse to replace them instead of being open to someone new and not always comparing them to their late spouse. The other reason is that some divorced people may not prefer someone widowed because they assume the widowed person may not be able to understand the divorced person's experience, not having been divorced themselves, and so they might not want a widowed person because they want to stay with dating only those who share their experience, which, to me, is a poor choice. But some folks care more about being with the familiar and keeping to those as much like their background as possible over trying others who might be more healthy and compatible than those they are sticking with. My late wife was divorced twice before she met me, but she was a great match for me and after dating her a while it became clear that her two divorces were more about the men than her.

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I had my only LTR with my late wife who was 16 years older than me. We were together 22 years, married for 20. It was the best years of my adult life. Neither of us had kids or were very close to our families. We liked most of the same things and had a very healthy balance of friends and time ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Apr 1, 2019:

@Stephanie99 Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I certainly don't compare other women all the time to my late wife, but it seems like many women don't want to date a widower if they have not had that experience because they seem to cynically assume that the man is either not over his loss or else will be comparing women to his dead wife and not give them a fair chance, so they choose to date divorced men instead. But if the man waits too long to date after being widowed, his skills get rusty. For all practical purposes, I have been widowed for five years as my late wife had lost her mind and personality about three years before she died two years ago, so I have been more than ready to date after she died, but that's not how most women who aren't widowed see it, which is very frustrating to not be given a chance. I notice differences and similarities between her and other women, but I don't comment on it to them. If someone is defensive towards the other sex, they can always find faults with how someone else copes with their loss or their approach to dating.....

After dinner pets with Mazie.

dalefvictor comments on Mar 31, 2019:

She looks like a big girl, just like our Lilly.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 31, 2019:

@Kynlei She looks way bigger than that, like a fat and sassy wondercat..

Love and Relationships

Cast1es comments on Mar 27, 2019:

This was advertised as a dating site . Although some say they are here for community only , most are interested in meeting others for dating .

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

The more I look around the discussion boards, the more I think there are lots of members who say they are here only for community, but are actually interested in dating-whether it's other members of this site or from paid dating site- except they don't come out and say so since they have had little luck or lost most of their hope. No one wants to look sad or rejected to others.

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I had my only LTR with my late wife who was 16 years older than me. We were together 22 years, married for 20. It was the best years of my adult life. Neither of us had kids or were very close to our families. We liked most of the same things and had a very healthy balance of friends and time ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@FrayedBear That's my feeling too and I said that above. Thanks for the validation.

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I had my only LTR with my late wife who was 16 years older than me. We were together 22 years, married for 20. It was the best years of my adult life. Neither of us had kids or were very close to our families. We liked most of the same things and had a very healthy balance of friends and time ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@UUNJ True. When I read profiles on Match and also when I have traded e-mails with women on Match, it seems like most women my age, whether divorced or widowed, seem to be staying alone for a long time, usually several years, before they try dating again. Another frustrating issue.

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

CaroleKay comments on Mar 27, 2019:

Although they have a lot of energy and they are fun in bed, I find they act young and I end up having little in common in the long run. my last BF was younger. Everyone is different but there's a new breed on dating sites, I'm finding, that know older women are usually dateless around 50-60 and ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@CaroleKay I think you are different and a rare breed. Most other women that age group in my area, not so much.. I don't think the 50-somethings I'm talking about are lacking at all in confidence or self-esteem..They just have different interests and priorities than me as far as dating and relationships.

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I had my only LTR with my late wife who was 16 years older than me. We were together 22 years, married for 20. It was the best years of my adult life. Neither of us had kids or were very close to our families. We liked most of the same things and had a very healthy balance of friends and time ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@sweetcharlotte Time is running short. I don't put limits on dating women who are divorced rather than widowed. I just realize that the divorced ones are less likely to be interested in me than ones who are widowed, plus the widowed ones are less likely to be bitter and/or cynical about men than widowed ones. Hence my greater interest in them over the divorced ones. That's all I'm trying to say..

Are women aware of being played by a charming, subtle flirt?

Julie808 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

We're aware and know not to take obvious flirts seriously, but it's the subtle flirts who slip under the radar sometimes. Those can fool us if subtle enough. Would be nice if the flirtatious dude's friend could tip a gal off if he sees her being taken in by someone with dubious intentions. I ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@Hominid Yup, he's an ass... I just wish women could spot guys like that as easy as guys like you and me can, but then again they don't see him without the mask or act on....

