@MissKathleen Not necessarily.

@barjoe or, by the time the woman can drag the man to counselling it's already too late.

@Cyklone Some of those counselors are troublemakers. Just saying. It's not always the man's fault. Sometimes the counselor sides with the husband, but they shouldn't take sides. I'm not a believer in therapy, at least not for myself.

@barjoe Hence my comment. Most males have exactly the same opinion.

@Cyklone Some women have that opinion as well.

@barjoe True. And unfortunately it means that often help is sought too late. I targeted men in my comment though mainly because abusive males refuse to accept culpability and only attend therapy after the wife has already separated, and abuse is a large part of marital problems. Not always though. What this also means is that if only the woman attends then it is most likely that the therapist empowering the woman will cause the destruction of the relationship

@Cyklone If a woman is being abused, counseling will do more harm than good, it could prolong an abusive relationship. I'd like to see what percentage of couples who seek counseling end in divorce. My guess is 90%

@barjoe I can't speak for the counsellors in your country, but bullshit on both counts. Women seek counselling to help end abusive relationships and avoid repeating the problem and I don't know where you got your 90% statistic from, but it's not true if both attend. If only one goes it's often because, most of the time, the male "is not a believer in therapy" and that's often an indicator that he is not that invested in the relationship anyway because he's putting his pride before his love. It does sound to me as if your experience wasn't helpful. I'm not a relationship counsellor but I work in mental health and am very familiar with all aspects of this area and although there is good and bad in every profession your judgement of the whole profession is uncalled for and unfounded.

@Cyklone A man who's an abuser. Does he deserve any consideration whatsoever? I think he should just be written off completely. Don't you think there are females who don't believe in therapy? A majority of marriages end in divorce regardless of whether they attended therapy.

@barjoe sorry, I did further edits while you were writing. I believe an abuser does deserve consideration if they want to fix it, but it is very rare that a woman will continue that relationship because he has already betrayed the relationship on a profound level. If the man gets help it normally means he'll do better in future relationships. Abuse in a relationship plants the seeds of destruction which are almost impossible to root out. Of course there are females who don't believe in therapy but it is overwhelmingly males who refuse help or who say it is weak or that here is nothing wrong with them

@barjoe It is not for the therapist, or anyone, to decide other's lives, but to support them in their goals. If the woman doesn't want to leave an abusive male it is the therapists job to help her do that safely. And to question her motives for doing so. Unless you've seen learned helplessness or understand how hard it is for a slave to free themselves, especially when their family and society will penalise them, you have no idea of the strength it takes for a woman to leave. Especially if it also means she might be making herself and her children homeless, or that he will try to kill them. Many women, and their children, are killed by men when they try to leave.

@Cyklone Hopefully she has a lot of older brothers with big fists.

@barjoe Sooo many times I've wished I knew a good hitwoman.