LINK We Have Five Years To Save Ourselves From Climate Change, Harvard Scientist Says
I think we're screwed.
14
Enjoy being online again!
Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.Create your free account
33 comments
Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.According to Al Gore the artic was supposed to be ice free several years ago. The climate alarmist are quite looney and only want to impose they’re idiotic climate change agenda on us.
Trajan61
Level 8
June 16, 2019
1
Wow “ alarmists “ I majored in sciences and the Scientists are far more knowledgeable and fully understand the process of climate changes ..... you poopoo it as some states are under water expanding deserts , decrease Ag, increased flooding, storm and wild flowers ....I won’t be exchanging with you ... you sound like a trumpette
@Millerski25 backwardsman seems to have named himself about right. Too many people listen to and believe Rush Limbaugh and Alex Jones instead of real scientists. Too bad they don't read a book by a real scientist like James Hanson's "Storms of My Grandchildren".
@Millerski25 Yes I am a Trump supporter and proud of it. Only an idiot would support the looney democrats especially the crazy ones like Omar and Ocasio Cortez.
@Bushshaker It would seem that you are unfamiliar with the meaning of the word “treason.” We have a president like that.
@Bushshaker So would I.
Ummm, they are Rapidly becoming so, Glacier National Park is green as is most of Greelnland & large parts of both poles, not to mention most of the glaciers in Europe, gone or retreating rapidly. Try looking at maps from now vs. 10 years ago, you fool
Guessing wrong for timescale is not a significant fault. Malthus was correct, but his timescale was off by hundreds of years.
Scary but true as all my research and readings say 5 years and with the prick as Pres we are reversing any progress we have accomplished... Hippie Chick it our children and grandchildren I worry about
Millerski25
Level 6
June 16, 2019
7
I think we are screwed too. The Earth does not care. We have too many folks on this planet and the planet will thin out the herd. I believe it is inevitable. I don't have children, but I do have friends with children and grandchildren. I do have a real concern that both, especially their grandchildren, are going to be in for a rough ride, and it saddens me.
Sticks48
Level 9
June 16, 2019
5
Interesting that you are childless or childfree, like me. No wonder we click so well. I agree with you, once again. Like Bowie used to sing, " We've got five years.....". The older I get, the more I take comfort in the things I will not be alive to see and suffer......
@TomMcGiverin Got to agree there. Like you I made a conscious decision that I didn’t want children although I do have step children in their 30’s now. All the indications are that this is not a good time to be born and many people take such joy in seeing another poor individual joining the ranks of the damned! (A bit melodramatic I know).
Oh well we are in it, can change it, but we can try to help our coexistentees through. It would be helpful if we could put all this religious/atheist nonsense down. It’s like being in a sinking boat and arguing over who should be baling out the water!
@TomMcGiverin as a Bowie fanatic, 5 Years was the first thing I thought of.
@Emerald Great minds think alike. Every time I sing that song at karaoke here in Iowa, people look at me like I've gone off my meds.....
@Geoffrey51 I think it was Krushev talking about nuclear war, who said, " The living will envy the dead".
@backwardsman Who are "you and your types"?
The tundra is melting. We are beyond the point of no return. Nothing humans can do will have any near future impact.
The problem is TOO MANY HUMANS. All the fires, and environment stripping is directly result of too many people.
The ONLY solution to long term human wellbeing, is to have LESS humans.
JacarC
Level 8
Mar 2, 2020
5
In the late 90's we were told we only had less than ten years. It's a real conundrum. If they say it's too late people will quit trying. If we still have time (but not too much) we will still try. Unfortunately, we are not only not getting closer but getting further. As long as we continue putting people ahead of the planet (I blame liberals as much as conservatives) there will be little chance for future generations.
This life and place is all there is. We are not special and are not destined for any sort of immortality.
JackPedigo
Level 9
June 16, 2019
5
Remi:
No one wants to say it, but we really need to stop reproducing
@Remi I have said it and so have others. But there is a conundrum that few will listen to. When I was a board member of Zero Population Growth we would ask women to try to limit their births (one woman on the board did just that). We often got the answer that , yes, they agreed but also they saw that the minority classes were having more kids and the middle-class groups would become a minority (we are on that road). It's a racist remark but it is true. How can we ask and expect women in this country, the biggest generator of greenhouse gases and with the highest carbon footprint, when we also import millions of people from other countries whose sole purpose it is, is to increase their carbon footprint? It is not fair and is creating many problems. The anger felt by the conservatives and poorer people in the country is palpable and the result of that anger is tRump and his ilk and I feel some of our gun violence. Until we deal with this issue there will be no talk of limiting our progeny.
