We serve the same god but give it a different name. All rivers have different names yet the same water runs through it. - adapted from Muhammad Ali.
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I may serve breakfast in bed, or serve a warrant, but I serve no god or other imaginary being.
HippieChick58
Level 9
May 7, 2019
5
Love it!
I think most of us here would disagree strongly with the semantics, specifically the words serve and god, and the absolute use of “all. But if you interpret them as broadly as possible I think there’s some merit to the sentiment. We all chase the same high. The rivers don’t all have the same water but it all leads to the same earthly ocean. There are similar Buddhist sayings about how multiple paths can get you to the mountaintop. We all seek self actualization and community.
All the ecstatic experiences of various religions and communities are effectively giving the same voltage. I believe people who get caught up in “the spirit” of any activity with like minds, be it a tent revival, drum circle, funk show, hari Krishna chant, whatever, are experiencing bliss for the same reason. Ecstatic experiences happen when you enter a receptive and/or creative flow state with a group of people, and what we have historically called “spiritual experiences” are those times when we get lost in the motion of others and experience something greater than the sum of its parts.
Wurlitzer
Level 8
May 7, 2019
5
I’ve also experienced ecstatic states while alone in wild places - nature provides the ‘others’ I suppose. But that ‘something greater than the sum of its parts’ Yes!
no we don't. i know a hell of a lot of people who do not seek self-actualization or anything but a place to sleep and something to eat, or a better life for their kids, or money, or power. we do not all seek the same thing. we really don't. stinky metaphor. not every metaphor rings true.
g
@genessa I did address the fact that absolute statements can’t be made for everyone and the rest of that is Maslows hierarchy of needs interrupting. Of course if you don’t have food or shelter those are top priorities first for survival. Once survival needs have been met we seek social acceptance and self actualization, freedom, purpose with our careers and mindsets. And yeah there are always exceptions to everything but generally even the most antisocial among us still ultimately find their purpose through others or a higher context than themselves. There’s a reason every culture has one or multiple customs of getting caught up in a flow with one another through song or dance, drums, chants, psychedelics, meditation, yoga, all of them lead to the same flow state of mind. And there’s a word for that kind of bliss in just about every culture I know of.
Even misery loves company. When you’re in prison with the worst off of humanity, the biggest punishment they can give you is isolation. That speaks to the deep human need for connection for all of us whether we want to admit it or not. We are highly socialized animals that depend on numbers to survive. I can imagine almost no one except narcissists, sociopaths and chemically damaged people find satisfying meaning purely in their own self absorption.
@genessa “the realization or fulfillment of one's talents and potentialities, especially considered as a drive or need present in everyone.” Are there any talents or potentialities of practical significance at all if anyone were in a vacuum unto themselves? None of it matters at all except in relation to others.
@genessa well no not always actively and consciously of course I grant you that; like you said some of us don’t have the luxury of philosophical introspection when we can’t afford basic essentials and education. If everyone could put their finger on it and knew what it would take to find fulfillment I think we could almost all find that’s it though. And of course there are infinite paths to finding that out, which is what I think is the root of what the OP and similar quotes, most religions and philosophies are ideally trying to get at.
I gotta correct my insistence that this only happens through connecting with other people actually; the other notable exception is through connecting with nature. Same water, different river. Still a major path to feeling less separated from the world and more apart of something greater. I think most of us need more of both nature and community but some perfectly fine people definitely like more of one than the other.
You won't get many positive comments with this statement in AGNOSTIC.COM!
LucyLoohoo
Level 9
May 7, 2019
5
I guess 'we' means you and your friends, because I do not serve ANYONE, least to say all that bunch of imaginary stupid fantasies like Snow White, jehova, Hansel & Gretel, jesus, satan, thor, etc... but I must say I like Marvel movies!
Merseyman1
Level 9
May 7, 2019
4
Huh -- then why are you here?
xyz123
Level 7
May 7, 2019
5
Showing that he think different.
Rubbish. I feel no sense of political correctness to conform to any hero worship of Mr. Cassius Clay, AKA Muhammad Ali.
If it's all all the same god, why are all the theologies inconsistent? Why have these religions fought each other for millennia? Why have countless died in these wars? Why is this one God so incompetent at conveying its existence and purpose? It's the God of stupidity and ignorance, created from our own foolishness, and it serves only to thwart our progress.
David1955
Level 8
May 8, 2019
4
Who is "we" and not all rivers have the same water. That is some crazy talk right there.
mistymoon77
Level 9
May 8, 2019
3
no we don't. most of us here serve no gods whatsoever. why would you say we serve the same god on a site geared toward folks who either do not believe there are any gods or firmly believe there are no gods? and by the way, even what ali said about rivers isn't true. it isn't the same water. it may be the same water flowing through all parts of EACH river (and i have heard the opposite -- that you can't step into the same river twice because it is always changing). all rivers do not have the same water in them. anyone who has ever seen at least two rivers knows that.
g
genessa
Level 8
May 7, 2019
3
He made no sense. Flowery language does not make it the truth. All Gods are terribly different from one another, the ways we follow are horribly different and the basic tenets of belief are... hellishly different.
That's why they said, the tailor should do tailoring that he is good at, the barber should do barbering. Boxing was his expertise. Like Moravian said below, too many blows to the head.
This is just one example of how we idolize people and make them heroes for wrong reasons.
St-Sinner
Level 9
May 8, 2019
2
Yep, all abrahamic religions are heresies from each other.
Judaism is probably an heresy of an ancient polytheistic semitic religion, YHWH was one of the gods of this religion.
Christianity is a Heresy of Judaism, Islam is an heresy of christianity.
They all worship the same imaginary friend YHWH. Actualy the name is not different, they just don't use the name of the god, calling it only the god in a sign that they think it is unique.
Pedrohbds
Level 7
May 8, 2019
1
I don't agree, but I get what Ali means by this.
SleeplessInTexas
Level 8
May 8, 2019
1
Even though Ali aka. Cassius Clay turned to Islamic dogma his god reference is not germane here in any form!
of-the-mountain
Level 9
May 7, 2019
1
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