Ok but why is it wrong to physically and mentally abuse someone? Like your reason for it being wrong is because it is..... not sound. Like the whole point I was trying to make which you clearly missed is what is the reason it is wrong to do these negative actions? If your answer is just because it is, than why even answer??

@Mollywhop So in your world, there is no right or wrong? You had better be glad you live in our world, or you wouldn't have made it out of your twenties. If you are looking for other folks on this sight who are not very bright like yourself, try the Republican Atheist Group. There is a whole bunch of stupid in that group and you should feel quite at home.

@Sticks48 maybe you should try that group clown... lol... like show me where I said there is no right or wrong?? I was saying the reason behind why one considers an action right or wrong matters... obviously that is to advanced thought for your mind yet you are saying I am 'not very bright'
Also not at all sure what you mean when you say 'you had better be glad you live in our world, or you wouldn't have made it out of your twenties.'
Lol like wtf does that even mean lolol like I'm sitting here trying to figure it out but like it is just complete nonsense lol like please explain that statement.... just so incredibly stupid and ignorant yet you call me that and than try to make it political... like why bring Politics into it?? Just trying to get a negative reaction?? Please explain... also lack of an explanation to the clear questions I posed back to you is an admission of mental inferiority to the person you called stupid.......

@Mollywhop Thank you. You confirmed everything I thought about you, and showed me you can't read either. That it wrong to hurt someone is the only answer you need. You are trying to make something complicated that isn't. The answer, like you, is that simple.

@Sticks48 again lack of an explanation to the clear questions I posed back to you is an admission of mental inferiority to the person you called stupid.......

@Mollywhop I'm not calling you stupid, you are stupid. There is a difference in name calling and observation. This is observation. I can do this shit all day long.

Come to think of it, I've not heard that from believers either. Maybe it just never came up in discussion. But there are many examples of believers beating their kids in the name of their lords or whatever.

@itsmedammit I'm not saying it never happens. And, especially what you bring up, I have seen that happen. I used to live across the street from someone like that. Church Deacon on Sunday... Beats his adopted kids for the other 6 days of the week. He has Alzheimer's now though. I am sure he doesn't remember a thing. He certainly doesn't remember me.

Cool thanks so because you NEVER ONCE heard something that means it never happens.... sound logic there..... like I also said it is bad because of the effect it has on society. But you added that because it is illegal that makes it wrong so do you also follow the logic if something is legal it is right...??? Not really sure that works to well but yea my post is the ignorant one......
Also the whole 'do unto others......' propaganda bullshit you are trying to quote makes no actual sense it is one of many psychological tricks used to get people to passively accept negative treatment from others in authoritative positions without offering resistance and actually helping the one oppressing them... maybe it is better to treat others the way they treat you because obviously that is the way they want to be treated
Tell me more how specifically my post is ignorant......

@Mollywhop You apparently have a hard time reading... And writing.

@RiverRick why is that? Help me than! Why is it apparent I am having a hard time reading... and writing?? And please don't bring up typos, not really intrested in spelling or grammatical errors, I totally concede that I am not the greatest at spelling or typing perfectly. I am intrested in the philosophical ideas that have been brought up.... so what is apparent???
Also you didn't answer the question posed to you... are you just going to ignore that? If so why respond only to try to personally offend me by attempting to insult me lol. Such pathetic behavior... I am unimpressed with you tbh.....

@Mollywhop it is apparent to all of us that you are desperate for an excuse for your wishes/actions.....good luck in Gen Pop during your sentence-serving. (And by "goodluck" I mean you get to feel what violation feels like!)