Remi:
@JackPedigo well first off, it's not entirely the woman's fault she got pregnant so... That aside, educating women has proven to lower birth rates. We need to do a much much better job of educating people in general, but also educating everyone about sex ed. educating people about sex ed also is proven to lower the abortion rate which conservatives are so concerned about. I don't get it, there is a win-win solution to the abortion debate, but conservatives don't want to hear it. It would also help the environment, by causing less births. also reaching out to those immigrant women and helping them have a community, helping them get educated and get jobs, so that they are less likely to have as many kids. And then there's the whole religion part of the problem 
@Remi I am hearing the same story that it is just about education. More than 2/3 of this nations population growth is directly or indirectly (births within the first generation) due to immigration. My late partner was an immigrant from Iran and she was very concerned about this issue. She was a master educator for an international, Seattle public elementary school and asked her 2nd graders the question: what is more important people or dirt? The immigration issue is very, very complicated and when a large majority of newcomers don't know the language or the culture and are struggling just to get by family planning education is a non-option. She and I dealt with many aspects of immigration. I understand it has to not be about individuals or even people but the system we all (including immigrants) have to live. When that breaks down (which it is and not just here) everyone suffers. Nature does not care for people and will toss us aside in the blink of an eye. It is harsh but only we can prevent it and we are failing. Some of us and most of the younger generation will bear the brunt. Preservation of the natural system that sustains us needs to be the primary priority above all others.
Five years...might as well be five minutes. It means that at some point our carbon emissions will have to go negative. In other words, reducing emissions to zero will not be good enough. We will need to suck carbon out of the atmosphere. Meanwhile, as the responses of government and industry lag behind the curve, individuals can do a lot to reduce their own footprints: reduce/eliminate meat and dairy from their diets; stop traveling by air; ride a bicycle or walk whenever possible; reduce driving by eliminating unnecessary trips; line dry clothing; limit heating and air conditioning to times of extreme temperatures; generate electricity at home with solar panels or wind turbines where appropriate; drive an electric car; recycle and reuse wherever possible; eat locally-grown, organic food; have fewer children!
Flyingsaucesir
Level 8
June 16, 2019
5
Grow algae with chemical fertilizer and spread it on your yard as organic fertilizer.
@Flying, there is a recent study, sorry I've forgotten where, that hemp is the largest absorber of CO2 and cleans soil of contaminants.
@Bushshaker
Accoeing to what I have heard/read, the oceans are absorbing a lot of CO2. However, as they become warmer, the waters will have less ads less ability to keep gases in solution. And the higher the ocean CO2 concentration, the more acidic the water becomes, which will massively disrupt food webs, coral reef formation, and who knows what else.
If the Republicans stay in power, we are screwed in every sense of the phrase.
wordywalt
Level 9
June 16, 2019
4
You ain’t lying
If the democrats take over we are really screwed so what are you talking about.
We are in the 6th mass extinction event.
Like some of the others the actions of the dominant species helped that event along.
WE, being smart little primates, have managed to replicate the effects of all previous five extinction events, all in one, in a lot less time. Not millions of years, but a few thousand, once we discovered fire we set the world alight.
This is the 6th mass extinction event, we are both part of it and a driving factor of it.
A “mass extinction” can be defined as a time period in which a large percentage of all known living species go extinct. There are several causes for mass extinctions, such as climate change, geologic catastrophes (e.g. numerous volcanic eruptions), or even meteor strikes onto Earth’s surface. There is even evidence to suggest that microbes may have sped up or contributed to some of the mass extinctions known throughout the Geologic Time Scale.
Throughout the 4.6 billion years of Earth's history there have been five major mass extinction events including the
The Ordovician Mass Extinction
When: The Ordovician Period of the Paleozoic Era (about 440 million years ago)
Size of the Extinction: Up to 85% of all living species eliminated
Suspected Cause or Causes: Continental drift and subsequent climate change
The Devonian Mass Extinction
When: The Devonian Period of the Paleozoic Era (about 375 million years ago)
Size of the Extinction: Nearly 80% of all living species eliminated
Suspected Cause or Causes: Lack of oxygen in the oceans, quick cooling of air temperatures, volcanic eruptions and/or meteor strikes
The Permian Mass Extinction (The Great Dying)
When: The Permian Period of the Paleozoic Era (about 250 million years ago)
Size of the Extinction: An estimated 96% of all living species eliminated
Suspected Cause or Causes: Unknown—possibly asteroid strikes, volcanic activity, climate change, and microbes
The Triassic-Jurassic Mass Extinction
When: The end of the Triassic Period of the Mesozoic Era (about 200 million years ago)
Size of the Extinction: More than half of all living species eliminated
Suspected Cause or Causes: Major volcanic activity with basalt flooding, global climate change, and changing pH and sea levels of the oceans
The K-T Mass Extinction (The dinosaur asteroid strike)
When: The end of the Cretaceous Period of the Mesozoic Era (about 65 million years ago)
Size of the Extinction: Nearly 75% of all living species eliminated
Suspected Cause or Causes: Extreme asteroid or meteor impact
Each of these events varied in size and cause, but all of them completely devastated the biodiversity found on Earth at their times.