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

CaroleKay comments on Mar 27, 2019:

Although they have a lot of energy and they are fun in bed, I find they act young and I end up having little in common in the long run. my last BF was younger. Everyone is different but there's a new breed on dating sites, I'm finding, that know older women are usually dateless around 50-60 and ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@CaroleKay I also think that for many of these women in their 50s that I mentioned, their goal is really not an LTR or even more than a FWB, and that's another reason they are not interested in dating men who are more than a few years older, because the older guys actually want a relationship, while these women have raised their kids, gotten divorced, have just gotten an empty nest, and are now wanting to just have sex and play for a while with much younger men while they still are young enough to do so and have their looks. They can always do relationships later after they have played a while. At least that's my theory of what's going on coupled with what several women that age have told me.

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 27, 2019:

I had my only LTR with my late wife who was 16 years older than me. We were together 22 years, married for 20. It was the best years of my adult life. Neither of us had kids or were very close to our families. We liked most of the same things and had a very healthy balance of friends and time ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

@sweetcharlotte Thank you for the compliment. Too bad my story doesn't seem to impress many women my age in my area on Match. Another problem is right now I'm a little young for most of the women who are widowed in my area. Divorced women make up about 80% of the women my age on Match and even tho I would prefer to date a fellow widowed person, there just aren't enough of them to give me many prospects. Plus, it seems like most women my age who are divorced indicate in their profile that they want a man who is also divorced, like them. Why they don't want to give a widowed man a chance even tho he's never been divorced seems a little weird to me, but maybe they are just more concerned with having that shared experience with someone than considering that a widowed man might still have enough empathy to understand them. Especially since in many cases there are good reasons a man got divorced, as in things being wrong with him, but I guess some women like defying Einstein's quote about insanity, ie. dating fellow divorced people and hoping to get different results next time. My point is, some people prefer the familiar over someone different that might have a better track record and be more capable of doing relationships. Gets very frustrating to not be given a chance....

Had a date tonight with a significantly younger man.

CaroleKay comments on Mar 27, 2019:

Although they have a lot of energy and they are fun in bed, I find they act young and I end up having little in common in the long run. my last BF was younger. Everyone is different but there's a new breed on dating sites, I'm finding, that know older women are usually dateless around 50-60 and ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 27, 2019:

You're absolutely right CK. I rarely even bother messaging any women on Match who are more than a few years younger than me because almost all the women who are 52-55 (I am 60) designate in their profiles that they will not date anyone more than a few years older than them. There are men my age willing to date the women you are mentioning, but so far the only women on Match who were compatible and interested in meeting me have been women who were in their early to mid-60s, probably because, unlike the women several years younger than them, they realize that the younger men in their 40s won't date them, so they are willing to date men their own age.

Are women aware of being played by a charming, subtle flirt?

Julie808 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

We're aware and know not to take obvious flirts seriously, but it's the subtle flirts who slip under the radar sometimes. Those can fool us if subtle enough. Would be nice if the flirtatious dude's friend could tip a gal off if he sees her being taken in by someone with dubious intentions. I ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 26, 2019:

Your suspicion is correct, most men will not cross a male friend to tip off a stranger about their own friend's behavior. Of course it goes both ways. How many women would tip off a male stranger about the dishonest behavior of their female friend? The continued friendship always matters more to most people, at least until the dishonest person burns them enough times. Personally, I don't maintain friendships with people that have that kind of character. Because of this dynamic, we are on our own when we date a stranger that has no mutual friends with us so we need to beware of their intentions for ourselves. That is why some people will not date someone that does not share any mutual friends that can be a reference.

Are women aware of being played by a charming, subtle flirt?

UUNJ comments on Mar 25, 2019:

Depends on the woman. Why anyone would want to be a manipulative player is the real question.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 26, 2019:

My guess is that they only want him until they see his true self or wake up to knowing they are being played.

Sometimes we have to go through something difficult.

vnufall comments on Mar 25, 2019:

I think people think they will go on a dating site and find a soulmate immediately or very soon. Finding a soulmate might be a once in a lifetime event. Better to make friends, take your time.I have found male widowers want a replacement for their wife, well maybe it works for them but I'm not his ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 25, 2019:

@vnufall I agree with that approach, it should only be after dating him a while, say, a few months at least if it ends up happening at all. We both live in the Midwest, but I live in Iowa and unfortunately here it seems to be all about family with the women who grew up here. That is why I am hoping to meet a woman who, like my late wife, is a transplant who grew up somewhere else like either coast. I seem to relate better to both men and women who are transplants than native Iowans. Probably because I share their values and outlook more than I do the natives.

