Agree

The point is well made that the primary difference between most believers and all atheists is that atheists know they are not believers.

It boggles the mind, doesn't it? I often think that there's no way people can really believe it. Even my daughter when she was seven years old and.explaining what they told her in church (Her mother and I were separated.), asked me, "Do grow-ups really believe this? Are they crazy?"

You have to consider that churches have been "indoctrinating" their followers for.millennia. They start young, use mysticism, rituals, and symbols to convince people. It's all very elaborate. Music and hymns are great brainwashing tools. They instill fear that questioning their doctrines will earn you the most horrific punishments imaginable for all of eternity. Finally they promise eternal life. People really want to believe and are afraid not to.

You mean like where it says in the Bible that it's OK if you beat your slave to death as long as he/she doesn't die on the day of the beating because that shows that you didn't mean to kill them because after all why would you deliberately destroy your own property? That sort of thing?

I don’t think deep down that even true believers believe without any doubt. They just refuse to recognize the flaws in their beliefs. They are too invested in their beliefs to let any logic to seep in.
All the big rich preachers absolutely don’t believe but they get rich off of convincing others. If they truly believed they would get rid of their money and care for the sick and poor.

My question was always: what does "believe" actually mean in this case? Priests in my hometown regularly said God didn't exist in the same way you or I do, and that initially tipped me off that it might all just be BS.

I think y mom does. She's been religious all her life. She knows I'm atheist and is not OK about it but we still have a good relationship. She doesn't have anyone else and keeps praying for me. Then says she knows how I feel about it but she's going to do it anyways.

I would have thought that if you really believe in a god or deity it's down to what you make of it, you certainly don't need a religion to tell you how to believe. If you're following a religion's way of doing things you actually believe in the religion not the god they believe in.

Can't spell believe without LIE.

obviously not! you're expecting logic from theists?

g

Do you like every track of your favourite composer, singer, writer, artist etc.? Most of us pick and choose particular lyrics, music , articles, paintings, book extracts and so on whilst still favouring the creator overall..So it us with believers who reject much of Leviticus or Deuteronomy whilst favouring the Gospels and the purported sayings of Jesus calling for love of neighbour and turning the other cheek.

Cherry pickers get on my nerve. I think 100% believers even have self doudts.

Thankfully, I can't know what is anybody else's mind. So you will have to ask them.

The hypocrisy idea is no longer up for debate,
The evangelicals follow Trump. Now again, I say the hypocrisy debate is over. It is as pure fact as the bowel movements I have.

There are people who believe in and attempt to live all 613 commandments in the bible. They are called Orthodox Jews.

My wife claims to be a believer, and I know she loves me. I don’t think she actually believes though. She doesn’t attend mass, and she never tries to talk me into believing, even though according to her religion, I’m destined for hell. I know she’d try to save me from eternal torture if she actually thought it was true.

I don't believe in any organized Religion. I just think there may be a God.

Agree

All I can say is there either must be a lot of cognitive dissonance out there, or a lot of very ignorant individuals.

Some yes, some pretends, some just give up so much to be part of the group that reality really distort, the person not ju
St believe, the persons sees, feel, hear, and live that reality. It is rely powerful, not true, but powerful.

I don't rule out "something". I just don't think organized religions have any more of a clue than I do. I feel like the origin of life is way above my ability to comprehend. It's a chicken and egg thing.

That’s the “super atheist” theory. The idea that NOBODY really believes or they wouldn’t do anything wrong if they actually thought they would live in eternal damnation as punishment.

In times of stress or times of pain, I think we all become weak and dependant. We ask for someone to help us, or relieve us of our pain, find yourself talking to someone, but really your just talking to yourself and hoping that you don't start answering too.

They believe enough to want to force other people to their beliefs to me it's all a scam for money and power

Got a wolfpack theory.
Wolves are very social creatures like humans. If a wolf gets rejected from the pack, he becomes a lone wolf, a wolf who can not survive without the pack and dies.
Most humans think this same way, except a lone wolf human can survive without the pack, as a strong individual.

A person will ignores many moral or unethical issues , for his stronger desires to be with his social pack, that would be religious.

For me, my desire is to not live a lie. That has been stronger than to be with most of the world population who are Religious packs of being hippocrites, based on fear.