@xamountofstars Agreed.

@xamountofstars I think it's sad and scary too but just because you don't like something doesn't mean it isn't true. :'(

@xamountofstars yup. It's not all bad all the time but the last couple years have been pretty rough politically.

@xamountofstars Admin, we need a sympathise button.

Anyone else notice a rise in gun violence cortalates directly to a rise in gun control? Look at Chicago.

@jayneonacobb that has been pointed out,yes. The thing is to suss out why that happened and find workable solutions.

@Blindbird what happened is the government over reached in its power which created a massive criminal network. The prison system was privatised making criminals a commodity. In order to drive that sick industry they passed more laws to make more people criminals. They also passed laws that make it near impossible for someone to recover from their mistakes there by further perpetuating the vicious cycle.

@jayneonacobb on that I entirely agree with you. It's modern day slavery dressed up as justice

@Blindbird there's more to my argument than "I want my toys! Waaah!" I'm not an idiot. I see the connections and seedy underbelly of Washington.

@jayneonacobb I never said that was how you sound. You have been more angry than effective with this post though tbh. I can tell you from experience that when that tone is taken most people shut down and stop listening.

@Blindbird no, I'm not shut down, I was trying to sympathize with you without compromising my position.

@jayneonacobb lol I was referring to how others viewed your post.

@Blindbird I only use "you" as a place holder. I need to stop doing that. It doesn't mean you specifically, just a general concept of opposition.

That's your opinion. You're right, I don't need an AR-15. I can get a Sig .556. Its a better platform.

I have an AR-15. It is wholly and completely what you would consider an assault rifle. I own it because I live in a border city. I have used this weapon to deadly effect on intruders that did not follow the law, and did not obtain their weapons legally or even in this country. I also always conceal carry a 9mm sig saur, another weapon that would be on the list to be made illegal because of its magazine capacity. This weapon has also been used in a civilian capacity to stop a violent crime.

I am also a peace officer in that same city, and I have also used my civilian obtained "assault" rifle to protect and diffuse situations in the line of duty as an "assault" rifle is not standard issue. I choose to carry my 9mm sig as the sidearm that I provided myself in the line of duty because it is a proven, and capable weapon. I am still "outgunned", and those weapons that make mine look like toys were not obtained legally, nor do they come from this country.

Now, as a former marine, a peace officer, and a citizen who is alive because of the fact that I am able to own this weapon....try and take it and that weapon will be used to prevent its confiscation as every week I am first response to calls of unlawful individuals, who obtains weapons by unlawful means that laws would not have prevented, threatening and taking the lives of innocent people. By the large, the ones that come out unscathed are the ones that shot back.

It is people like me...law enforcement, military personnel, ems, and fire personnel that heavily support organizations like the NRA because we see first hand the importance of a citizen to have the right to choose. The NRA also heavily supports us, with my precinct alone receiving 50k already this year in donation. Sure you get radical gun nuts thrown in the mix in all of that, but for the most part the people supporting the NRA are the ones that see what the media doesn't show or tell you.

@SteveB we don't live in a democracy. We live in a constitutional republic. That constitution and Bill of rights recognizes my right to keep and bare arms. The bill of rights is a list of laws which prohibit government from doing whatever it wants. Or it's supposed to be. Thanks to anti American legislation like the patriot act and gun control those rights are being chipped away.

@SteveB if the government has it, I should have access to it. The problem isn't the weapons, it's a severe lack of respect and education regarding them. Your neighbor shouldn't have access to claymore mines if that's what they are doing with them. It's irresponsible and incredibly dangerous. He has proven himself unfit for such responsibility by committing a criminally negelegent offense. It is considered criminal negelegence or wreckless endangerment to utilize mines in such a capacity. That's how it is here anyway, I can't say what your state laws are. As i do not know where you are. Federally though as long as they take proper precautions it is technically legal, as long as no one is endangered. Honestly I'm surprised they can even get claymores. Do they have the permits or licensing for such devices? As much as I hate gun control the current law is still what I follow.

@SteveB well I know that currently it's federally illegal for him to posess those without proper licensing. He may have it, but it's rare, even in my line of work.

@SteveB A mini-14 is an "assault rifle" under the current terms used to describe such. So is an SKS. A 22 can be deemed an assault rifle. Certain variants of 12 gauge shotguns are deemed assault rifles. All can, and are, used to hunt deer in the configurations labeling them assault rifles with no second thought to the avg oppositionist.

