@powder So muslims are freedom fighters?

@powder But it's okay for them to make war on military infrastructures? Israel"s? Then they want to conquer Israel, dismantle it, and turn it into an Islamic state? And that's okay?

@powder I don't know. All good points. I'm tired of talking about it and I've been painting all day. Just glad I'm not in the middle of it.

That"s an ignorant answer. You know that"s not going to happen.

@Storm1752 really ignorant. Who knows what is going to happen. Nobody thought that Donald would win either.

I'm sorry for calling your answer 'ignorant.' By doing so I was indirectly calling YOU ignorant, and no one deserves to be unduly insulted. I am just so frustrated at some people's attitudes toward Israel, which is basically, if you strip away much of the verbiage, Israel does NOT have a right to exist, that their creation in 1948 was a travesty. Well then, just say so. According to them, they should just pack up and leave. And I will agree it was unfortunate. Like many of the arbitrary borders created by the colonialist as the dismantled their empires, it caused more harm than good. The Palestinians were displaced and their neighbors refused to assimilate them, choosing instead to house them in permanent refugee camps. That also was a travesty, but perhaps an understandable one. It should be clear by now most Muslims will never accept the existence of the Jewish state. If it takes 100 years, or a thousand, they will defeat them. Hey, they still have designs on, say Spain, which was Muslim for hundreds of years. Islam NEVER accepts defeat. A conquered territory is always considered sacred ground. It's an attitude enshrined in the Koran. It's ridiculous, but all religion is ridiculous, and as we know is used by "pious" men to cause much bloodshed and grief. The Christian's destroyed the civilizations of North and South America and elsewhere. They REALLY wanted the land and its treasure, but insisted in part it was to "save" the indigenous peoples. Talk about hypocrisy!
Israel, however, is different in this sense: it is not just a distinct culture, a "people," it is also a religion. Because the New Testament, probably authored by Roman's to destroy them because their instransgience to their rule, blamed them for the death of "Christ" (who never existed), after they brutally massacred many of them and dispersed them, replacing them with a Rome-friendly fiction. This has resulted in their persecution throughout the centuries in the Christian world, culminating in the Holocaust. Ironically, Hitler may have actually done them a "favor" by once and for all making it clear they'd never be accepted in "Christ-"obsessed Christendom. Should have then moved them to some unoccupied land somewhere (if such a land existed)? Well, yes, maybe, It's debatable. It would've spared the world the present conflict. But the Jews themselves wouldn't have been too happy about it!
But they didn't. They shipped them back to the Middle East, and there remain, a successful, vibrant liberal democracy right dab in the middle of Allah Country! Great. Just great. Now what? THEY ain't going nowhere! But the Arabs say, oh yes they are! You can just forget the "peace process;" it's a joke and always been. An indestructible Scorpion in a glass box with an invincible Mongoose, forever circling, forever poised to strike. What to do? Well, da*n good question, but Israel knows the "right to return" is stealth surrender. Never going to happen. Islam knows this, and will never stop insisting. The U.S., under the delusion "Christ" is coming back any day now, props them up with quasi-religious fervor. Islam, convinced the final Caliphate is right around the corner, "knowing" Palestine is THEIR land and have to have it back before their war against the rest if the world's other gods and religions can re-commence, will never rest until the Jews are gone. Meantime, the Palestinians sit there stranded, never to return home, never to be adopted. The truth of the matter is, they're screwed. The ONLY viable answer, as simple as it is impossible, is for the world be become agnostic and realize it has all been a bad dream. Sorry. Wish there was a way short of that to get them all singing 'Kumbaya,' but there isn't a "final solution," and never has been.

The Arab states are democracies?

@Storm1752 I did not say that. I do not approve of the theocratic control of their countries either, but I also do not deny their right to exist either.

@powder Israel is NOT an Arab state.

@powder, @wordywalt But you deny Israel THEIR right to exist?

@Storm1752 You evidently read selectively to fit your attack. The first thing I said on this post was that I believe in Israel's right to exist.

