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Why is it that atheists, at least in the USA, can bash christianity relatively freely, but if we insult islam, we are called racists or islamaphobes?

Islam is every bit as hateful and wrong as christianity, but it's off limits because its followers are mostly minorities or immigrants. Are we afraid of the repercussions for pointing out islamic bullshit?

JimG 8 Mar 30
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22 comments

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5

You're right. It's all bad. Religious fakery of all kinds. No God, just patriachy oppressing and sucking the life out of the common man. BTW it is okay to slam Islam, but it it not okay to slam Arabs, Asians and others who look and act differently. If you check under the hood, you will find that most anti-Islamic rhetoric is actually racial and ethnically based.

4

I agree that Islam is just as wrong as Christianity. That being said, I feel that I have no place speaking out about something I have no personal expiriance with. I was raised both Lutheran and Catholic. Christianity is what I know and am comfortable speaking out against.

4

Its a good question. I think a lot of people don't really understand why and that gives rise to a 'victim' mentality,

Firstly, imo, you shouldnt be insulting ANY religion or set of beliefs. When did you last change your views after someone called you a @% (insert your fave expletive)?
I doubt if theres any of us that don't hold a strange belief or two. Theres a world of difference between 'challenging' and 'insulting'

Secondly, context IS important. Whats your objection to Christianity? Is it that they believe some weird shit about a virgin having a baby with god and that wiped out all the sin that had been incured by a woman that ate an apple when asked to by a snake....? No of course it isnt. Lets face it, thats actually quite funny. My guess is what we actually object to is the power that these organisations have managed to acheive over us.

So in our respective countries we can bitch about Islam or Christianity but only one of those has any serious impact on my life and here the context comes in.... the vast majority of muslims in my country (and i suspect yours) are darker skinned and ( i don't know this so forgive me if i'm wrong) probably 1'st or 2nd generation immigrants. Whereas the majority ( not all but the majority) of christians are white and probably have a longer connection to the country.

The outcome of this is that if i insult muslims in my country its far more likely that im insulting recent immigrants and people of relatively little power and therfore people who are perhaps more vulnerable. Whereas if i insult christians theres far more of them, they are more established, not as visible.....

At this point i reiterate that insulting anybody at any time is not really a great thing to be doing 🙂

I often wonder what Native Americans must think of it all. You lot have only been there for a few hundred years and you didnt bother learning the languages or customs.... Its no wonder youre so frightened of other cultures taking over 😉

I never insulted anyone. Why would we associate criticism of beliefs with criticism of people. If you posted criticism of a scientific theory nobody thinks twice of it. I might argue with you if you insulted my tastes in music, but I wouldn't take it personally. Why take it personally if someone would say that Jesus didn't rise from the dead or there is no afterlife with 72 virgins waiting for you?

Maybe I should have said question or criticize islam rather than insult, but religious people are pretty quick to see even the most moderate criticism as a personal affront.

I don't see insulting a belief as the equivalent of insulting a human being. I think the most dangerous aspect of any religion is when they value their beliefs above the lives of human beings.

@JimG you state in your opening post 'if i insult islam....' I think essentially my point still stands. Its HOW you go about challenging a religion or belief. people have a lot invested in their beliefs wether those beliefs are based on nationality, religion, science, whatever... And if you are a white person in a white country its more likely to be construed as racist than if you were an Arabic person for example.

I have to say I'm dissapointed about the 72virgins. I was kind of banking on that 😉

@JimmyM I understand that people are invested in those beliefs and identify with them in the case of religion. I disagree with people placing more value on their beliefs than human life.

Add: my longest three relationships have lasted an average of 7.5 years. 72 virgins isn't going to cut it for eternity. 😉

4

I don't see religions as being hateful. I see some humans that practice them and berate you for not being of like mind, or trying to continually push their beliefs on you, as intensely dislikeable !

I don't know how else to describe religions that preach that apostates, nonbelievers, immodest women, etc should be put to death.

@Akfishlady Exactly. No one religion earns the hatefulness award - they all share.

3

no need to insult or bash , just rational commentary would do .

I should have said criticize, but I used the terms used by religious people when their beliefs are scrutinized.

3

All religions are bullshit but some are more pernicious than others and Islam is one of the worst and possibly the worst one! Mormonism and Scientology are terrible too and they were invented in the USA.

3

I bash all religions with equanimity.

3
I don't bash anybody.  Christianity is being used by trumpty dumpty and the Republicans to form social policy in this country.  Messing with education, football games, and LGBTQ rights are solely hateful Christianity. 