An AR-15 is nothing more than a platform, and unless it is fully automatic (illegal in most states) it is not military hardware. An M4 is military hardware. A single fired rifle is not any different from each other. Giving it an extendable stock makes it no different than a fixed wooden one. A 30 round magazine makes no difference what so ever because even an untrained individual with practice can very quickly change out 10 round mags.

Armed civilians make a difference every day, they just don't make the news. I respond weekly to situations where a concealed carry individual was able to stop a violent crime in progress. I am also an officer in one of the open-carry states. You know the ones I have had a problem with, and personally been shot at by? Criminals...not would be or first time idiots, pure, unadulterated criminals who did not obtain their weapons legally. They also did not obtain them from the United States.

Now I would tend to agree with you on the government thing, but frankly, if it makes them feel better I can say first hand they cause less trouble that way. But the vast majority of people look to history for their argument against banning guns...which then leads to the "government taking over" thing. It really does get blown out of perspective though. The underlying idea not being that the average citizen has to fight off the government barricaded behind their front door, but that a citizenry with no means to protect themselves has no way to limit the government.

Now that all being said. I obviously support guns despite being an officer that has to potentially deal with the consequences of crackpots having them. I get to see the benefits of armed citizens, where the media does not allow the average person to see these things.

I can also tell you as a former marine, a current peace officer, and a highly trained individual, that I am more terrified of a .22 Ruger with a 10 round clip than I am an Uzi with a 30 round clip. Mind you I am using an explicitly illegal, highly dangerous, military grade weapon as an example. An AR-15 with a 30 round clip is no more dangerous than an 00 variant with a 10 round clip, in fact depending on the loads quite the opposite.

In all nothing at all needs to be done at the legislature level. Very little can be done at the enforcement level. The problem doesn't lie with the guns, nor does it the laws. The problem lies in this generation and the current social climates. This did not happen, at least frequently enough to be common knowledge in the 70s, 80s, or even 90s. Gun laws and views were far more lax back then. This would lead one to assume there is something else to blame besides the things that have been in place for 50 years. I'm 31, and to put it bluntly, the younger half of my generation and my son's generation are soft, ill-equipped children that society has somehow forgotten to teach how to cope with life.

edited to note: It should be pointed out that my freshman year of highschool marked one of the very first school shooting in the country, in San Diego. Granite hills highschool had an armed officer on site, who ultimately stopped the shooter....however what wasn't published in the media was the campas was located in a neighborhood. A little old man that lived right across from the bus circle that the individual opened fire in saw what happened, and from his front door pinned the shooter down with an "assualt" rifle until the campus officer could respond. Why that did not hit national news I have no idea, but the shooting itself sure did.

@aenith well said.

@SteveB you can buy an F-16 and the armaments for it with the proper licensing, permits and or a large enough bank account. I know a guy that owns a tank, legally. The fact is that arms is defined as all weapons and armaments.

@SteveB The Second Amendment is not about guns for " ...or hunting, sport shooting...".

@SteveB it does, but it would concern me far more if it were illicit for me to own such things. The militia laws need updating. It's antiquated but still true that anyone eligeable for the draft is technically a member of the militia. We need to fix that by getting rid of the "eligeable for the draft" part. I'd word it to say any legal adult who is sound of mind and body are a member of the militia, but that's just my desire for equality showing.

@SteveB Lol, unfortunately, that answer is way more politically charged than it really should be. For illegal weapons locking down the borders is a must and not just Mexico. How to do that, well there are 30 different ideas and most likely all of them have some merit.

But the sheer fact of the matter is that if a person wants a gun, they will get a gun. By the letter of the law (and yes this is riding a very technical line) any person under 18 that has committed a mass shooting has done so with an illegal firearm, as soon as that weapon left the premises it was stored without a legal-aged adult it was stolen. Now take this most recent one. He is 19 which means he can go and buy a rifle. Now you can argue all day long that he shouldn't be able to, and I would probably agree with you. However, that isn't the fault of the gun nor the gun laws. That is a direct failure of the educational system to not only get him the help he needed but to also make sure authorities knew he was dangerous. Guns are and have been the easy scapegoat for all of these issues when the true failure lies in many aspects of the community.