So than you support the idea that there are certain moral principles that are absolute universal. Like there are certain actions that will always be right and certain actions that will always be wrong? And what makes it right or wrong is that 'we inherently know this as humans'
So than what if the majority of humans changed their moral stance on an issue that we had previously 'inherently known as humans' would the rightness or wrongness of the action also change based upon what the majority of what people think..... or ....... is the rightness or wrongness of an action measured in a different way than 'inherently knowing something as humans' ??
Another way to say it is if someone told you that one race or gender was inherently superior to another, after you rightly called that person a racist and sexist, you asked why he or she feels like that and the person responded that he or she 'inherently knew this as a human' would you now have to believe this or is 'inherently knowing something as a human' not a good tool to measure truth? Can 'inherently knowing something as a human' possibly lead to both true and untrue statements and if so than why use that as a justification for knowing truth?

@Mollywhop I’m afraid you lost me somewhere in that convoluted argument. But I will just make it clear once again that I believe we inherently know as humans what is morally correct...this goes back to our earliest times when it was crucial as humans to cooperate within our tribes to defend from wild animals and outsiders. If we broke the social mores we would either be killed or thrown out of the tribe to fend for ourselves in the wilderness. Because rape and assault were always considered wrong...that was why conquering armies specifically used rape as well as pillage to subdue the tribes they came to subjugate...as armies still do today.

Poor darling, that's incredibly brave of you to air your sentiments in this way, hear, hear!

Anne that is such a horrible violation for anyone to endure, let alone a 2 year old baby. I am so sorry you have endured such pain.

Lol tbh I'm not even a little bit concerned if you are offended or not by what I typed. Like do you honestly think I would at all care? Like I don't know you. Lol it's crazy that you can make an abstract thought all about you. So incredibly arrogant!! Like believe it or not this post wasnt about you because I don't know you.....
Also you say that by me talking about a philosophical idea that somehow shows you that I am 'a person to be avoided at all costs' but than you are initiating contact with me by responding to a post..... like that is SO INCREDIBLY STUPID lol like if you actually believe that than why are you not following your own advice and avoiding me at all costs??? Lolol that is unbelievably stupid and literally one of the craziest things if you think of the lack of logic in what you said... why would you ever initiate contact with someone you have never spoken to and doesnt know you even exist if you felt they were someone to avoid at all costs?? I am rarely amazed at how shortsighted and ignorant people can sound but you are rare. I guess you are proof that age and intelligence don't correspond as at 71 one wouldn't expect that egregious of an error. I doubt you will answer tbh....

@Mollywhop lololol, like, tbh, you're an embarrassment so why keep talking?

@Mollywhop pedophiles Never have "abstract thoughts", they are totally focused on 1. Their Next victim 2. Justification. Oh, and they get incredibly defensive when called on their BS.....look in the mirror, lately?

So it is wrong in your view because a child cannot defend themselves is what you are saying? And what do you mean by defend in this sense? And does your reason for why it is wrong being the individual is defenceless apply to just children or all people?
Like saying because it has the word abuse indicates it is wrong is similar to saying that the term abuse shows us that the action is wrong, so it is a tool to identify the rightness or wrongness of an action, but it is not actually a reason for why.....

@Mollywhop abusing anyone who cannot defend themselves is wrong.. Adults included... If you don't understand what I mean by "defend " , then I can't help you.. I've read all the replies here and your comments, you don't seem to except any individual answer or to even consider all the answers as a whole in order to seek an understanding of your post...

@Cutiebeauty like you obviously can't see what is going on.... defining terms is the first step to coming to an understanding. If you really have an issue with having to define a word than why even respond?? Also I'm not asking for your help in any way so I'm not sure why you are saying you can't help me.....

Also it's really wierd when people refer to themselves as physically attractive such as CUTIEBEAUTY like I think that says a lot about the person that they would want to be refered to as that. I also feel it is probably not the move of one that is mentally healthy..... seems like a move of one trying to portray something they are not aka a liar..... to me: the lady doth protest a bit to much methinks.......

@Mollywhop wow, scaping the bottom of the barrel for excuses (nasty, indefensible excuses) for Using a child....just a charming read, here.....

