Oh i did, indeed. chuckle Please refer to my previous responses to this thread to get an idea of what occured in response to his actions. I will not allow anyone to push themselves upon me in such a crude fashion and in the shadow of the death of his own child, whom I Loved. It was dishonorable. It was inappropriate. I made sure to express this in various manner from terse to blunt to outright. I left No Gray areas. You can believe that. I am no stepping stone. I won't tolerate it.

This is good advice @Sadoi you would be wise to follow it. I also agree that you need to put yourself first. Put on your own oxygen mask BEFORE helping others.

In this instance, telling him that you just got into a relationship with someone else may help him realize you are not available to him or anyone. Definitely do not be alone with him.

Good luck!

@shockwaverider No, I wouldnt lie to him. No need for that. I prefer not to hide nor make excuses in order to tip toe around a situation. Sometimes you must be clear when a person is attempting to take advantage of you, otherwise, how will they ever learn? If you just lightly tap them back, how will they understand the consequences to their actions? After I asked him over a dozen times to please stop and he opted of his own accord to continue, and to not only continue, but to get more and more persistent, then I believe there must be justice to follow, an unpleasant response, if you will. He may not like what the response Was, but he will surely understand the next time he feels the need to ingratiate himself upon me or anyone else for that matter, that maybe he should back the heck up, maybe this will not pan out in the way he imagines it could/should/would. I tried to be gentle, but gentle, he felt, meant Weak. After I realized his perception of my kindness, how he manipulated it and mistook it for weakness, I knew it was time for him to understand my compassion comes from a Healthy Place, not a Hazy, Weak place and I am not a sheep. I needed to make sure I was correct about his intensions, but once he made that painfully obvious and neglected my wishes, it was time he had his own comforts put to the test as well. It is tit for tat. If you treat me disrespectfully, I will not outwardly disrespect you in return, but I Will strike back at you in self defense, and it won't be done gingerly, either. There is a limit, a healthy limit, to empathy and to kindness. A line must be kept. It is the same in the field of medicine. You Must Learn to adhere to a line. You can feel as bad as can be for a patient, but you Must keep your distance. It isn't always easy to do, but it is necessary if you wish to do the Best, Most objective job humanly possible. You can care, you Should care, but there is a point where you must also Understand how to Not cross into the areas of gray. It is difficult to learn that line until you are placed in situations, that are common place for someone in the medical profession, but not always commonplace for the typical person. In my case, I was forced to Hone that skill/ability so I Can easily see when lines are crossed and I can steadfastly adhere to those boundaries necessary for a Healthy relationship. His behaviour is not healthy. It is almost egotistical to think it is your right to be so dishonorable and tacky. There is no tolerating such behaviours. There is no vague nature to his actions. It may sound harsh to some, but... I would Never have been placed in a position wherein I Had to make him feel... badly, had he Not continually chosen to make me feel uncomfortable and violated. It is simply a consequence to his ill behaviours. It wasn't nothing personal. It was me saying, "no fucking way. it is like his, not like that. this is How you deal with me." etc.

@Sadoi There is a famous quote you reminded me of, and I mean this as a compliment:

“Don't mistake my kindness for weakness. I am kind to everyone, but when someone is unkind to me, weak is not what you are going to remember about me.”

? Al Capone

Read my above responses, my friend. You can better gauge how things panned out, in the end.

I felt, instinctually, that a line had been crossed during the dinner. He was a bit forward. I felt it was obvious. His constant asking for another date after his business trip to Thailand, he wanted to take me to the most expensive restaurant in our city, and our city is filled with mostly wealthy, Dutch Christian's. He is one of those. He owns his own business, has a number of failed relationships... he must have forgotten, I was a Friend OF His Sons... hence, i do not forget what Jon told me About his father. I am a cautious person. It is just awkward now thought and although I'd come to the conslusion on my own that I was intending to Force those boundaries, I just needed to hear it echoed from other like minded people.

@FortyTwo Yes, I figured these things in as well. Please refer to my above responses so you can better understand the outcome. I seem to be repeating myself at his point. haha

You are correct. Refer to my above response to glean a clearer idea of what I did in response. I am no pushover my friend.

Smart girls don't do stupid things. Smart and wise girls don't do stupid things And they don't tolerate stupid people.

Yes, I have always been in groups with him, but I did notice he was gravitating toward me more than anyone else when I was together with their family. We had already made dinner plans though, since I had a date to have dinner with his son, initially, but in his passing, we decided to go together and that was the time it got rather obvious and i spent the whole of dinner trying to discourage him. It was a nightmare. Since then, i have not responded to him, but to the other members of his family instead.