Sometimes we have to go through something difficult.

vnufall comments on Mar 25, 2019:

I think people think they will go on a dating site and find a soulmate immediately or very soon. Finding a soulmate might be a once in a lifetime event. Better to make friends, take your time.I have found male widowers want a replacement for their wife, well maybe it works for them but I'm not his ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 25, 2019:

I'm a male widower and I don't want a replacement of my late wife. But I do want someone with the some of the same qualities of personality. Namely, strong and independent, smart, funny, and curious. Also someone who has a healthy balance in their life of family, friends, and time for a couples relationship. That last one seems to be the really rare one in my area where the women seem to want to spend the vast majority of their time with their family and the man tagging along as the escort.

NOT SARCASM, GENUINELY CURIOUS: Reading through the posts here it has been suggested by some to rate...

Sticks48 comments on Mar 22, 2019:

I don't understand what you are talking about.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 22, 2019:

@demifeministgal It's your post, your thread. Who else should I have questioned? Learn some manners.

NOT SARCASM, GENUINELY CURIOUS: Reading through the posts here it has been suggested by some to rate...

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 22, 2019:

I think I know what you are asking, but I don't want all the drama it would cause if I answered you here on the boards. If you are truly interested in rating yourself or getting a rating from others so you can try to only pursue those at your own level or rating for looks, PM me and I will try to ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 22, 2019:

@demifeministgal I'm not interested in discussing further with you. I think you are looking for a fight or someone to embarrass.

NOT SARCASM, GENUINELY CURIOUS: Reading through the posts here it has been suggested by some to rate...

Sticks48 comments on Mar 22, 2019:

I don't understand what you are talking about.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 22, 2019:

@demifeministgal Speak plainly using words or bother someone else.

NOT SARCASM, GENUINELY CURIOUS: Reading through the posts here it has been suggested by some to rate...

Sticks48 comments on Mar 22, 2019:

I don't understand what you are talking about.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 22, 2019:

@demifeministgal Still don't get it. I am probably way older than you and snark is not my first language. Speak plainly or don't bother chatting with me. The only emoji displayed on this thread so far is the one you just posted, which is different that what you described.

NOT SARCASM, GENUINELY CURIOUS: Reading through the posts here it has been suggested by some to rate...

Sticks48 comments on Mar 22, 2019:

I don't understand what you are talking about.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 22, 2019:

@demifeministgal What is XD? I'm interested to see what you come up with on that point.

I have been having to style my hair in a 1962 middle aged matronly hairdo while playing Benjamin's ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 20, 2019:

Could you say some things about how the stage version differs from the well known movie version? I know that in the film version Ben's parents didn't have that much screen time, maybe about three scenes or so. From how you describe the hairstyle, it reminds me of Tammy Fae Bakker, or some other ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 21, 2019:

@Deb57 That's kind of what I thought. My favorite part was the ending of the movie. What would the two of them do once they got off the bus? Where would they go and what would they do with their lives?

Got stood up again for the second time in four months, each time a different woman from a site that ...

Rustee comments on Mar 21, 2019:

I cannot imagine being so rude as to stand up a date, and then to lie about it, or act as if it was "no big deal", or be put out because you did not remind her. Huh? Certainly not your job to be the vocal calendar. It *is* a big deal to be where you say you are going to be, and that is simply a ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 21, 2019:

Thank you Rustee. Keeping my word is a big deal to me as well as you, but we are the minority these days. Apparently most people only believe in keeping their word or their agreements as long as there seems to be more in it for them to do so than to not do so. So as soon as they decide to change their mind, they believe they owe others nothing and don't give a damn if they look bad to others. It's all about self-gratification and self interest, not principles or integrity. That's for chumps according to their value system. What's galling and ironic is how many people bitch about how politicians have no principles or integrity and then hypocritically act this way in their own personal dealings in the dating game where they actually have a little power to use with others and yet they end up acting the same way as the pols they condemn. Just goes to show that you never really know a person's real character and values until they get the chance to have some power with other people and show how they use it when they have the opportunity to be tempted to be dishonest or abuse their power. Until then you don't know who they really are, all you have is their words about what they believe or value, which usually mean nothing......