@Mollywhop oh, I understand now... You're a creep! Very funny acting like a philosopher and now also a psychiatrist .! Making a prognosis based only on one's username... haha speaking about ones username... What philosophy course taught you that, Molly? Are you man or woman? Who's the liar now? You're a pathetic troll... Also, your post is all over the place.. It doesn't layout a philosophical inquiry at all.. It's mostly rambling... Go back to school little one and stop acting like you know what you're taking about... Defining terms? What a moron!

That is stated way better than I ever could. Thank you that makes so much sense the way you said it!!

@Mollywhop My CAT could have stated it better than you. I repeat, GET SOME HELP. You are sad and creepy and probably dangerous.

Thank you for the way in which you clearly stated your points. My life would probably be at least a little easier if I had that ability to the extent you do. So....

1. For the negative responses, you feel I did not make it clear enough in the post that I am against hurting others and so some people mistook what I was saying as a way for trying to argue it is not actually bad to rape and abuse others mixed with the fact that I kind of glossed over the reasons with 'there are probably other good reasons too' very fair point I guess I just thought people would give anyone the benefit of believing they are against that unless explicitly saying they are not. But I guess some people are looking for the conflict and are willing to manufacture it. The point you made that no child or person would wish that upon themselves is really mind expanding for me as I have never thought about it like that, maybe because i have 0 experience with this type of interaction from either side but yea that is a really good reason for why it would be wrong.
2. So that is begging the question?
   Or 1 it is bad for society 2 the reason it is bad for society is 3 being bad for society effects the individual in this way 4 being affected this way is bad

Thank you for being nice in your response like I do want to expand my mind and I truly did not come into this at all trying to make enemies but I mean if it comes like I welcome drama like I don't believe in turning the other cheek

@Mollywhop sweet deal. I know it's hard through words on a screen to Express nuance sometimes. Things that seem obvious to others arent always obvious to me, because I have literally only had the last 2 years to start redefining what my entire outlook is based on. It's a slow process but I love learning things about myself and others who have successfully navigated out of religion (or never had to wander in) This seems like a good place to talk about a lot of different things. Sorry it can be bumpy. It's still the internet and we're all human
Cheers

Thank you for helping to express the idea I was trying to get to. Like I thought the connection was obvious but maybe only in my mind because I have been thinking about it maybe idk either way it's funny how you were able to say everything i was trying to in one sentence. Like that is such a good way to summarize it. Thank you again
And I also do agree it is a wordy mess ‍

Just wanted to point out that the mollywhop is a he not a she... According to his profile

@Cutiebeauty Thanks. I hadn’t checked out the profile, just went by the name...sign of the times, right?

I care the reasons why

@MissKathleen yep, maybe I'm a sucker for useless speculations

Cool thanks for the nothing comment definitely glad you pointed that out

@Mollywhop obviously not

This is a forum...

You know nothing about me.... what kind of help should I get? Please be specific. And exactly why should I stay away from children? Like is the problem me or that you CantUndertstandNormalThinking

@mollywhop lololololol.

@Mollywhop you have obviously done something terribly wrong & are now looking for excuses/justification. Your increasing hysteria & aggression o normal commentary shows every normal person on here, plainly, you are Not Right! Good luck in Gen Pop.........

Definitely nailed god's involvement

And I think you have failed utterly to understand anything about the point being made in the comment. It’s not about whether any particular act is moral or not. The point is that Religion is not capable of teaching morality.

@Azatheist If the post had been more succinct about what the author was after as far as discussion perhaps more of us wouldn't have "failed utterly" in understanding this persons point. I agree with you, religion is not capable of teaching morality.

I think you are missing the point tbh like your answer 'because it's bad to hurt people' --- ok but why is it bad to hurt people? Like your answer lacks an actual reason.....

it all lacks an actual reason. you can drill down as far as you like but you still end up with "but why." i did not actually miss the point at all.

g