Sounds like your doing great. I feel bad for the guy, but it would be worse for him to continue being attached. Maybe someday he can make the distinction, but that will take quite a while; if you wanted him in your life in any capacity, otherwise separation is best. @Sadoi

@Funandfondles I agree. If he can learn to cool his heels, I wouldn't have an issue with being a Healthy friend to him, but not at the expense of basic courtesy and mutual respect. If he cannot respect me enough as a human being to control himself when I clearly state my feelings, than how can he expect respect in return? Respect is a two way street. There are no freebe's when it comes to simple, logical rules of engagement. He cannot behave as he does, esp in the shadow of the death of his own child, my friend. How disrespectful. Poor Jon would have been embarrassed over his fathers behaviour and I Know that, as does his father. If that wasn't enough to dissuade him, then what is? If not as we mourn for the death of your child, then when? He must Also respect that I, too, lost someone. No, not my child, but I lost a friend. I am grieving as well. If he cannot understand how one should treat those around you that are also in pain, then how can he assume his pain means so much more that it allots him the right to cross my personal comfort zones? There are rules I adhere to. I was offended that he would attempt to use mutual pain to his advantage. I could see how he was using my pity and attempting to wield it against me, in the face of my compassion. Knowing how bothered Jon would have been only served to irritate me further. I warned him too. He knew what was coming. I cannot pity him if his only concern for that pity is to use it to get something he wants, to manipulate my empathy to further his ill-mannered desires toward me. There is no blurring those lines. It was blatantly clear what he was attempting. I simply let him Know, in no uncertain terms, that, not only was I on to him, but that I was also not some passive softie that Will sit there and take it. I Am very kind, very respectful, very sweet by nature, But.. if you attempt to abuse me with my compassion, I will defend myself and my rights. I don't allow it.

I can’t relate to the desperate nature of his thoughts letting him cross personal boundaries. Even in times of weakness, no means no. I once showed interest in a girl that did not share that interest, but I was up front about it. She told me she was not interested and I said that’s alright we can just be friends, I’ll call you sis, it stuck, and we were friends for years. I never thought of her as a prospect again, even though I was fairly certain she was trying to hit on me later in the friendship. The ship had sailed. My point is, he’s being petty, and he needs to see a psychiatrist. Also, he may be dangerous to you if he keeps on obsessing. Please be safe, don’t let him get away with anything, you don’t need to feel bad for him, and you especially cannot help him. @Sadoi

@Funandfondles Thank you. I appreciate your kind words and you are correct. I did the best I could.

Refer to my above responses, my friend. I did something similar. You shall see.

I agree - that man is being very inconsiderate of Sadoi’s grief

@ LizBeth read my above responses. Oh trust me. He Was put in check.

Hi my lovely friend! Read my above responses. I felt he was insulting the memory of his own son. I felt he was abusing and taking advantage of my kindness and of our mutual mourning. You will understand once you read my responses to the previous posts here. At this point, I am echoing the same story

Taking his phone! That’s awesome - you are brilliant!

@LizBeth Why thank you. I contemplated thinking of sneaky ways to procure the phone, then it dawned on me, "duh, hes trying to impress you. Use that to your advantage. Ask for his phone. Maybe he will assume I am going to put My number into it. Maybe he will think I am attempting to flirt. Either way, its worth a shot." I asked, he gave it to me. Once he realized what I had done, I do not believe he was all too happy. Oh well. He proved to me that his actions warrented back up and whom better to go to for Back up that a Man of Faith's very Own Pastor. Try your argument for pestering and mildly stalking me to Your pastor. If you are grieving and losing your mind, whom better to go to Than Your Own Pastor. See, its a win-win situation. He Cannot fight nor resist me if I am With his Pastor. So he can either risk embarrassment and possible church intervention... or he can get his P's and Q's in check and back the F' off. It is his choice. But, if he pushes... i Push too... Push the "Pastor" button on my cell phone speed dial! The ball is in his court. He Will Behave... or he will face the consequences. I used his Own Game Playing Bullshit Flirting Against him. He wanted to be so coy and so willing and open... well... okay then, if you are open, open that hand and give me that cell phone! If he was so willing to offer himself up And his phone, Well thank you Sir! You just made my job easier. Check Mate.