"WE, being smart little primates, have managed to replicate the effects of all previous five extinction events, all in one, in a lot less time. "
Davesnothere
Level 7
Mar 1, 2020
4
And this time, humans are here to witness, and learn. We live in interesting times.
I think you're right, and I think those Harvard scientists are far too late to the game, and far too optimistic in their projections. We passed the point of no return years ago... We are just now starting to see the weather being affected on a global scale. It's all downhill from here.
Kafirah
Level 8
June 16, 2019
4
I have some very bad news for everyone buying into all the hype: climate change is going to happen regardless of what we do. Has been for millions of years, and will continue to do so. And regardless of what you hear in the news, no one has any idea just how much of an impact man is having on this natural cycle. When there is this much money and power at stake, we are getting an agenda, not science.
Call me names and spew hatred at me all you want to (it's a typical response from most people who don't do much thinking for themselves, and the vitriol doesn't really affect me). But I have been in the finance game way too long not to see the obvious signs of a money making scheme. It's no coincidence that the cap and trade market has grown into hundreds of billions of dollars, and that the very people who are gaining from this growing, massive bubble are the very ones who are sponsoring the "research".
Think critically for yourself, or continue to buy into whatever the controlled media feeds you. But one thing I can assure you: the sky is not falling this time, either. The climate will change, it always has, but we have about as much of a chance of slowing it down significantly as we do controlling volcanic activity.
Piratefish
Level 7
June 16, 2019
2
So you reject the basic science involving greenhouse gases, as to why their presence traps heat?
Of course climate change happens all the time, but read the genuine science and you may understand better what is happening. Why would anyone 'spew hatred' at you? Science happens whether you believe it or not.
So you have a monopoly on thinking have you. ha ha
Yeah, right.
Yeah, people die all the time. Yeah, it's all pointless. Life is all hype, man, not just climate change
Pretty much the kind of comments I expected. I'm sure we're all going to die soon. Meantime, some people are making a ton of money off of all the hype, and not many seem to notice or care.
As far as the science goes, climatology is about as accurate as weather forecasting, seriously. We have no fucking clue. This isn't physics. It's p-hacking and fearmongering to make huge bank. And it wasn't all that long ago when top scientists were convinced that humans would soon evolve gills - all the data was there to prove it. Yet we're still gill-less.
If I've learned anything in life, it's never to trust what anyone says when there is so much money and power at stake. And if you think climatologists cannot be bought or influenced, that is just about as naive as one can be considering human nature and history.
Anyone else remember the hole in the ozone that was going to kill all of us in a few decades? Well, here we all are, all living and shit, and no worse for the wear. Believe what you'd like, just don't expect everyone to play along.
Well that makes me feel relieved
@Millerski25 Happy birthday.
So glad to hear a rational mind here. Far too many Chicken Little folks around. Read about climate history, this planet has had ice ages when the CO2 was much higher than today. The ice cover is growing in the arctic. The average temps are much lower here in the US than they were in the 30's
Money is driving this BS. It always has
@Boxdoc It always amuses me how excited some people get when you question what they hear on their favorite media outlets. And their responses are always the same: either hostility, name calling, or circular logic (the news reports can't be wrong, because here's another news report that says the same thing).
It's also amazing how many people believe climatology is a hard science, like physics. They're guessing - at best. They cannot even tell us what the weather will be like next week with any real degree of accuracy, let alone what the climate of the entire planet will be like in 50 years.
I also like how everyone focuses in on less than a century of data to extrapolate a phenomenon that lasts for dozens of millennia. Climate cycles are measured in the tens of thousands, even hundreds of thousands of years. A small deviation about the mean over the last few decades is hardly proof of a long-term trend. It's like trying to predict the entire season based on the opening set of downs in a preseason football game. Ridiculous. Why not analyze a more relevant timeline measured in tens of thousands of years instead of a few decades? Well, because then, the uptick over the last few moments suddenly becomes irrelevant. Pretty basic stats concept that a lot of people seem to have missed.
