My local senior center is that way. I silently protest by remaining seated and drinking my coffee while they pledge and pray, in this case a moment of silence instead of a prayer. The know my intent and I know theirs, which is to force conformity and agreement. I am passively telling them they can shove it and they can't do anything to force me to conform to their rituals.

I only come there to get the free lunch, not to socialize. I make that clear by always sitting at a back table by myself. However if a brave soul who was not a conformist happened to ask to sit with me, I would probably give them a chance and talk to them some to see if they were different from the rest. Everybody there is at least a dozen years older than me, from what I can tell, so there's that too. They are all also country music fans, so I always dread that they might start playing CDs of country music during the meals, in which case I would have to give up the free lunches. I don't want to tip them off to that or they would probably start doing that to get rid of me.

@DenoPenno Geez, you live in Missouri, right next to Iowa, so you know exactly the kind of folks I am talking about, small town hicks who are still living in the 50s, when they were teenagers. Which is not surprising since none of them left town or went to college.The funny thing is, my once small town that I now live in is presently a suburb of Des Moines with a rapidly growing pop. of 60K that is mostly a bedroom community of white collar types who work in Des Moines or West Des Moines in banking or insurance. In other words, the people at the senior center are poor and uneducated, while most of the town is yuppie Repub types.

You summed it up perfectly. I don't pledge allegiance to anything and act accordingly.

While I was at my grandson's graduation this past June, they had everyone stand for the pledge and prayer. I stood but did not participate in the pledge nor did I bow my head for their prayer. A woman behind me actually poked me in the back and said I should bow my head for the prayer. I turned around and told her if she touched me again she would lose her finger. These folks in Texas are so rigid in their beliefs and expect everyone to do as they do. I make a point of doing the opposite.

When the national anthem is played at a political or sporting event, I will stand and take off my hate and leave my arms and hands down at my front, but that's it. No hand on my heart stuff.

@Bobsuruncle That's a really lame "argument".
When Kaepernick started taking a knee, he was demonstrating what a REAL American ought to be doing when they see their nation tolerating terrible things. Protest is absolutely the most American of activities. He was right to do it. Criticizing him for it is what is completely UN-American.

He also wasn't "performing" when he took that knee. It was BEFORE the
game. He still did the job he was being paid to do when the time came to do it.

No one is required to acknowledge the anthem or the pledge, or even the flag.
The ONLY thing worthy of reverence is the Constitution.
Without that, neither the anthem, the flag, nor the pledge mean anything at all.
As far as I'm concerned, the anthem, the flag, and the pledge mean absolutely nothing to me.
Respect the Constitution. That's what makes this country THIS country.

@Bobsuruncle There are very few instances where pledging your allegiance to the flag of our country should be considered a paid performance. A stage play where that is in the script would be one. Pledging allegiance before an athletic event is not.

@Bobsuruncle No, dude. You do not just get to label and insult me for not agreeing with you, and pointing out where I believe you're wrong.
I called your argument "lame", not you. There's a difference.
Learn to debate.
You also don't get to question whether anyone has served or not.
It's none of your business what someone else's service may have been, or wasn't.
You don't speak for all veterans, and you have no right to act like you do.
To that point, and as an fyi, families also serve. You don't speak for them either.

You either present a well-researched, reasoned rebuttal, or not.

I'm not a socialist, a leftist, a communist, a democrat, or any other damned thing you want to try to label me. I'm an American and I don't have to uphold anyone else's idea of what that is, or how I should act.
I think political parties pretty much ALL suck and are corrupt.
Don't think you actually know anything about me, or anyone else.
It's clear you do not.

@KKGator, @GarytheGondolier, @Bobsuruncle This will probably make all of you hate me, but I think kneeling is a very American thing to do, and hating that anyone would kneel during the pledge is also very American. I also think protesting can have a cost, and the cost for Kaepernick was his job...which I also think makes his protest more effective and not less, although I can't imagine myself ever kneeling at the pledge and I find his kneeling a tacky way to protest (while acknowledging it got the attention of the people he wanted to notice).

America is always filled with seeming contradictions. We vote our Congress in, then hate them all (although usually we like the person we voted in). We vote in a president, and a huge number of us spend 4 or 8 years hating his guts (no matter who they are). Eventually we'll elect a woman, and hate her guts for 4 or 8 years. We're not required to agree with each other. And we always have the freedom to change our minds.

@Bobsuruncle You said it plain and wrong, but whatever, you won't even consider another position but your own.
There is nothing "knee jerk" about my reactions. I've been cultivating my own mind for 58 years now, thank you.
I am a student of history. You are behaving like many others have before you.
Almost always not in their best interests, and usually with lots of jingoism thrown in for good measure. They invariably, like every single time, fail spectacularly.
You can't come at me with anything but your emotions.
That's okay, I understand.
If you ever learn how to debate, please let me know.
I'd be happy to.
Enjoy your day.

@Bobsuruncle Thank you for your service, but it doesn't make you better than anyone else, whether they too served, or not.
It's shameful to trade on that service, like it gives you some sort of "right" to dismiss anyone else. It does not.
Seriously, shame on you.

Christ. I go run a few errands for a little while and a shitstorm has broken out over my humble opinion. Turns out I'm edgy and controversial.

My take: Gator's right, Bob's Uncle is wrong. Annnd that's all she wrote.

@greyeyed123 I don't hate you. You have a different opinion. That's all.
I don't agree with some of what you said, but I also agree with some of it.

@Bobsuruncle Hood rat? Racist much?

Having served does NOT make your opinion more valid than a regular citizen. Most of my antecedents have served or were married to servicemen and NONE of them expect their opinion to carry more weight.

Perhaps it is because they came from a different era or because they saw combat for extended periods or perhaps it is because they were decent people in general but the way you are treating people here marks you as unlike any of the veterans I know.

Would your commanding officer be ok with the way you are speaking to fellow citizens?

Talk about conduct unbecoming.

@Bobsuruncle Well, you are not "everyone" are you? Who is this everyone you keep mentioning? He has plenty of supporters and many others who are just kinda meh about it but he does not have "everyone" hating him

He risked his career to bring attention to something he felt strongly about. Sounds pretty American to me. The fact that he had white parents and affluence makes his action even more meaningful as it would have been easier for him to just comply and maintain the status quo rather than going against the norm. Particularly since he himself probably had never experienced much injustice due to his white parents

In fact, it was downright brave of him

He could have just ranted anonymously on the net instead of putting his livelihood on the line

I'm sure you are in excellent company.

@KKGator Yeah, I probably am lol

I don't stand for any prayer will stand for the pledge but never say god

Same

@germangirl90439 Thanks for doing that. I will do it too, now. It's becoming a necessity, now that racists are ruining equal rights.

How about taking the knee?

That's pretty much where I'm at with this thing. Kids' school functions are the primary places where that garbage gets trotted out.
I'll stand silently. Won't put my hand over my heart, won't sing, won't recite the pledge.
I've noticed several others doing the same. I know I'm not alone.

Do you mean, "British"?

The Pledge of Allegiance that mainly schoolchildren are forced to recite has a lot of similarity to the "Loyalty Oath" government officials & others were forced to take during the Red Scare & the McCarthy horror. The House UnAmerican Activities Committee would love it. Prepare to denounce your Fellow Travellers

And while we're at it, let's try to get "IN GOD WE TRUST" off our currency as well !

@HughJassell Great Idea. Why is "In god we trust" on American currency. Maybe because we may trust "god" but not the currency