I was reading a post by a member about how hard it is to find love with another atheist because not too many people identify as such. I have to agree with him. I have these two situations that I am currently in and I would like to ask what the members of this community would do in those situations.
First. In my field of work I have to meet with clients and do their Medicare plans, insurance plans and retirement plans for them. A vast majority of them ask me either when I first meet them, or at the end of our meeting if I am a Christian and if I have accepted Jesus as my savior. I have heard on many occasions from clients and potential clients that they would not do business with anyone who is not a Christian.
Second. I am talking with this girl and she is a good person, and almost every conversation and text and meme that she sends me has God bless you. Thanks God. God willing. Everything starts with something about God. It wasn't like that when we first started talking, but now that she has gotten more trusting and comfortable with me, she says them all the time. I haven't decided whether to pursue this relationship further. I am weary of getting involved with someone who is too religious. I do value our friendship, but I can see that she wants more and I don't want someone that is too religious.
My two questions are.
1- Would you answer no to the question of being Christian and accepting jesus and severely endanger your ability to earn a leaving.
2- On the relationship scenario. Would you come out and say to this other person that you do not believe in God and potentially lose a friend.
the performance of my job has nothing to do with whether or not i am of any particular belief system, so i will keep my personal life out of how i professionally serve your needs, thanks so much.
if you are even the slightest bit considering being with this woman you MUST be honest. her "god" shit bothers you. and you are atheist. i mean really, you're gonna keep this from her? you realize this is called DISHONESTY. which is the other side of the coin... "lying". is that the kind of person you are?
I have avoided answering the question as far as work. If I was to answer them the way that you advised, I would be out of business. There are more diplomatic ways to answer without answering them. This is the south after all. The relationship scenario I will tell her if I decide to pursue a relationship. So far I am leaning toward just staying friends.
@noworry28 oh don't be a DOLT. i did not mean that to be word for word.
i am a therapist. from time to time someone comes in that is adamantly xSTAIN. and i address them and their beliefs where they are and actually connect with them, whilst not believing a whit of what i say. no lack of respect for the peace that their belief may bring. but, really, what am i going to say to them - there are studies in usa and uk that PROVE that religious belief is a mental illness? (yes, i have ACTUALLY seen and read these studies at named unis)
ON the job I'd never share that I'm an atheist. My dad was career Naval officer, and an atheist. He posited that his job was the most important aspect to his presence, and since he didn't work in a church, there was no need to be religious.
Seems people in certain cultures get some sort of comfort thinking they are dealing with like-minded people, when in truth there's no certainty that the person is a good, honest person. We all know of the diddling priests, e.g. But they ask, and the answer that the company does not permit employees to discuss private matters ought to be the best answer. I'll look forward to the other answers that pop up to see how others feel.
On the relationship side, BE FECKIN' HONEST. If it turns out to be a deal breaker, wipe your brow and mutter "Whew" as you walk away. Unless said girl thinks she can fix you and bring you to Jebus. Then RUN. Someone who puts all the godish shyte in messages is too insecure to be a partner unless the other person is just as insecure, IMO.
I hear you with th he relationship part. I have walked away from potential relationships with people that I considered good because they were too religious and would want to fix me. I will tell the truth and if I decide to pursue a relationship and ser what she she decides. The work part, so far I have danced around answering those questions.
Regarding your love life, you can decide whether you'd be okay with compromising your lifestyle, or values in order to find a partner. This would only apply if you're certain you'd be alone otherwise and would prefer not to be.
Regarding work, I was shocked to learn this goes on. A way to dodge the question is to say, "Yes, yes of course I have. In fact, I just sold him an insurance policy last week."
You'll know you're joking about both, but they won't.
I don't want to start a relationship with a lie if I decide to move forward with that relationship I will tell her the truth and she can make the decision to accept me as I am. The work situation happens all the time. I have avoided answering that question so far. I dance around it by talking about the idea of doing the right thing and following good teaching that have been passed on throughout history.
People either try to "save" you or don't want anything to do with you when they realize you don't believe in God. Where I work people go around with God this and Jesus that on their t-shirts and sweaters. Makes it hard to want to date anyone around here.
I think the key phrase is around here. I know your experience would be very different in some parts of the country.
That's up to you. I don't think it really matters other than how you feel about it.
This is a bit easier. If she is capable of being a friend, she will respect, if not accept, your worldview. If not, then you lost nothing.
I would tell clients that this is not a church, but a business, so let's get down to business.
In personal situations, I would be honest, even if it means losing a friend. I would not myself sever the relationship, but if the other severs it, that's her choice.