Does anyone ever feel like they will never find that one person who just gets them?

MsHoliday comments on Mar 20, 2019:

After my husband died I thought I’d have no problem finding another someone to love and love me. it maybe that the area I live is filled with religious conservatives so I never clicked with the men here. Stopped looking a few years ago.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 20, 2019:

I'm widowed also, two years ago, but I haven't given up looking even tho I am very discouraged. Like you, I thought that after my wife died that with my track record of no divorces or failed relationships, just the long marriage ending in death, that women on dating sites would be impressed and I would have little trouble finding someone to be with. But that was very ignorant and naive of me because not only is that not how online dating works, because the process is so superficial and impersonal, but also that women in online dating don't care, for the most part, about your relationship track record in who they want to date. What they seem to care more about is looks, money and how high status your job is. Of course this goes both ways as men seem to only care about looks with women. I don't click with 97% of the women in my area because I'm not family-oriented, am not religious, don't like country music, and don't care about college sports or drink.

What's an album you would recommend everyone listen to once in their lifetime?

Davekp comments on Mar 19, 2019:

David Live.. An album recorded in 1972 at The Tower in Philadelphia Superb vocals

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 19, 2019:

You might specify that this is David Bowie. Some might not know who you were talking about. I concur that it's a great album.

I haven’t seen anything here about Alabama being the first state to introduce Sharia law.

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

The more I look at the white nationalists in the Repub party, the more I see them as a mirror of the Islamic extremists, like the Taliban, Al-Queda, and ISIS. Reminds me a lot of what Carl Jung, the great psychologist said about the shadow self, in which individuals end up hating others that ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 19, 2019:

@bingst Where each group fits into Jung's concept is that they are each in denial of how they are the same.

I haven’t seen anything here about Alabama being the first state to introduce Sharia law.

mzbehavin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

They mimic anyone in order to control females.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 19, 2019:

Bingo, that is what both groups are really about....

Are we going to allow Far-right apologists or possibly even agitators a forum here? Or?

Athena comments on Mar 18, 2019:

I believe in free speech and that everyone should have a voice. Mostly because, if there's an asshole nearby, I want to know.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 19, 2019:

Good point. Maybe not on Agnostic, but in the larger world, I like to know what the opponents of my politics are saying and up to....Know thy enemy.....

Rep. Steve King shares violent meme about Civil War

AtheistReader comments on Mar 18, 2019:

What I want to know is how a shithead like him gets elected?

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

See above.

Rep. Steve King shares violent meme about Civil War

gigihein comments on Mar 18, 2019:

un effin believable. I guess the good news is the new potus has legitimized being proud to be an asshole. How did he get elected?

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

See above.

I was only one when Woodstock happened.

aahouck49 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

Only one year old, my ex-husband was there, it was as crowded as THE MAYFLOWER, but he was there, me I was at Union Grove, the same weather conditions, there were at least 20,000 of us there that week-end! Joe Cocker, man did I love that man, that song! As a retired teacher, Pink Floyds, TEACHERS ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

I like your spirit Amelia. Have you seen the TV series that seems to draw on The Big Lebowski, Lodge 49? I think it's pretty good. I try to live by the spirit of The Dude, taking it as easy as possible, seeing life as gutters and strikes, trying to ABIDE.....

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

NorCalFreethinker comments on Mar 18, 2019:

I use it all the time in certain situations. I was in sales for 30 years and never cursed in front of customers. As soon as the place was empty the language turned to profanity for most in the store. My father used to say that people that speak like that lacked intelligence. According to all recent ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@NorCalFreethinker My old friend was a career computer salesman who sold to lumberyards.

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

NorCalFreethinker comments on Mar 18, 2019:

I use it all the time in certain situations. I was in sales for 30 years and never cursed in front of customers. As soon as the place was empty the language turned to profanity for most in the store. My father used to say that people that speak like that lacked intelligence. According to all recent ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

You worked in sales for 30 years? Have you ever seen Glengarry Glen Ross? Talk about F-speak among the salesmen when there are no customers around.......I knew a salesman a long time ago and the show sure seemed realistic to me. Now with your comment I've even more sure of that..

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

HippieChick58 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

It is not acceptable in a business office, so in my little corner of the world it is not acceptable. However, get me in traffic and.....

