Positioning for 2024, trying to appease both wings of the party- Hawley/Cruz and Romney/McConnell. Which is an impossible task. You can't agree simultaneously with those who don't believe Biden legitimately won the election and those who do. You can't simultaneously ignore and follow the Constitution.

It's supposed to be "10,000%", for some reason the site keeps editing out the 10. I keep fixin', it keeps editin'.

@Paul4747 sorry. I was confused by that and the European decimal, lol. Now, it makes more sense.

I would agree with that, if only there were any sign that he had talked Trump out of anything. It's been left to the courts to shoot down his executive orders and restrain his most absolutely ridiculous urges. Pence is the only adult left in the room precisely because he doesn't speak up.

@Paul4747 perhaps. I wouldnt put it past Pence to "make a deal" with the president to get some of his agenda supported. But that I expect from any politician, compromise and consessions to win a more important battle.

I just am impressed that on one of our worst days as a nation, when he was literally seconds away from being lynched by a mob of the presidents goons chanting for his death, the same mob that attacked the capitol police, he was whisked away under protection and could have ended the session and come back another day with massive protection, but he stood his ground came back and did his duty for the American people.

That takes courage and guts. I won't vote for him due to his policy choices, but I surely will respect him, and shake his hand in thanks for doing what was right under threats from all around including his direct superior.

@MakeItGood Pence, like McConnell, earned a little respect on the 6th. But only a very little compared to what they would have earned by standing up years ago and doing their duty before it went this far. Even a month ago, and it might not have gone this far. Especially if they had simply said, "There was no fraud, the election was not rigged, Biden is the legitimately elected 46th President. Mr. Trump needs to do the right thing and concede. And all of you in the Republican party need to stop encouraging him with fantasies that he might somehow still win."

Alternatively, he is loyal to a fault because Trump chose him. He went from a career in Indiana politics (a state most people think of only in connection with cornfields and college basketball) to Vice President and, in a normal presidency, heir apparent to the next nomination. He's another Dan Quayle. But this last four years was anything but normal.

@Paul4747 I think he hung his hat in the wrong camp....

@Canndue The problem with being religious; the Pence family debated and agreed that "God" had a calling for Mike to go and be Veep. Didn't matter that Trump was objectively one of the foulest and least Christian people ever to be fawned over by the religious right.

I'm amazed at the ability of religious people to discern what God wants, especially when their books say in so many places that men cannot know the mind of God.

@Paul4747 Oh, good sir, you misunderstand. It is only you that cannot know the mind of god. True Scotsmen, er, I mean Christians know his will because he tells them so, and anyone who would claim his will isn't to prop up a racist, adulterous rapist who would nominate crazy Christian judges must not be a true Christian able to hear his word.

Just a guess.

@JeffMurray Perhaps.

I just take note of how rare it is for conservative Xians, after a long period of devout prayer, to realize that God wants them to do the exact opposite of what they were contemplating, rather than just telling them, "Go ahead, you do what you want, I got your back."

@Paul4747 Wouldn't it be so interesting to be able to see inside people's minds to know if they actually believe the shit they say or just say it to justify shit? That would be a legit super power.

Exxactly. I can foresee Trump stepping down on the 19th so Pence can pardon him.

I can also foresee Trump drawing up a mass pardon for all the rioters who were involved in the Capitol insurrection, as one last act of shame.

Being a sycophantic slime bucket when trump is the top dog, doesn't mean pence wouldn't rip his throat out if he thought he could be the alpha.

@JimG What personally advantageous motivation would he have to do that?

@JimG Wait, why am I even questioning why you think that, we know it's false. Nancy and Chuck already approached him about 25thing that fat pile of democracy cancer and he wouldn't even take their call.

@JeffMurray I didn't say it would be to his advantage. I was actually stating that I don't think he would remain loyal if a betrayal would further his agenda. It's pretty clear that the loyalty of Trump's supporters does not extend to him.

So basically, what I think is that Pence will look out for his own interests. On the 25th amendment, I am certain that, pence realizes the dangers outweigh any benefit. Even if trump's cabinet pledged to support him, would you trust them if you were pence?

@JimG

1. It's doesn't have to be his cabinet. It could be a body designated by Congress.
2. In the first sentence you said, "I didn't say it would be to his advantage." And in the second you said, "if a betrayal would further his agenda". I don't really know what you're trying to say. People are already calling for him to be hanged, so if he really wanted to fuck over Trump and/or grab power or whatever else you think he's looking to do, I don't see any downside for him to 25th.

@JeffMurray The word "if" indicates a conditional or hypothetical scenario. In my opinion, pence would turn on Trump if he thought it would benefit him. I don't know what you're trying to read into that, but you're free to disagree rather than trying to explain why it isn't to his benefit.

@JimG In just trying to boil it down not disagree. So you don't believe he thinks it would benefit him considering he's turned down ample opportunity to turn on Trump.

@JeffMurray Yes, that's correct.

@JimG Reading back through I remembered this was what I was questioning:

doesn't mean pence wouldn't rip his throat out if he thought he could be the alpha.

But he literally could be the alpha by metaphorically ripping his throat out and had the opportunity to do so. My only thought was that it must be that he's a pussy bitch with no spine, though I am willing to entertain other theories like Pence and Trump are in a 5 year long sexual domination relationship and he knows crossing him politically would likely bring to a close the best sex he's ever had... other than maybe those 2 summers at Bible camp before they realized the kids shouldn't have unsupervised rec time.

@JeffMurray That's an interesting perspective, I was convinced that the reason was his lack of a spine, but I'm not sure now. I have thought since he was governor of Indiana that he has to be in denial about his orientation.