There is no coincidence that estimates for incarcerated individuals in this country range from 40-80% having a mental illness, usually untreated (yes that is a very broad range, but it is hard to pinpoint an accurate one when they receive 15 mins with a shrink). Because of shifts in society and "social justice" we are now seeing that same illness spill into places we did not see before. It isn't that it didn't happen, it's that instead of schools it was gas stations, or banks, or more conventional crimes. Society did not let you blame someone else before, as it does now so your violent offenders made an effort to better their lives however misguided it was, usually by robbery. Now the blame lies on everyone else, so instead of changing their personal circumstances even if by violent crimes they are out to punish those that they feel wronged them.

Unfortunately, it took decades for it to get this way with no one caring or noticing, and it will take decades to reverse it if the effort is even made. There are no in-betweens and frankly, most who can do something about it will take the easy way out because it is a political stepping stone.

Yes then something actually significant will happen. But until then, and who knows when that will be, we will continue to wait.

Why wait? Call your legislators TODAY. (ok, well MONDAY), but don't wait. The more we require them to preform their sworn duty to the people, the less they'll think they CAN wait it out.

How do you plan to take guns from people if you're not armed? Are you aware that the bill of rights is inalienable and unabridgable?

@jayneonacobb "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." In the absence of well regulated Militias, the right to bear arms cannot apply. We have a gun problem in this country that the Founders could not have imagined. And in the three days since Parkland, about 120 people were shot and killed. The mass shootings can make us forget that over 14,000 are killed by guns every year!
[gunviolencearchive.org]

Yup.

Why? Nobody is saying everyone should have a gun, just that they should have the option to. As long as they are not in prison or a psych ward where weapons are prohibited for obvious reasons.

@SteveB if they are released they should be sound of mind. If not, they should not be released. That's a problem with our mental health and penal systems.

@SteveB Licenses that allow you possess or purchase a gun or ammunition; it works here in Canada.

@SteveB It is not "in the spirit of the law". It is clearly stated the same as the ownership.

How do you ascribe meaning to advancement in this case? There's no such thing as an "Assault weapon" that's liberal propaganda. If these weapons are banned it will be because there are better, more instantly deadly ones readily available. You can't seriously believe that the very intelligent founding fathers couldn't foresee weapons advancement when they watched it happen in their life times.

@SteveB I researched the number because I heard it on MSNBC, It was there, 700 rounds per minute. I too think that is incredibly high.

@SteveB Who needs facts to have an opinion ey. all we need is an opinion, screw the evidence and just let loose the words and opinions. That's what the liberal media do anyway.

@Lancer OK lets go with your number of rounds, I use your facts and guess what , they have the exact same impact. Why do you feel you need an assault rifle, if I may ask

@EMC2 very simple answer actually. Have you ever read a history book? Do you know what war is? Did you know that America used to be a British colony? The first Americans rightly fought the Tyrannical British government in order to secure their own nation for their children.

Did you know that the British have committed genocide multiple times in several different countries?

History isn't always accurate I guess but if you can see governments in China, Russia, Venezuela, Mexico, Britain, Australia, etc. In their current states where the governments practice gun control on their citizens. Please, tell me which country is safe from violent crime? Because I'd really like to know.

Did my homelands gun control work? My friend was robbed at gunpoint a few years ago in broad daylight waiting for his school bus. There are shootings in Melbourne and Sydney. Gangs are assaulting the elderly and women. There are more and more violent youths on the streets every year.

We aren't talking about just 1 type of gun. We are talking about all guns. America was founded on the principle that a person must be allowed to defend themselves and their family. If you disagree with this then leave the country. It's your choice to remain or leave.

But don't force everyone to cater to your wishes.

The US government has already killed millions of innocent people throughout the world . What's to stop them from setting their sights on their own citizens? Because they already have. ????????

@jayneonacobb Well it is the term all use, Even fox uses the term. No need for semi automatic rifles. What is it you are afraid of? Do you have one

@Lancer Gosh no , I have never read a history book, All those years in college I was not educated in history, Maybe I should realize what you say is down right third grade level assertion. If you feel the need for a tank to protect your home go for it but we, who have faith in others and common sense, we can live with a hand gun and or hunting rifle but do not bring your assault weapons to the issue

@EMC2 Hahaha wow, faith in others? You must have had a real sheltered life. I grew up in middle class Australia and I never new that faith and common sense would stop a home burglary, rapist or murderer.

