So lately, I have been discussing my views with my boyfriend because he's one of the very few I can open up to about being an atheist (due to living in the bible belt and having many religious friends). When it comes down to our difference in views, we begin to butt heads a little because he seems to lean towards the Christian view of a god being the cause of the universe and has no logic to support his argument. I will ask, then who created God or what could his origin possibly be? And he will say nothing, just that God was the beginning of everything. Then he will try to backpedal and say "only IF there is a god would this be the case" but it's obvious he believes it or really wants to. He grew up with a dad who was Jehova's witness and a Catholic mother so he was influenced probably a lot more than I was as a child by religion. I know it can be difficult to let those ideas go but what bothers me is that he defends the ideas with no logic. He even defends the bible as being a good guide to life, NEVER HAVING READ IT. I have, as I was forced to attend confirmation classes, and I suggested he do so before we discuss it. He says he won't. I love him but this is so frustrating. Obviously I feel it is easier to have a relationship with someone who is agnostic than a religious person, but does anyone have suggestions for how to have these conversations without letting the differences come between a couple? I really appreciate any advice.
Why does religion, or lack of it, or whatever - have to play a part in your relationship at all? You're both on different paths in that subject, not a big deal. Why do you have to agree? Do you both like the same foods? The same people? Do you both agree on literally everything else? As an atheist, I firmly believe I have a right to not believe as much as others have a right to believe, or even be unsure about it. You two are sharing your journeys with each other - you're not on the same journey. Let him find his way. He will find his truth, let him enjoy that journey for himself. You did, maybe it is his turn. <3 Love and support to you and him! <3
You do not have an agnostic boyfriend. You have a non-denominational boyfriend. His beliefs are non-dogmatic, but clearly rooted in Abrahamic tradition. An agnostic is not someone who follows no particular religion. An agnostic is someone who does not feel confident that a god (or gods) exist, or not.
You can in fact be an agnostic and a theist. The two are not mutually exclusive. Agnostic just means you don't know. Theism or atheism deal with belief. Not knowledge. So he could very well not know if God exists but believe he does anyway.
Treat him with the respect and caring you would with anyone else who has been abused. Keep in mind the fact that all religious organisations practice brainwashing in some form or another.....this includes athiests and agnostics. Personally I feel no need for a god, because the spirits I believe in, require no worship, no dogma, no donations, and make no promises. He, on the other hand may have been beaten, embarrassed, excluded, or, threatened into a state of confusion and fear. It's amazing what sunday school teachers will allow their "Good" students to get away with against a "Bad" student.
Find an Atheist boyfriend? I have no idea having tried many times in this situation on how to do it since their is such a wide gap in the systematic view of life, nature and our responsibility to act as humans to save humanity from either Religion or just....non caring.
You have to take the emotion out of it I think... I totally understand being passionate about this but it will be a lot easier to talk with him if you can avoid letting his approach get under your skin.
First, consider yourself lucky. Agnostic is much closer to Atheist than say, Baptist.
Second, don’t be so literal with him. I know the only reason I say I’m Agnostic is because I can’t know everything in the galaxy and beyond. I am a fan of proof and science- I have kept an open mind, but require proof which has not been forthcoming as of yet.
I was raised catholic with catechism on the day of saturn / saturday and mass on the day of the sun / sunday. At 13 started doubting their bs and stopped attending mass. At 16 without having read marx, i came to the conclusion that religion was the opiate of the masses. Much later i was forced to go along with the jw way or face not seeing my children. Sad but i did it for the sake of our family. I still love my jw ex wife that didnt become a jw until the birth of our third child but she broke all the jw ways by being lured by two other jw males young enough to be her children. Knew of infedelity even amonst highest jw in the congregation. All they have to do is ask "god" to forgive their sins and "he" will do so. After all "god" sent his only begotten son "jesus" to die to clense our inherited sinfull ways by the creator that screwed up and made us imperfect ! Love that logic ! Thus hypocrisy is close to godliness ! Obvious from actions from some members of most religions. Before being forced into following the jw way, i asked a jw to define god. He defined god as boundless dynamic energy. If god is so defined then god is really the universe. I then deduce the son of "god" is our sun. The sun was worshipped centuries and thousands of miles apart by multiple civilizations then religions made the sun a male diety to make the sun more humanly pliable, retain control of the masses and assert male dominance because obviously god has to have a penis. So my current believe is that god is the universe. The sun of god is our sun. The third rock from the sun is our beautiful blue paradise on the planet we call earth. I occasionally pray to the universe that it spare our destruction by a rouge meterorite or an orange satan pressing the nuke buttons. Amen.
Why argue... stay away from those conversations. Its one of those who knows the most and whose the dominant person with control issues. Dont play his game. Get your game going. Make a pac that your beliefs and his beliefs want be in the same conversation. All that special stuff goes away. Normal conversations are now the topic.
