Religion is many people’s favorite toy and is something I don’t think many non-believers would want to take away from believers. If you could, would you remove religion from society completely? What role would you relegate it to? I’m thinking in a US-context here, but of course value any international input. Looking forward to your thoughts.
Religion is a crutch to assist people with the regards to the vastness and hugeness of the Universe. This type of mental masturbation is only practiced by humans. And then, only because we have the capability of abstract thought. This abstract thought capability allowed us to survive in a generally unfriendly world.
I imagine early humans looked up into the night sky and were impressed with its vastness and expanse. Just like it is to most people today, it was probably incomprehensible and confounding. Humans do not like unanswered questions. The lack a definable answer leads to unsettled feelings.
This nagging unclarity tends to irritate and aggravate. So in order to assuage the irritation, they rationalized their world around them. Likewise, the human mind doesn't deal with, what appears to be disorder (it's not really), so they impose a false order, once again to ease their mind. Humans like to control their environment, so they seek ways to exact a control by declaring a controlling Godhead(s) of some sort.
Even in a modern world of science, many need religion's rationalization to deal with the vastness. It is not until large numbers of humans venture into space will the human paradigm be significantly changed. Seeing the unlimitedness of space, "in space", only then will humans realize how truly insignificant they are in the larger scheme of things. Perhaps then might they give up the folly of rationalizing an order that doesnt exist, and accept the order that does exist.
i couldn't have said it better... so, i'm glad you did...
What role would I relegate it to? The role of fantasy.
My son fully believes religions should be outlawed since they are pretty much the cause of the majority of wars.
Me..... as long as the nut cases stay out of my way, I'm okay with religion. Unfortunately that doesn't happen very often.
If I could I would remove religion from society completely. I see absolutely no benefit from it outside of facilitating an illusion to avoid dealing with reality. It's role would be the same as alchemy and magic. There would be people who still insisted there was a benefit, but they would be outcasts and "odd" not being able to demonstrate the veracity of the claims they make about their odd beliefs. Also, religions would have no effect on the political and social dynamics of the overwhelming majority of people out of disdain for it's purposeful ignorance simply to make a few nutcases feel good about their delusions.
What if they were not making truth claims? For example, I am quite taken by many world myths knowing full well they’re used to explain things about nature and the human condition. Likewise, many marvels of architecture have religious funding. I agree with your last point, but not in such barbed terms haha.
@DoublePlusDanny If they are not making "truth claims", then are they a religion? Using myths as metaphors regarding the human condition is not the same thing as creating ceremony, ritual and social responsibilities as religion does. Using myths is no different than using stories. I have no issue with passing on knowledge, wisdom and experience with stories. My issue is when the characters of the stories become more relevant than reality and used to manipulate the people around you.
Tonight I was watching Monty Python's Life Of Brian, and it struck me that the movie's title character, a Christ figure, said it very well in jest. He said, "You don't need a messiah, you have to work it all out for yourselves".
Reluctantly born in a nearby manger next to the alleged vaginal virgin birthing an alleged baby gawd in a next door dirty donkey stable.....end of movie dozens of people are crucified ALL SINGING: " always look on the bright side of life, when life hands you some gristle, always give a whistle
The best role in my opinion would be none...but that is not a realistic prospect. I think if the religious kept their religions as a private matter and didn’t try to inflict their beliefs on the rest of us that would be good. I’m not American, and in the UK the judiciary is quite separate from the legislature and therefore not subject to religious or political interference. At Westminster MPs religious beliefs are not material to the framing and passing of our laws.
Charles Bradlaugh my hero
Fabians too
NO role at all, completely irrelevant! IMAGINE by Lennon playing......
The religions require faith. Faith is believing in things without evidence. There is no reason to believe anything without evidence. Therefore faith is illogical.
Most people find comfort and validation through their religion. But it is illogical to rely on delusional thinking for comfort and validation. It is possible to find those things through a better understanding of reality.
ideally? to vanish from existence. i don't know why religion, which is basically mass delusion, should have a role in society. do i want to take it away from believers? no, but i don't want it foisted upon me, either. it is not my job to relegate it anywhere.
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To give large , money grubbing churches legal tax avoidance.
To give humans a universal scapegoat.
To provide wayward comforts, when humans go through hard times and cannot face reality.
The one good thing, as I see it - to provide inspiration to countless composers, for some mighty fine tunes !
I would never outlaw religion because that just does not work. I would take measures to educate people out of it. No science denying, fact denying, history revising home or private schooling would be allowed, for instance; and I would fortify the wall of separation between church and state. I would have secular programs to help people so they would not have to turn to religious organizations for help and the only tax exemptions churches would get would be for money that went directly toward helping people; they would not be allowed to force people to listen to sermons or other proselytizing in order to get that help. Hopefully, in time, organized religion would just fade away.
Sunset laws upon legalized charities to phase in 100% secular rules
Religion does not serve any purpose in society, apart from giving people a placebo effect and (false) hope. The sooner that people believe that this is the one life we have, the better people can start treating themselves, others, and the earth fairly and with respect.
Ideal role of religion today? To be taught in schools that people a long time ago used to believe in gods... Zeus, Apollo, Jesus, etc.
Exactly
Nope, it should be treated as ancient fiction text and analyzed for its historical, linguistic, and literature value.
Religion, from what I can see in America, is a catch all term to use if you want to justify behaviours.
America received a strict, puritanical version of Christianity from Europe, or In the first instance England specifically.
It will be very hard to break that down because it is in the fabric of the nation’s history. The Rapture, deep within the Christian Right is not likely to go away due to its soteriological nature, with everyone wanting to be ‘saved’ from something even if they don’t know what it is.
I don’t know if it is pre-millennialist of post but due to the aggression associated with it, it is probably pre-millennialist. In other words, the momentum for endemic Christian abuse will remain until Jesus whisks the ‘godly! up in his cloud and the rest of us experience the tribulations.
I must add that the Rapture is a combination of biblical ideas put forward by John Darby who was associated with Plymouth Brethren and so has no textual authority other than within its own sect.
soteriological - hey I learned a new word today! I think it is more the fundamentalist religions that are into this. I don't know how widespread they are though I get the feeling that they are gaining ground, or at least gaining percentage because of attrition elsewhere.
Ideally, there would be no role for religion in the world. I suppose it could be used as fairy tales for entertainment, but it should not be taught as if it were reality.