Pascal’s wager, the most overused Christian argument in existence.

Pascal's wager has a flawed premise. If I waste the time and money on the actions required by belief I have lost quite a lot. Add in opportunity cost on forbidden things (thinking shellfish and mixed fibres here, not murder) I have lost even more. This loss can only be justified if the pay off is heaven.
No heaven? I've been bilked.

My though is this:
I don't believe in God, but for the sake of argument...

1. God made me and gave me free will to either believe in him or not. How can he fault me either way?
2. I live my life as best I can, I try to be a good person and do what's right. Not because I fear the magical man in the sky, just because I'm not a dick. I suspect that any rational God would want me in heaven rather than some murdering jackass who happens to go to church and/or confession every once in a while. And if not, that's just effed up.

So whatever argument gets thrown at me, I'm solid and comfortable in my non-belief.

I'm with Stephan Frye on this on. Why would i want to believe in such a mean, capricious, hateful, uncaring, malevolent creature who makes sure Osteen has a mansion & Creflo Dollar gets his plane but God allows children to die horrifically of cancer, starvation & in wars. "Worship & love only me, put me first in everything & I will give you eternal life in a beautiful place but ignore me & I will torture you forever. Oh wait, John Wayne Gacy gave his life to me & asked for forgiveness just before he died so he's saved. This person who's never heard of me died. Yup sinner...going to hell." Fuck that. (Edited to correct typos)

If there is a god, and heaven is real, who would really want an eternity there? Every description of it is designed to appeal to the illiterate, middle ages peasant/slave who toiled for his or her lord and master, sacrificing everything. Even the part that promises a wealthy man is unlikely to enter heaven is designed to keep the poor subjugated.

If there is a God and it’s from a “man made” religion ie Christian, Muslim, Hindu... after all that you experience on this planet, the suffering, death, destruction....is that the being you want to spend eternity with? So by that rationale.... Who cares? Biblical God is a piece of shit! And due to the fact that the inconsistency of text, history, and current knowledge all suggests he doesn’t exist, the douche bag that thought the story up is a piece of shit!

If there is indeed a god and you only believed in him because of Pascal's wager wouldn't this god know that your "belief" was merely to game the wager and therefore invalid? To Hell you go anyway.

The idea one can 'choose' to have faith is ludicrous to me. I'm sure if you 'believed' in a god/religion/heaven only as a form of insurance, it would not count.

Everyone beat me to it. Pascal’s Wager. The downside to believing is all those Sunday mornings you could have been out doing fun stuff. ?

I’d say that this is Pascal’s Wager. The idea behind it is that even if we aren’t convinced that God does exist, we should choose and profess to believe anyway...just in case.

But two things: First, if God is omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient, then He’d know the truth of our false belief and we’d lose just as if we had no belief to start with. Second, belief is based on knowledge or else it’s an irrational position. If God doesn’t demonstrate His existence in a manner in which would be convincing and final (He should know how), then He has hidden Himself until this life is over and then gives you the finger for not believing without proof. At the end of the day, He would be playing favorites to those choosing to not think critically. Screw that noise.

That's Pascal's Wager is as bogus now as it ever was.

The lesser fallacy is that there is a risk of choosing the wrong god.

The greater fallacy (in my opinion) is that if there is no god, your finite lifetime is one of the most precious things you have, and you will have wasted part of that finite lifetime in worship.

"If you believe in God, and there is no God..." then you've probably wasted your whole life attending church, donating money to the church, following religious strictures that have no basis. Of course, the same thing happens if you believe in the wrong god, with the additional benefit of an unhappy afterlife.

Which god?

If you are referring to the christian maniac, then you're fucked either way.

It is allegedly all knowing, so if you did lie about believing, it would know that you didn't really believe.

Old saying that makes as little sense now as when Pascal thought of it. Not much of a thinker was he?

Only the deluded could posibly believe that there exists a diety who by sheer wizzardry could create a universe, Matter from nothing !, by a nobody ? A rather childish belief in fairies........ No I don't fear ever meeting this bullshitting character.............

There is no soul or life force after death to confront that deity or ponder its absence. Even if one supported a megachurch for years, that long anticipated soul to deity encounter will not occur. Just enjoy your thoughts and fantasies up to the point they are just gone and that includes conversing with imagined deities. I rather fantasize about horny old ladies.

And if you don't believe in the tooth fairy, you get rotten teeth later on? I think I'll take the rotten teeth over living the life of a cowardly idiot.

I will tell the bastard, "WTF? You hide from me and then want to punish me for not believing in you? What kind of games you playing?"

I usually hear the workaround that "If you're believing in god on a maybe, its not believing in god, and you're damned for not 100 % committing" ..at least thats what I was raised on. of course, for baptists you're always going to hell. always.

You could literally be in heaven, and a baptist would be there saying you're going to hell.

After I heard the description the Celestial Heaven that only Mormons can enter, it sounded like eternal slavery. But then again, Mormons are slaves to the church already.

Google Celestial, Terrestrial, and Telestial Kingdoms if you have some time to waste.

Pascal's wager. Well ... more nonsense.

I'd catch a cab to hell and stop at the liquor store along the way..

Such a saying shows a very flawed understanding of what it means to believe in something. It treats belief as something you choose, which just doesn't make sense. It's really just stupid, and insincere to boot.

No evidence of god.