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@JackPedigo To each their own.....

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

VineetHonkan comments on Mar 18, 2019:

it has seeped into everything...there was a funny line from the old 90s movie CB4 where the record exec asked the trio if they cuss on their records...I found that to be funny...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@VineetHonkan I'm 60 yo but on many pop culture things I am admittedly an out of touch old fart....

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

Robecology comments on Mar 18, 2019:

Sorry; Profanity's not my thing. I learned young to disrespect those who use it... https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/157562/when-and-from-whom-did-the-quotation-vulgarity-is-the-effort-of-a-weak-mind-to

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Robecology Well played sir.....

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

HippieChick58 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

It is not acceptable in a business office, so in my little corner of the world it is not acceptable. However, get me in traffic and.....

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

I'm unable to drive comfortably without using one of my middle fingers occasionally.....would be almost as bad as not having turn signals.....I have the restraint when I need to exercise it, such as driving a school bus for seven years without ever cursing around the kids or using my middle finger behind the wheel. But sometimes it is so exhausting to restrain.......

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

VineetHonkan comments on Mar 18, 2019:

it has seeped into everything...there was a funny line from the old 90s movie CB4 where the record exec asked the trio if they cuss on their records...I found that to be funny...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

Which movie is CB4?

What does the “H.” in “Jesus H. Christ” stand for?

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

I don't know. I've just always enjoyed using the expression "Jesus H. Christ on a goddamned crutch!" as a way to express my ultimate disgust and feeling flabbergasted at some absurd situation....

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Zoohome I have heard and also used that variation myself, as in Jesus F-ing Christ.... I prefer the H. most of the time since it is less vulgar.

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

Robecology comments on Mar 18, 2019:

Sorry; Profanity's not my thing. I learned young to disrespect those who use it... https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/157562/when-and-from-whom-did-the-quotation-vulgarity-is-the-effort-of-a-weak-mind-to

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Robecology Back at ya! Nice wordplay on the Cork-Soaking Sock-tucker. I remember the SNL parody of The Exorcist with Richard Pryor playing a young priest and the writers cleverly reworded the demon's taunt to him as " Your mother sews socks that smell..".

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

Robecology comments on Mar 18, 2019:

Sorry; Profanity's not my thing. I learned young to disrespect those who use it... https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/157562/when-and-from-whom-did-the-quotation-vulgarity-is-the-effort-of-a-weak-mind-to

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Robecology All I have to say to you is F-you, Rob, lol!

Has profanity become the normal way to communicate?

slydr68 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

The F word is an amazing word...it can be conjugated to perform the task of ANY part of speech. Plus, studies have shown that people who curse are more intelligent...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

There, I knew that something about me showed I had above average intelligence, lol....

New high score!

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

Fat and sassy!

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Cast1es Nor should any feline king or queen be. I've never met one that was apologetic about it. They never tire of being fed.

What does the “H.” in “Jesus H. Christ” stand for?

CaroleKay comments on Mar 18, 2019:

*Hell on wheels*

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

My late wife and I used to attend a Unitarian church in Ames, Iowa where she had been a member of a cycling group the church had. What was its name? Hell On Wheels, of course...

Well, after some discussions with the lead artist, my boss chose to fire me instead of getting rid ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

The few times I was forced out of a job it was the same story each time. Namely that the workplace was dysfunctional and that the way management dealt with conflict in the workplace was to get rid of the person who was speaking up about the problems and was the newest person there rather than deal ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@kasmian For reasons that never seemed clear to me, managers usually won't get rid of bullies or toxic people in a workplace when it's so much easier to get rid of the new person who points out what's wrong or gets targeted by the bully. Maybe the bullies and toxic people have some close connection to management or serve a useful purpose for the manager, but either way you usually can't win in places like that once the conflict starts....

This is directly from Quora: How much does Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez know about economics in the ...

David1955 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

She's on the young side, and learning, and finding her place in the cutthroat world of politics, and she might make mistakes sometimes. But she's smart, a quick study and confident, and most of all she driven by idealism, not idealism in a vacuum, but idealism that needs to be translated into real ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

You're right. Look what the TPTB have done to Ralph Nader over the years. First, they try to discredit or ridicule you, as they did with Ralph, if they can't buy you off. Nader couldn't be bought, but the establishment successfully labelled him as a kook who opposed American prosperity and most Americans bought it. It that doesn't work, they will threaten you or kill you, as they did with MLK. My fear is that if AOC lasts until she is 35 and runs for prez, they will resort to the last option because I don't see the earlier tactics working with her.