Nah. Even if humanity could remove all religion as something to fight over, we'd find something else to replace it.
We're assholes that way.

You mean if Republicana turned into Democrats Democrats would still oppose them? What?

Oh and Muslim countries don't have abysmal human rights records? Do you even know what you"re saying?

Arab states aren't theocracies and dictatorships?

@Storm1752 You have a serious reading comprehension problem if you have to ask those questions. @KKGator Was pretty clear.

@indirect76 Explain his "clear explanation. Maybe is a radicalized democracy which MUST be ideologically-driven because they are being attacked by theocratic dictatorships which want to wipe it off the face of the earth? Maybe Jewish citizens elect bellicose leaders because it is necessary to their survival?

@Storm1752 My friend, please reread her comment and tell me what you think her stance would be on the theocratic dictatorships attacking Israel.

@indirect76 I'm just telling you my point of view. Israel is a liberal democracy. There"s a huge difference between that and an Israeli theocracy. It is not a theocracy. Liked would be voted out tomorrow if suddenly the threat to Israel vanished.

@indirect76 Likud

@Storm1752 I don’t know who or what Likud is and I don’t see how any of what you said is a response to what I asked. It might be a language barrier thing. I don’t know, but I wish you the best in your endeavors.

@indirect76 And I wish you the very best as well. I especially hope you never find yourself in, say, Iran, where they would surely have their way with you, my friend.

@Storm1752 Cool your jets, don't come at me with your bullshit.
The topic was Israel, and that was what I addressed. I will, generally, try to stick to the topic at hand.
I'm not fan of ANY theocracy, and generally most of the countries in that region are theocracies, regardless of what they call themselves, and they ALL have abysmal human rights records.
Don't you dare try to make it seem like I was defending ANY of them, because I most definitely was NOT.
I have NO use for ANY religion. I have no use for any government that operates under any religion.

Do not conflate my comments to mean ANYTHING but what I specifically said.

As far as the US goes, since this is where I live, I fight against the influence of ANY religion (in this case, it's primarily christianity) on public policy.

You can shove your righteous indignation right up your ass if you're going to twist anyone's comments (especially mine) to suit your own agenda.

@Shouldbefishing
Not for nothing, but the semantics of this do not concern me.

However, just as a point, once someone says they are an atheist, they are no longer a jew, a christian, a muslim, or any other damned thing.
As soon as someone determines that they are an atheist, they cease wearing ANY religious label. If someone else attempts to put a label on me, or anyone else, I have every right to tell them they are full of shit.

As far as that entire region goes, if they're ruled by religious laws, they are a theocracy.
I'm against all religions and all theocracies.
I am an anti-theist.
If that makes me an anti-semite, again, not really giving a shit.

One last few things: 1) Israel is NOT a theocracy, it is a democracy which has to do certain things to survive, like restrict it's voting population. If it didn't, it would cease to exist, 2) You said you were "anti-Israel." Okay. That's a legitimate position. You don't have to be an Islamic terrorist to feel that way. I would have rather they were never born into existence. Would have saved the world a lot of grief. BUT THEY WERE, AND HERE THEY ARE. And, they are not going anywhere. You, I, and everybody else has to deal with that fact. And since they ARE here, I support their right to exist. Hey, all countries were formed somehow. Look back a thousand years, or two, or three, and see how different national borders were back then. National boundaries change over time. Who knows what they will look like a thousand years from now? So, in the end, does it really matter? 50 years from now we will both be dead. Will it matter to us then, this bullshit problem these bullshit religions are having with one another? I don't follow the news. This territorial and religious dispute has absolutely nothing to do with me. I have an opinion which doesn't matter even to me. So if you want me to shove it up my ass, I will do so gladly. Have a nice day.

"yahweh is coming to town" thank you thank you thank you

making a list..anyone else old enough to remember 'santa is coming to town'.

Are you anti-Muslim as well?

@Storm1752 ,
what do you mean as well?