You want to use a handgun? You could easily shoot a bystander by accident, have you seen the sight picture of a handgun? It's accurate at best to about 20 meters. Any more and you risk hitting a bystander. Rifles are accurate at long and short ranges which is why close range semi-automatic are ideal. That's why police use M4 variant rifles to kill people who commit shootings. Because they don't want to hit a bystander by accident.

Hunting rifles also take a while to reload and re-arm after every shot.

Realistically, AR-15 or M4 variant rifles are ideal for safe use and accuracy.

I don't trust strangers so I don't believe in faith in others or common decency.

The bill of rights is non negotiable because of the terms used to describe its status as inalienable and unabridgable. Your argument has no weight.

Exactly my point-"terms used" who decided those terms? who believes in them being inalienable and unabridgable? If you truely believed this you wouldn't even bother trying to change them! oh wait nothing has changed! Case proven?lol.

Finally, some one else capable of objectivity on this subject.

@jayneonacobb Thanks, I appreciate it.

Obviously we can both agree that every unnecessary shooting is a tragedy but whenever people look for solutions they let their emotions and ego's get in the way of objective and logical thinking. It's sad really.

That's one of the reasons I think that we should encourage people with engineering degrees into government. Engineers are literally problem solvers who use scientific methods of analysis to fix real world problems. I have no idea why society doesn't realize this. We need more engineers who can be objective, logical and use well documented processes to solve this problem.

That's just my mini rant anyway

@Lancer I agree. I've long been a supporter of a fact based government. It's fair, it's based on science and it's unable to be misinterpreted by people's feelings.

@jayneonacobb Now that's a slogan I can get behind. We should make that a bumper sticker

It's not your right to infringe on others rights. What measures do you propose that are legal and constitutional to quell this tide of senseless violence. Nothing has stopped it yet, including gun control, which is not constitutionally legal to do.

@jayneonacobb I understand what you are saying, but do we other than the military really need AR weapons? I wish we didn't need guns at all, my nephew was murdered 6 years ago, our lives are not the same. Its such a cluster fuck! I'm just saying, I'm not telling at you.

@Presley1209 I'm sorry for your loss, it's a tragedy when innocent lovers are lost because of senseless violence.

If the government and criminals have them I need them too. They have them, I need them. It's how a balance of power is established between humans on this level.

@jayneonacobb Thank you. As far as the latter part of your reply, I guess we will have to agree to disagree. It would be nice if there were no guns at all to me but I know that will never happen.

@Presley1209 I'll happily agree to that.

How about tighter controls on free speech? Read the Second Amendment...it is not "the law" that allows semi-automatic rifles, it is a Constitutional Right. If you cannot abide that, get a two-thirds majority of states to amend the Constitution relative to that. By the way, the Second Amendment does NOT give a person the right to own weapons suitable for hunting.

@dahermit But you do have rules that govern free speech - try slandering or libelling someone or get up and call on others to bring down the government or bomb federal buildings. See how far the first amendment gets you in those cases. The second amendment just states that "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" but that doesn't prevent States from having laws governing when open carry is allowed or that fully automatic weapons are banned. You can and do have laws that over-rule or nuance the constitution. My point is that arguing the intractability of the constitutional amendments is a waste of time, just like statute law can be amended or nuanced in reality by case law.

no, it puts money and a lot of it into gun sales and "home protection"

This will only work if you stop the huge campaign contributions that the NRA makes in order to buy off our key Congressional persons. See other comments on this discussion regarding the role of the NRA in buying off our politicians.

I'm a millennial, but I know what inalienable and unabridgable mean. I also know what right means. I'm fighting for my right and yours to self defense. I'm highly educated in the subject. I have the highest degree in the field from the most prestigious school for the study. I think the real problem is millennial and others not understanding simple definitions. Instead they rely on feelings when it comes to the gun debate. That's a recipe for failure.

We have gun laws, they havn't stemmed the tide of violence. The black market is cheap and easy.

@jayneonacobb It won't be perfect but gun control laws will make a big difference.

@think-beyond they havn't yet, in fact places in the US with stricter gun control laws breed gun crimes. That's a statistical fact.

@SteveB better than you would think. Look at the war on terrorism. They have nothing compared to most people in the US and we still have yet to defeat them.