Illusion of Choice: 1500 Newspapers, 1100 Magazines, 1500 TV Stations, 9000 Radio Stations, and ...

indirect76 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

That’s only true if 100% of people watch network TV, listen to radio and read newspapers/magazines/books. There’s a new thing called the internet where a lot of people get their content these days.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

True, and that's why the corporate media wants to eliminate net neutrality so they can have the same kind of control over the net as they do other mass media.

In a paragraph describe yourself, your passions and what you’re looking for in a partner, but also...

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

Doesn't talk about or identify as being family-oriented, has several or more common interests with me, doesn't talk about how they enjoy social drinking, doesn't list a lot of outdoor activities, doesn't talk about how much they love college sports, doesn't identify as religious, doesn't mention ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Sacrilege Because, like many or most people on Agnostic, I am mostly estranged from my family. I have no children, by choice, and my late wife and I were very happy with a healthy balance of friends and each other to spend our time with. My family is mostly a toxic group of people who were never very supportive or understanding of me during my adult life, so I replaced them with friends, most of whom I have known over 25 years, during my adult life. In my local area of Iowa, family is worshiped almost like God or religion. The vast majority of women on my paid dating site say in their profiles that they are very family-oriented, "family is everything to me, I love my family, my family is very close to me, etc.". I don't bother messaging those women as they are clearly of a different experience and mindset than me. Also, it seems clear that these women are making these statements to let men know that they are more interested, at least until they get to know the man and are "won over" by him, in spending time with their family than with a dating partner. I want someone who is more couple oriented than family oriented and thus is on a dating site to find someone to spend most of, not the minority of their time with, in relation to their family. It seems like most women in my area are on a dating site to seek a man that would gladly spend most of their time together as an escort for the woman to take on visits to their family rather than have a healthy balance of spending time with friends, family, and couple time with just the man they are dating. I won't settle for less than that. I had that in my marriage and I want it again.

Too young:

Pralina1 comments on Mar 18, 2019:

What's a SAT ?

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Sticks48 I was already aware of that acronym. Are you sure that's how it was being used here?

Too young:

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 18, 2019:

What is an SAT?

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

@Arouet None of us are losers for not knowing. I'm just honest and curious. I don't spend much time online except for Agnostic, so I'm always behind in learning the latest hip terms..

Wedding vows. Are atheists vows stronger than religious vows?

Deb57 comments on Mar 17, 2019:

The vows are as strong as the resolve of the people making them. I don't think religion has much bearing on that.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 18, 2019:

Exactly. Integrity, fidelity, and loyalty are either there or absent in a person, regardless of whether religion is involved or not.

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

EyesThatSmile comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Not only do they list that they want younger women...they also list that they want the woman to be thin or petite. Although I am not overweight, I take offense to men who are that rude and shallow (and I keep looking).

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@DevraisA1 I have seen some men, and women too, that are heavy that still move very well and lightly on the dance floor. It's all in the technique.

I have a close friend in my professional field whose intellect and wit are sexy to me, and we can ...

EyesThatSmile comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Yes. It has happened to me. Most definitely. The sparks were a total surprise. A New Year’s kiss from a long-time friend of the family. Absolutely NO previous interest.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

You are the exception that proves the rule, as they say.....

I have a close friend in my professional field whose intellect and wit are sexy to me, and we can ...

Deiter comments on Mar 15, 2019:

What does that mean, *physical chemistry*? Do you mean you don't find him visually appealing? By the above it sounds like what you're saying is that he should be sexy on paper, but that thing that happens outside of your free will, that mysterious spark, didn't ignite. This is what my ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

What my guru Deiter said.......

I have a close friend in my professional field whose intellect and wit are sexy to me, and we can ...