The Muslims do not interfere with our institutions the same way.  Big difference.
3

Where in the USA can atheists bash Christians, exactly? And why are we "bashing" anyone...my definition of "atheist" is someone who minds their own business & wants others to do the same!
And I find your post pretty racist, btw.

Man, answering this is getting old. I never mentioned insulting human beings. Why can't we distinguish between a people and their religion?

@JimG sorry, totally nonresponsive to my question...

Bashing and insulting are the terms religious people use when you criticize religion. That's true of any religion, but the way. If I'm not responsive to your question, please highlight where you responded to mine.

@JimG Again: Where in the USA (or anywhere, really) do atheists get to bash Christians? Maybe if you are a talk- show host.........

2

"Both horses have jaundice"
BUT the motto is "In God We Trust", not "Inshallah". It's about whose beliefs are written into the laws of the country. Who has the most power over your life? Moslems or Evangelicals? Humour and mockery is the weapon of the underdog against the powerful. Turning it on an equally disempowered group in your society (they are the power structure in others, and should be mocked by those people. And in fact are) is self-defeating, in that it takes focus off the power structure, and somewhat cowardly, given that you are then "punching down".
Ultimately it's not about Islam, it's about you.

2

For one, you're messing with a hornets nest. For two. why do you feel the need to insult them or even re-educate them? For three, I would be afraid of the repercussions for pointing out Islamic bullshit due to the populace of fanatics in that religion who are ready to chop off your head. Shall I go on? Your pointing out its followers as mostly minorities or immigrants sounds blatantly racist as well making me question your real motives.

SamL Level 7 Mar 30, 2018

I referred to them as mostly minorities and immigrants in the United States. If I am wrong about that please show me some proof. You just exemplified my point.

@Bierbasstard There is nothing racist in the post until he points out minorities and immigrants. What is the point in pointing that out?

@JimG and your point in pointing that out is what?

In some countries in the MIddle East, Islam is the state and the state is the people. There is no separation. There is no choice. There is indoctrination from day one. You are Muslim until you die or escape but since they're as fanatical as they are, escape is futile, unthinkable, and fatal.

@SamL I'm pointing out that the instant you criticize islam, you are accused of racism or islamaphobia. People like you will try to portray criticism of the religion as an attack on the people who practice it.

You're proving my point. My initial question was why do people do that. Could you please explain?

@Bierbasstard You're missing the point unless it's on purpose. Why bring up minorities and immigrants at all then? In the US whenever talk is brought up about immigrants and minorities the underlying theme is about race.

@JimG LOL people like me? What exactly are you saying now?

@JimG As I said earlier in response to Bierbasstard. Your post was fine until you added immigrants and minorities.

@SamL I'm referring to my questioning whether criticism of religion is off limits because it's seen as racism, xenophobia, or islamaphobia, and you attempt to portray me as racist.

@JimG Please explain to me how and when I called you racist? Also, please, explain why others in your thread have deemed your remarks racist but you've not bothered to even address them? It seems this is a sore point for some, perhaps because you're not aware of how your remarks are perceived.

2

Islam is based on the Judeo Christian religion as is Mormonism. Islamic terrorists are Wahhabists. Wahhabism is an Islamic cult or sect practiced in Saudi Arabia and is spreading from there.

2

It depends on what the criticism is. If there is a suggestion that muslim=terrorist, for example, that is definitely islamophobic.

1

Go to a present day moslem state, (try Pakistan), and mock Christianity. The people will laugh.
Mock Islam, or even criticise the Quran or say something about Mohammed, and you will be hunted down and killed. THAT IS REAL DISCRIMINATION.

1

I think I'm one of the seemingly few liberals that agrees with people like Sam Harris and Bill Maher on this subject.

1

Or we fear for our lives..

1

I ignore all of them. If one will pick an argument with me over their personal belief, I will tell them that I am happy for them but request that they keep me out of it,.

1

Same in UK they just use anything to stop people criticizing them ignore and carry on dismantling their beliefs

1

Welp Islam is not a race. But I've noticed this from regressives.

1

I disagree we can do it freely. And we shouldn't be bashing anyone.

0

I believe your right and its the do-gooders standing up for them. how comes you can have a ms black America beauty contest but not Chinese or white?

How do you know there isn't?

? what do you mean? I've watched credits and Oscars too and seen best black actor/actress but never seen best white.

0

Ignorance of mankind

Rosh Level 7 Mar 30, 2018
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