I had no reason to lie about my position. I was clear and precise. Please refer to my above responses to better understand what I speak of. You will see. I doubt I shall have any further issues. I just wanted to hear the opinions of other likeminded people to gauge my own response to the situation. This was more than enough confirmation, to me, that I made the correct decision.

Good job on all posts below. ...call the preacher if his texts are wearing your battery down and tell the preacher time for a fornicator one man sermon to leave you alone

I did suggest therapy too. Since he is devoutly religious, at one point I said, May I see your phone? I reached for it. He was trying to make a pass at me so I had a feeling he would hand it to me, which he did, begrudgingly. I then looked for either Rev (reverend) or Past (Pastor) or Bro (Brother). I found his Pastor. I transfered his pastors number into my phone Right in front of him. I said, "If you need any help in the future, please let me know and I will arrange to meet you With your pastor so WE can get you the help you need." I made sure o let him know, I wasn't going to judge him harshly, but Likewise I WASNT going to allow him to push my limitations. I let it be Known that Although I Am kind, do not take advantage of that kindness because there is a flip side to me too. That side will not allow anyone to force me into a situation that I am displeased with. I had already distanced myself, but what I wanted, mostly, was feedback from other likeminded people, so as to reconfirm for Myself that I wasn't jumping the gun, being too harsh, etc etc. All I know is that, if something Doesnt feel right, I refuse to follow. I won't play along. I am against games in all form and fashion. Hence, it goes against my Fundamental Values as a woman, A Human Being, to give someone a free pass at a vulnerable moment in time. I have standards and I have Expectations, Mores, Rules of the Norm... I heed to those. Don't Cross My Lines and think I won't defend my positions. I didn't come to these bits of wisdom out of nowhere. I came to these conclusions from Life Experience and im Noo dummy. Nor a pushover.

@heyhihullo note to self, she's no dummy or pushover... and has a flip side...

@sadoi ah, ok!

@HeyHiHullo these things are true, else I'd not admit to them. Treat others the way you would like to be treated. Golden rule of thumb. He wasn't subtle. He was vulgar. And the memory of his son, utterly disregarded. I could have overlooking Many things considering his condition and situation, but that man went way too far and abused his rights and abused my rights and abused the situation. That should Not be tolerated under any circumstances. What would you suggest? I allow someone to abuse me, to make me uncomfortable, to disrespect the death of my friend, of His own son? Sorry, but enough is enough. He doesnt get a free pass just because he is grieving. We are ALL grieving over here, but no one else insulted me in the manner he did. If he can be so ill behaved, expect a reaction to his actions. Simple.

I give as good as I get.

@Sadoi most excellent confrontation grabbing his phone and getting the preacher # ....I would call the preacher immediately after the next contact from this slime xian and ask the preacher to grab his fornicator believer by the balls and tell him to leave you alone

@Sadoi completely understand where you are coming from based on your tone and other posts, additional justification not necessary unless needing to vent, not judging your actions.
Breath... inhale... 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10... exhale... 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10... repeat as necessary to feel better.

@HeyHiHullo hahaha!! lol! touche sir! "Anakin! I Have the Higher Grooound!" haha

Read my above response, friend.

yes. I have done exactly that. i no longer respond to him, what-so-ever. I felt more irritated that he was taking advantage of the death of his Own Child as a way to find favor in courting me. Actually, courting is too kind a description of his Advances toward me. It was more akin to a Mauling! I had no choice but to back away because I simply could Not respect him as a person or even a human being at that point. My annoyance grew and grew, festered and enlarged each and every time I had to negotiate and/or deal with him. Eventually I knew if i did Not opt to distance myself, I was going to go Ape shiiit aaaall over his ass. Hence, the distancing seemed the better option of the two. chuckle

I have already cut him out of my life like a bad habit.

Well, I suppose at times I lack certain... social cues and perhaps I can be crued, but I felt it was warranted. I never would have said that, so bluntly, had I Not been pushed to the point that I was reacting off the cuff and with words to back my emotions. Perhaps it was a bit harsh to point out his lack of intellectual prowess, but he Also took me off guard when he opted to hit on me, the friend of his recently deceased child, and to do so in such a vulgar, disrespectful manner. In my eyes, he left himself Wide Open for that sort of reaction based on how he treated, or should i say Mistreated, me. It was like a knee jerk reaction for me. He hit a nerve. Repeatedly. In my mind, he got what he deserved. He'd best be mindful about where he chooses to poke his stick in the future.