Robecology comments on Mar 15, 2019:

The big question is why you say 'but then, no". Was it eye contact? An offer turned down? A clear difference in physique? There's so many variables that it's hard to project success or failure here. In general...relationships that work well over time can evolve - and for me....the longer a...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

I see your point and agree with the general truth of it, but when it comes to attraction, I am always going to go with how the woman's appearance and physical presence makes me feel in the present, not some patient hope that they are going to improve their looks, physique, etc. And that's for two reasons. One, in my experience, what you see and experience when you meet them is what you'll get after you have been with them long-term. If anything, age itself is going to change their looks and physique, as well as mine, so I am not going to count on or hope that they improve in attraction with time. If that happens great, but I'm not going to invest myself on that assumption. Two, I try to maintain my health, but how can I promise that, in spite of my best efforts, that my health won't decline a lot with age? With all due respect to fitness buffs like Rob, even the best of us fall victim to genetics when it comes to illnesses or other conditions in older ages. I don't think it's fair for me to expect something from the woman that I can't offer about myself, like the promise that my attractiveness, looks, physique are going to improve or even hold up the same with aging. Your mileage may vary.....

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

EyesThatSmile comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Not only do they list that they want younger women...they also list that they want the woman to be thin or petite. Although I am not overweight, I take offense to men who are that rude and shallow (and I keep looking).

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@brainyactress Agreed..

This cat is prettier than I'll ever be. ?

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Ah, Persians are so cute to me, even when they have scrunched up faces.....

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@Kynlei Yeah, you're right, I didn't look close enough at his lower fur..

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

EyesThatSmile comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Not only do they list that they want younger women...they also list that they want the woman to be thin or petite. Although I am not overweight, I take offense to men who are that rude and shallow (and I keep looking).

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@brainyactress I agree with you BA about how most men react to a profile that advertises those body types, but speaking for myself I'm not interested in BBW. The other types, yes.....

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

NoMagicCookie comments on Mar 15, 2019:

After my grandfather's 2nd wife died he found a wonderful woman at the local old folks community center. It was like they were in high school, held hands, kissed with much affection, moved in with each other, went on ocean cruises together etc. . . . All was good until her children warned her ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@Robecology Sorry NMC, but I agree with Rob about online being the best of the options. I've tried the offline stuff of joining groups and going to activities. Those are too shallow of a potential dating pool. I made two good new friends from doing that, one male, one female, that was it. My local senior center, useless, I am 60 and everyone there is at least a dozen years older than me, along with having nothing in common with me as far as I can tell. Bars? Forget it, I don't drink and no one my age goes to them in my area.Social groups? I went to two widowers groups in my area for several months and all the women were at least ten years older than me. The well known local dance club/meat market specializing in people my age? See above note on bars. Everybody drinking very heavily, all the women there clearly either with a man or there just to hang out and dance with their gal pals and not interested in being hit on...... Agnostic.com? Hell yeah, like Rob said, it's as good as it gets, better than the paid sites. Only problem is for most of us there are zero prospects within 100 miles of most of us.

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

Booklover comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Hey ya'll are picking on Sue, a lot of us have a rant now and then and it usually includes a little sarcasm. This is a safe space. I hope so anyway. Besides I ran into one if those on here, no kidding almost word for word. Ok I exaggerate......he was worse. Lol. Welcome Sue, mostly we are nice ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@Robecology Agreed. Sometimes it depends on the object of the sarcasm. I use sarcasm a lot, it's my second language. I think it's ok when directed at a situation or myself, but when directed at someone else as the object of the sarcastic put down, then, yes, it's a sideways way of being mean while cloaking it in the cover of "just joking".

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 15, 2019:

The funny thing is I can believe and see the truth of most of Sue's criticisms, but, as has often been said on this site regarding dating behaviors brought up about one gender, it goes both ways. I long ago lost count on the paid site that I'm a member of about how many women who were in their ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@Booklover I agree they are shallow in my eyes, but that's why there are hookup sites like Tinder or even Ashley Madison for hookers. I agree that men who are just after hookups should stick to Tinder and leave the actual dating sites to the rest of us that are seeking a relationship. But don't tell Zesty that she's shallow, lol, even tho she seems to be only after men for sex. To each their own, I like her ornery humor even tho we are very different.

