LINK Richard Dawkins is Still Denying the Basic Humanity of Trans People | Hemant Mehta | Friendly Atheist | Patheos
(He's not my favorite atheist)
On Saturday, for some reason, Richard Dawkins randomly decided to question the humanity of transgender people — under the guise of I’m-just-asking-questions — while comparing their situation to that of Rachel Dolezal:
8
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Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.Dawkins is intelligent, and somewhat enlightened, but in the end, he is just another guy with opinions. He should be studied but not revered.
As far as transgender goes, it is a relatively new phenomenon (though the need may have existed forever). You see it all the time, people trying to use traditional thoughts to deal with new situations. They get frustrated at the failure so return to absolutes. Where have we heard that before..
“Marriage is between a man and a woman, period!”
“Next thing you know, they will want to marry their dogs!”
“Even though they are on hormones, and growing breasts, they must compete a men...”
Canndue
Level 8
Apr 13, 2021
2
The sheer glut of new forms of self identity that have spawned on the world in the past decade does not surprise me. There are those who expediently misrepresent the words of an eminent scientist to further their own agenda.
Everyone is free to identify with whatever they want to identify with in terms of their beliefs, gender or sexuality. However, to redefine scientific facts to accommodate beliefs leads to a very slippery slope indeed; further down the road there is the corruption of language of the kind that George Orwell wrote about in his work, 1984.
"By renaming a person, an act or object you may make the same more socially acceptable or repulsive" Thomas Szasz
By calling someone 'old fashioned' or saying that they belong to another older generation may be considered as 'ageist' and is a piss poor attempt at a put down and by implication the writer or speaker is more enlightened.
ASTRALMAX
Level 8
Apr 13, 2021
2
I don't identify as trans or black, so the only comparison I can make is that I do identify as atheist, even though people will insist that I'm a child of God, whether I believe so or not.
Yes I was born into a Catholic family, raised Catholic, but by the time I became adult, I had examined my spirituality and fully identified as atheist. Like it or not, only I can know my own spiritual beliefs. Just like only a gay, trans or bi sexual can assert their sexuality.
On pretending to be black, well I just don't have any comment for that. Here there are people who pretend to be Hawaiian. There are going to be people who take on accents or mannerisms for whatever reason to be someone they're not. It doesn't really affect me, just like other people's sexuality doesn't affect me. Similarly, other's spirituality doesn't affect me, unless they are trying to impose it on me, or discriminating against me for being different than them.
While I like a lot of what Richard Dawkins says, this is not the first comment I've heard him make that reminds me he is of an older generation and perhaps not as enlightened in some subjects as he is in theological arguments.
Julie808
Level 8
Apr 13, 2021
3
Where I see that breaking down is when a male trans to female, and then insists that you deem them female, as they out-compete you in some manner or other, thereby affecting you, possibly quite profoundly?
@bbyrd009 I have a friend who was born male, but at some point decided she preferred to be female. She dresses as female and has a female name. She prefers the she/her pronouns. She's also a professional plumber. It does not bother me that she can change out a faucet or disposal faster and better than me. Her gender doesn't apply at all. I've seen her dressed and made up to be far more beautiful than me, in her own way, but I gotta say I look better in a bikini than she does. 
We did attend the same gym for some classes and I outperformed her in hulabobics, and we seemed to be about the same riding bicycles, but as a former roller derby queen she can definitely out skate me.
Everyone's different with various strengths and weaknesses and there are many people better than me and worse than me in both genders. I'm not into sports, so I won't comment on something I don't compete in myself, but otherwise having someone out compete me in things doesn't bother me in the least, no matter their gender. I'm just not a competitive person.
@bbyrd009 About 50+ years ago, a male radio personality dressed up with a blonde wig and competed with my sister in a powder puff boat race, supposed to be only females, and at the time that meant wives or sisters of the predominately male boat racers. (My brothers raced boats.)
This radio personality "Frosty Fowler" ended up crashing into the boat my sister was driving (my brother's boat) and thereby making her lose the race. He shouldn't have been allowed in the race, since he was male, but it was a publicity stunt for him. Not a good one, as it turned out! All the girls and lady drivers that day did better than the male impersonating a female. I guess it could have been a over zealous lady instead who might have crashed into the boat my sister was driving, but it was a male. He was definitely competing as a male impersonating a female for publicity. That makes a pretty fuzzy line. Of course, it was a "powder puff" race, not a "real" race, back in the day... 50+ years ago. Because girls were just beginning to get into racing.
Shortly after that, racing was opened up to male and female, and I would have beat the pants off the male drivers had I been allowed to drive - I was being trained to race my brothers' boats that I helped build, but a racing friend of ours lost his life in a race and then a few years later my brother lost his leg testing his boat, so my mom drew a hard line that no, I would not be allowed to race. Girls were treated differently back then. I wanted to be the first national champion - especially being a girl - not because I'm competitive, but because I had faith in my brothers' ability to teach me the skills and my dad's ability in making our boats go fast. Doing the best I could with what I had to work with would have been easy. Gender shouldn't have anything to do with it.
Not really sure what point I'm making, just a memory that flashed into my mind on this lazy Sunday afternoon.
Nonsense. Nothing Dawkins wrote questioned the humanity of Transgender people. That is 100% intentional misunderstanding to push the Trans activism social agenda. Trans activist propaganda is being pushed to counter the anti-Trans propaganda pushed by the wing-nut Evangelicals. The latter are utterly asinine as expected. Bogus propaganda from both sides hurts everyone, including Trans.
Men and Women can dress any way they want to and do. Men and Women can identify and/or dress any way they want to, and do. However, a person with XY who identifies and dresses as a woman is NOT a biological female. Again, identifying their gender as a woman does not make a person female. Sex is biological and gender is social. Surgery cannot install ovaries, at least not yet.
In no way should anyone with XY compete for money against biological XX females. If they want to compete in sports, they should compete against other biological males, regardless of their social identification. If they can't compete, they shouldn't.
It is wrong to insist that scientific concepts of sex and genetics be redefined by social movements based on gender customs that are wholly artificial in the first place. Trans activism is understandable, but overreaching propaganda that uses cheap insults and fake science will backfire.
racocn8
Level 9
Apr 12, 2021
5
Be careful! Speaking sensibly on this topic will attract the wrath of the lunatic fringe.
Oh dear. I’m familiar with people as identifying with a culture that others may not recognise them from. I once met an indigenous Australian whose father was Scandinavian and whose mother was Aboriginal, he had white skin and blue eyes.
But to question anyone’s else’s humanity just because you conveniently feel comfortable in your birth alignment shows a lack of empathy and insight.
girlwithsmiles
Level 8
Apr 12, 2021
3
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