I would just say that is a topic I don’t like to discuss and hope they respect that. If pressed, I’d lie and say I was Christian but quickly move off the subject.
This is one you can’t lie about. Especially if has the potential for a relationship. If you lose a friend or a possible relationship then so be it. It wasn’t meant to be. You got to be true to yourself.
I also think you’d be surprised about how many people are tolerant to atheists even if they say they are not. A lot of people say “I’m catholic” or “I’m Jewish” but don’t take it too seriously. Or are not a practicing [fill in the blank]. So don’t think your only relationship possibilities are only with other atheists.
Personally, I’m an atheist since birth, my parents raised me with no religion and I’m very happily married to a catholic whose parents are very serious about their religion. We make it work and respect each other. Don’t think your dating pool is limited to other atheists unless you’re the one limiting yourself.
Not only with regards to atheism per se but with any semi-personal joke or comment.
For years I would tell coworkers to never worry about hurting my feelings. I've always been more comfortable with forthright relationships.
The time they should start to worry is when I stop joking with them because that means that I don't trust them.
With people I've just met of course (as customers), I wouldn't have time to learn trust or gain theirs so I would tend to avoid personal comments. With customers if they asked that sort of question I'd play the professionalism card and not answer. If they wanted to make (likely correct) assumptions they could.
For the love interest... I've been out of the game for a very long time. But all my life honesty has been one of my driving principals. If my positions were a problem for her, oh well.
For both questions, I've never (that I know of) been forced to end a relationship that I was serious about.
I always try not to hurt people, but I've never been driven to lie. (knock on wood.)
I would tell her the truth if I was going to pursue a romantic relationship but I will stay friends with her. They always think that they can change and save you. Work wise I answer no by using their own teaching and they don't even realize that I am answering no.
Just become a Christian, solves both problems
You don’t have to believe it or get entrenched in it. Constantine managed okay!
No one would ask about religion at work on the left coast, at least not in tech. Depending on who asked me, I'd either tell them the truth, or say I don't discuss religion or politics at work, or make a smartass remark...
I haven't ever have a job like yours. If I did, I'd say that it is against company policy to have religious or political discussions with clients. If you are part of medium or larger company, they probably do have rules like that.
On the relationship side, you need to, IMHO, tell her in person ASAP.and openly discuss it. Why would you want to be in a relationship with someone with strong religious beliefs who wouldn't accommodate your belief system, or lack thereof? Of course she might be saying those things because she is assuming that's what you want to her to say. So it is possible that her belief system is similar to yours. Find out. See if you can come up with an arrangement that works for both of you. Good luck!
To answer question 1 - yeah, you can fake being religious if you have the stomach for it. I did so for most of my life with my grandma because I knew it would crush her to know I was an atheist. It's easy to fake it if you just have to play along here and there - and in your case it looks like the engagements are short enough each time to be tolerable.
As for question 2...the answer stares you right in the face and you can't see it? C'mon now.
Tell your friend the truth and deal with the consequences. If she doesn't like you after knowing the truth, so be it, she can leave the friendship and go somewhere else with that bigotry. That's what they call it when someone's truth is intolerable to someone else, you see.
You don't want that in your life.
Would be good to know where she stands on that, wouldn't it?
Tell her the truth, for goodness sake.
Now to those who would scoff at my apparent double-standard - lie to grandma, tell the truth to friend? I think you know the difference already. You don't get to decide who your family is, but you definitely need to learn how to co-mingle with them harmoniously, and that means sometimes you need to put aside your beliefs for the good of the relationship. My atheism wasn't more important than my grandma.
You get to choose your lover or spouse.
Totally agree with all you said!! Amen!
I would answer potential clients with "Thank you for asking, I am fully devoted to my faith." They do not need to know more, and you've managed to sidestep the question without actually lying. They have no business knowing the texture or shape of said faith.
Personal relationships. Ugh, can be messy. I tolerated Christianity in my 21 year marriage. I did manage to raise our children without religion. Now, with dating, I put it all out front. If you have problems with the gay community, minorities, or others because they are different than you, then just move along, cause I am that different.
Good luck with both endeavors.
Sigh. I work medicare customer service for members as well as brokers. That would probably be the least offensive question I was ever asked throughout the course of my day.
As for GF I think religious discussion are interesting but as a way of life..not so much. I would be curious as to why she believes. For me not believing meant I would never be reunited with my father. He obviously passed on. For a very long time I believed because I couldn't let go. There are other people who seem mildly superstitious about religion. That if they don't believe, bad karma will surely follow them the rest of their days. Perhaps you will get to know her even better if you have this discussion.
