Public transit would not be personal transportation.

@barjoe In metropolitan areas it works

@bobwjr it's not personal transportation

I would have no place to charge it. I just want to put gas in my car and drive. I don't believe people will actually buy them. Not in my lifetime. I'd never buy any Tesla product and they won't be $20K. Ever.

I remember when you couldn't buy a color 19 inch TV for less than $500

We gotta drive around in a Yugo? Batteries degrade in 10 years. How many 2011 cars do you see? A lot. You don't have to change the engines every 10 years. What do you do with them? Put in a new $10K battery? Crush them? In my lifetime, I will drive an internal combustion car. I'll never buy an EV.

@barjoe As original owner, I'm still driving a 1998 Toyota 4Runner (original engine) which was totaled (for insurance purposes) in 2008 (I did all the repairs myself).

If needed, my next vehicle might be an EV.

@FearlessFly You'd never be able to fix a totaled EV, even if you had R2R. Never. Orange wires will give you a buzz.

@barjoe [cnbc.com]

[driving.ca]

@FearlessFly He's making my point for me. He hasn't had to do any major body work like you did. He didn't discuss any high voltage wiring. He believes in EVs and inTesla as a company. I don't. 2030? I am sure 75% of cars will still be ICE in 2030, probably more. These guys love Tesla and believe in Tesla, I don't know why.

@barjoe The only "body work" I did was to pound-out the dents -- no bondo, no paint.

I am neither anti-Tesla nor pro-Tesla.
I am pro Right to Repair, be it John Deere, Tesla, Apple/Android, Maytag, whatever.
IIUC Teslas' OS is a version of Linux . . .

@FearlessFly 10 year old 4runner was totaled? Sounds like a lot damage. I figure I'll be dead in 20 years, ICE will be dominant until then.

@barjoe . . . "a lot" ?

I had to replace the entire driver-side front suspension and rear axle w/brake-drum (never done either before), and radiator.

@FearlessFly My basic problem with EVs are my personal situation. I don't have a parking spot. I park on the street. I sometimes don't use my car for a week. If you let an a EV sit it discharges. A gas car can sit for a month, if the battery is good, it starts right up. You need gas, you put gas in it. If I had a driveway, I could leave the car on charger at home. If it's dead and you're on the street, you are screwed. I can't have one. It won't work. Hybrids are good, you just put gas in them. Plug in won't work for urban dwellers. Me.

@barjoe i wasn't saying i like electric....for one thing, where is the lower pollution if we have to make a boatload more electricity so everybody can charge? Nor are disposing of bajillions of spent batteries going to be a picnic. Never mind making bajillians of new ones. I'm saying there has always been money in cheap knock-offs, whether cars or lipsticks.

@AnneWimsey I'm sure someday, when I'm long gone, gasoline cars will be relics. Unless I move to a place with a driveway, an EV won't be possible for me to own. I don't drive that much, my car doesn't pollute much, I hafta have ICE car. EVs are good for a lot of people. They don't work for me.

I don't consider a bicycle to be personnel transportation. It's not a car.

@barjoe its not a car. But it is perfectly fit transportation if there are safe places to use them. It's ridiculous we all have these 2 ton machines moving us everywhere and it isn't really always necessary. Bike lanes make it so not as many people need cars.

@MsAl Bikes are fine. I don't want to give up my car though. I have a very small carbon footprint. My car is only 1800 lbs and it gets 40 mpg. I've had like 5 bikes stolen in Philly and with all the potholes, it's not that great.