I am an Atheist and my soon to be ex is very spiritual and a believer in many GODS. When I told her I was an Atheist- she freaked. I explained my reasoning in a calm and measured way. Told her the bulk of the Holy Books are filled with glaring contradictions that cannot be rectified. Plus they were all written by guys and the final draft was more than likely not where they started. Calm, respectful and measured discourse is the only way to overcome these disagreements.
Yes, but did you manage to "overcome these disagreements"? That is, was that a factor in your pending divorce? I kind of compare it to a Trump voter and a Clinton voter. I did not support Trump and would never be able to have a relationship with someone who did support Trump. Trump's positions, problems with the truth, past actions are just more than I can bear and anyone who would justify that is not someone who I could relate to. Kind of like christianity vs. atheism.
It sounds to me like he is currently a theist with doubts, rather than an agnostic. I think the key in this situation is to ask questions and listen to the answers, in particular, “why do you believe that?” Why do you think the Bible is a good guide for living life? Are those things exclusively tied to religion? the goal between you should be to understand each other, not necessarily to persuade, but maybe through your conversations he will become more comfortable with letting go of faith in things that aren’t logical.
He has faith, something you don't or can't have. That's the only difference really. I would suggest not only listening to what he believes, but why... and he may not come out and say it, you'll probably have to read between the lines.
Like it or not though, you'll never be able to convince him there is no god, because he believes there is no evidence one way or another and he's correct. I'm an athiest, I don't believe there is a god, but I don't know that for sure, and I can't. There's simply not enough data backing up one theory or the other, so while I'm 99.9% positive there is no god, I could die tomorrow and meet that god face to face. He believes there is a god, and that there is no evidence on way or another. You believe there is no god and that's why there is no evidence. I'd concentrate on the similarities of the two theories rather than sticking to he's right or you're right... because you both are, and you both aren't. Be patient with him, he'll come around eventually lol.
I can only add my personal experience. I am not a complete unbeliever. I accept that it is not rational to retain a bit of Christianity, but it makes me feel good. I'm not praying, I'm not worshipping, but I do still define myself as a little bit (maybe 5%?) of a Christian.
Otherwise, I'm a polytheist, Buddhist, Christian agnostic. In order of precedence.
I know you want to talk to your significant other about these things. Is he on this site yet? Because it sounds like he hasn't found himself a balance to define his beliefs, and if he could, you might argue less.
That said, you don't have to determine who's right and who's wrong, and trying truly can only lead to tears.
I wish you well!
If religion is the only obstacle in your relationship, I would say that you have something worthwhile and just avoid the subject.
First of all the boyfriend does not appear to be an agnostic. He is a believer who is trying to convince you to agree to his views, just as you would like him to be rational like you. If he unwilling to read anything, or listen to other rational approaches then you two either should avoid the topic and know that this would create some significant problems at difficult times in the future, e.g., when a loved one dies, etc. I cannot imagine, given the present scenario, that this is going to work out. It might be best for you to each take some time apart to re-think if this relationship is really best for the two of you. Or, if the two of you will agree to read each other's literature and discuss it openly, there might be a chance for your boyfriend to begin to think more rationally. But religion is a nasty kind of mental/emotional "virus" of sorts, and I don't think that your prognosis together is very favorable.
I had a friend who said he was agnostic and I am pretty hardcore atheist. Truth be told just liked to argue for the sake of argument, and now we haven’t spoken in several years although we had been friends for years. My wife is Catholic and we have been together for 21 years. We get along fine and love each other very muchj. We talk a bit about religion but know where to draw the line. Argument or discussion should entail listening as well as talking, asking and answering questions equally. You both should be able to really open up and honestly express yourselves and that will be easier if you both start out on a level playing field but honestly it sounds that he still has a lot of baggage that he’s reluctant to dispose of. I am acquainted with a lady who has been out of the Witnesses for thirty years but can’t get her life together because she just holds on to beliefs, although she doesn’t seem to recognize them. You need to be honest with yourself as a one-sided relationship is worse than no relationship at all. You are the only one that has to make the decision. Good luck.
I think you have to make a choice, if you love him and wish to continue the relationship, you will have to basicly just avoid the subject. The alternative will be continued pointless arguements that will never go anywhere because he will not be open to reason given his stated position. I hope you can resolve this within yourself because the only person who can affect this is you, as it appears that his mind is closed.
if he's not religious ask him why he cares if there's a creator? if there is something that would be capable of comprehending the entirety of the universe, it would have no regard for us, let alone provide us with an 'afterlife' or teachings.
and if the bible is such a good guide to life why did god waste the first 5 of 10 commandments screaming me, me!, me!, me!, me!, and not banning slavery.
in the end, he's a Christian saying he's agnostic to be with you, you should take it as a compliment, you make a man deny his faith in spite of himself.
Shouldn't be many, but since he's agnostic, he must concede you could be right and he's wrong since he can never be sure
In this messed up world, an agnostic, and an atheist, ought to be able to find something else to argue about other than religion. I know that's not an answer, but I do wish you luck.