#1 As a salesperson you will accept daily lying or be fired or starve. There are so few careers that require no doodling with unvarnished truth. You might re educate in accounting. Numbers do not lie unless you are running for public office.
#2 Look more closely at the girl. What does her family do for fun ? Weekly churchgoing is suspicious, twice a week is a deal breaker. Does fam smoke ? drink ? Cuss? Gamble ? Play golf ? A lot of peeps pick up OMG from our culture. If they say Gosh be alarmed. If you take her out does she rock sexy? Have a serious discussion. DO NOT ADMIT YOU ARE AGNOSTIC. Say you were raised in a not particularly observant family, you know, Christmas, Easter, weddings, funerals and that's as far as your interest goes. If she wants more Jesus than that, you are not the kind of man that would make her happy.
its hard to find someone regardless and if you are looking for the perfect mate and not willing to compromise then stay alone
for f*** sake there are ppl that love each other and are of diff religions or political views or color and they make it why can't believers and non believers women marry men with small peckers do I think they deserve more of course but if they can stand it who am I to make trouble
so stupid I have a son in law I dearly love and he is very religious and occasionally we discuss and it works for him so the hell what I still love him and my damn son thinks trump is so great granted we don't discuss that but I still love him get over yourselves
In the situation where your job, method of making a living is at stake, your best position is a position that is truthful, but also business-like. Businesses in general discourage any representatives from discussing religion, and you should tell them that you are not at liberty to discuss your personal beliefs.
That is you though . . . with me, if someone brings up religion, they are giving me the permission to hammer a couple of nails into their decrepit religious coffin. Like, where in the hell did Noah get the penguins and polar bears? But that is just me.
When people start bringing "god" into the conversation, it is like the wino who brings alcohol into the conversation, they are attempting to manipulate you, and that is fine if you do not mind being manipulated during the whole time you deal with them, meaning pretty much all the way into a relationship and beyond . . . the truth is not always pretty, but it certainly is magnificent. I have seen a lot of instances of women dragging men into the religion . . . . my brother married one about a week after meeting her . . . . it is a form of manipulation that, as an extremely independent person, I could never, in any way, tolerate.
I'm inclined to agree with those who would answer that it would be unprofessional to discuss religion or politics in a work setting. I think that is something that many fundamentalist Christians would accept, as they are socialized to be hyper-focused on following rules. But I also recognize that in the Bible Belt, this gambit might not always work. In that event I would do what I must to function, even if it involved pretending to be of their tribe. Of course, as a former evangelical that would be quite easy for me to do. I know how to say a few suggestive things that wouldn't actually be dishonest but would cause them to assume I were a believer. Sometimes it just requires a couple of well placed "god willings" or similar.
As for the girl ... it is a function of how much of this is verbal tics vs stuff she takes seriously. It requires, I think, an honest conversation about what she really believes, and what you really (dis)believe, and then let the chips fall where they may. No serious relationship can survive dishonesty. It is, if you will, the cross we atheists must bear. I am not one who believes you can't marry a believer, but there are all kinds of believers. I would only consider one who held their beliefs rather loosely and had zero desire to impose it on others. That means, in practice, someone who doesn't believe scripture is inerrant and to be taken literally, and who does not believe in the concept of corporate guilt, which is the primary wellspring of attempting to control people outside the religion, and to proselytization.
All that said, my preference would still be for a fellow atheist, all things being equal.
Smile and fake it a lot in your business dealings. As for the possible relationship this is not going to work out. Now you get to the real problem. If you tell the girl you do not believe in god will she in turn tell your business prospects? You could be caught between a rock and a hard place, as the old saying goes.
You might try replying with “faith is a gift I have yet to receive” - it’s not dishonest, and perhaps innocuous enough to baffle them.
In terms of your relationship, I think it would be appropriate to say there’s a vast chasm between your religious beliefs.
I feel like if he says that then he's opening the door for his clients to talk more about Jesus and why he should be "saved."
I tell that if more people followed the teaching that they said were given by jesus like do mo harm, help the poor and some of the writing of that commandment not to kill and to love thy neighbor but not his wife and if mankind followed some of the good teachings that have been passed on throughout history, we would all live better lives. I use other religions fables as well. I basically say no without them figuring out that I am answering no. I would not pursue a relationship without telling her that I am an atheist. I will not however pursue a relationship. I believe that being friends is as far as our relationship will go. Even if she said that she was ok with me being an atheist I know from part experience th that she would be thinking that she can save me and make me a believer.