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

Booklover comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Hey ya'll are picking on Sue, a lot of us have a rant now and then and it usually includes a little sarcasm. This is a safe space. I hope so anyway. Besides I ran into one if those on here, no kidding almost word for word. Ok I exaggerate......he was worse. Lol. Welcome Sue, mostly we are nice ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@Robecology Jesus, Rob, and I thought I ended up writing novels too often, lol! I agree, there is too much gender bashing that goes both ways. And there is also too much lying and game playing by both genders that is the result of people who are injured, hurt, and full of baggage that seem to refuse to own, deal with and then stop projecting and taking out their own shit and baggage on people of the other gender they have never met, been lied to or hurt by, who are innocent parties who have never done anything to them. Whether it's encountering someone of the other gender thru Agnostic. com or a paid dating site, I agree with Rob, that maybe it's better to get some therapy, do some healing, and quit projecting your injury onto everyone you meet of the opposite gender that doesn't agree with you on everything........ Disclaimer: I am by no means perfect in dealing with my own baggage, but I have gotten therapy in my life and I do my best to judge and encounter members of the opposite gender as individuals. Lastly, I will say not nice things if I see something that does not seem to be the truth or to be unfair being said on these threads, which is my right as well as everyone else's.

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

JustRyanAgain comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Well, instead of just reading their profiles, perhaps you ought to message them and try asking some questions. If you want information from men, you usually have to ask.

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@SiouxcitySue Sue- I hope my comments have not offended you, I was not bothered really at all by your post but by the reactions in the thread by some of the women to Rob. I commend you for taking the initiative to message a lot of men on the paid site instead of waiting for the men to message you, because, no offense, but for both women and men who are average looking, as I would type both of us as, the rejection rate is pretty steep on paid sites. I know this because I have chatted about it with average-looking women on both Batch and Agnostic, as well as reading the comments of people, both male and female, on other threads about their experiences as average-looking people on paid sites. For what it's worth, my experience has been about the same. For every 60 messages I send to women on Batch, I will get replies from less than a handful. Of those 60, maybe two dozen will bother viewing my profile. Of the handful that reply, I will trade messages with them, discussing dealbreakers and getting to know more about them, and at most I will meet one or two out of those women in person. And I know damn well that for the three dozen women who don't reply to my message or view my profile, the reason is that my main profile pic that goes with my message doesn't look attractive enough to them to bother viewing my profile or, in many cases, even bother reading my message. Are they being shallow? Depends on who you ask... All I know is that we're in the same boat, just a different name on the bow....

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

Robecology comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Kind of a harsh evaluation for us senior men; full of exaggeration and bitterness. I'm a 73 year old who recently ended things with a 60 year old who simply was getting too old for me... She didn't like to bike nor swim...and no...neither of us attended "the gym 3 to 18 days a week, bicycle ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@Robecology Fitness and thinness, at least to the level that Rob is seeking, is not important to me in a partner, but like all of us, there are other things that are as important to me as these things are to him. We all have dealbreakers. For me, two big ones are loving music in general and not liking country music as well as liking some of the same music as me. Does that make me shallow? I don't think so, because music is a big passion of mine to where being deaf would be unbearable for me. Same with politics or materialism. I could not be with someone who opposed my core values in these areas. And I'm not going to start dating someone if their appearance holds no physical attraction for me.

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

EyesThatSmile comments on Mar 15, 2019:

Not only do they list that they want younger women...they also list that they want the woman to be thin or petite. Although I am not overweight, I take offense to men who are that rude and shallow (and I keep looking).

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

You, Marriane, are not thin, but curvy with a great figure. So while you would not get attention from men who are only after thin women, you undoubtedly would get a ton of interest from men on a paid dating site, including me, if you lived in my area. I don't agree with or understand this rigidity of some men about thinness, but I realize it's out there. My late wife was short and curvy, so I see their attitude as their loss, my gain....

After 5 years of withdrawal from life (after the death of my husband) I decided to try online ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Mar 15, 2019:

The funny thing is I can believe and see the truth of most of Sue's criticisms, but, as has often been said on this site regarding dating behaviors brought up about one gender, it goes both ways. I long ago lost count on the paid site that I'm a member of about how many women who were in their ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Mar 15, 2019:

@DevraisA1 Thank you also for the compliment on my writing and your interest in me if I lived in Cali. Seems like I would have no problem getting interest from women on Agnostic that live far away if they lived in my area. Unfortunately the women from this site who are in my area are not the type that are active with the forums here and probably have little in common with me besides being non-believers due to their having grown up in Iowa so they have adopted all the mainstream cultural traits (unlike me) except religion. Or, at least in two cases of women I messaged from my area, they are too good-looking for my level of looks even tho we had compatibility %s of 80 or above. As far as my writing, maybe it's in the genes as my brother got a MA in English Fiction writing and when I read I always pick stuff that is very well-written and challenging.