But I'm sure they're right this time; the sky really is falling now. Nevermind that the people funding the research are making billions of dollars from all the fearmongering.
Gills and webs between our finger and toes, that's what we should work on.
Spinliesel
Level 9
Aug 18, 2019
3
When these meteorologists and climate scientists can accurately predict the weather 10 days out I will pay more attention to them.
abyers1970
Level 7
June 18, 2019
2
One more time: weather and climate change are not the same.
@Spinliesel I’m familiar with the difference. My point is that when they can accurately predict the short term then I will have more confidence in them long term. Remember Al Gore predicted that certain cities would be underwater by now
By then it will be too late. It almost is already.
I have a theory. The earth's axis wobbles possibly as much as a quarter degree. That little bit of wobble is responsible for both ice ages and global warming. Less than 200 years of industry is not causing global warming, the wobbling of the earth's axis is the cause. We've only been keeping records of weather for a little more than 200 years, that's like 3 seconds when compared to 2+ billion years that the earth has existed.
RobertMartin
Level 8
June 16, 2019
2
Sorry, but you're wrong in two fronts.
1- we have figures going way further back. It's an entire subject called palaeoclimatology.
2- atmospheric scientists already take into account short cycle variance in the angular tilt of the earth, as well as the longer cycles of sunspot activity and orbital difference as the earth travels around the sun. It's not just the total change in ppm CO2 in the atmosphere, it's the rate of charge.
@MrBeelzeebubbles I suppose in that case nature itself will wipe out humans and then repair and reset itself.
@RobertMartin oh, I don't think that'll happen. Worse case scenario, lots of people will die. But there are tribes living in isolated microclimates in the Star Mountains of Papua New Guinea who will neither know nor care of we shoot ourselves in the proverbial face.
Remi:
@MrBeelzeebubbles you keep getting me with your defending reproductive rights and trans rights and now the environment...
@Remi and I ride a really cute scooter!
Remi:
@MrBeelzeebubbles maybe I need to look into that island in Ireland that wants Americans to move there... 
That's at least the same time zone... 
Good move. every 125,000 years much of the ice melts. This is in response to the 3 known wobbles. 25k years, 40k years, and 100,000, years.
125,000 years ago sea level was at least 30 feet higher than now. Nothing we can do about it other than move north, and learn how to farm the tundra.
If we haven’t done in 50 it’s not going to happen in 5!
Geoffrey51
Level 8
June 16, 2019
3
I'm not sure I agree that the problem is irreversible. I think we have the technology to fix the problem, but it will take a concerted herculean effort to do it.
bingst
Level 8
June 16, 2019
2
The technology, perhaps. But the will and ability to work on the problem, no way at all. Outer narcissistic shortsighted leadership, corporate and political, won’t even allow us to try.
I sadly agree that I have thought that we are screwed for some time now.
Stephanie99
Level 8
June 16, 2019
2
That shows you what kind of garbage science goes on at Harvard.
BD66
Level 8
June 16, 2019
1
Bury that head in the sand! That'll make the inconvenient truth go away!
Baloney!!!!!
BigMac10
Level 6
June 16, 2019
1
Shush, honey, the grown-ups are talking.
I love it how so many people have just given up and think that it's all over and there is nothing we can do. Humans are much more robust than we give ourselves credit. We will develop the technology to completely control the worlds climate sooner or later, and there are other things we can do to mitigate a lot of the problems.
For example, there are a number of unpopulated places on earth's surface that are currently below sea levels that could be flooded to produce hydro power and lower sea level overall.
Atmospheric CO2 can be made into a commodity, there are already several industrial processes that utilize CO2 to produce synthetic materials.
We have more drastic options as well, such as blocking sunlight by seeding clouds, deploying orbital mirrors, adding minerals to the oceans to make it absorb CO2, and my favorite, seeding plankton an harvesting it for bio-fuel.
Happy_Killbot
Level 7
June 16, 2019
2
@backwardsman What link? You say you have a link and mention flume gate several times in this thread, why didn't you repost it?
@Bushshaker fukishima killed the "plackton" now did it? All the "plackton" are dead because of a nuclear disaster at an outdated nuclear plant?
You just opened a can of worms that demonstrates a complete lack of understanding about any environmental issues. I am tired of having this discussion in the comments so I'm going to start a new thread about how nuclear is the cornerstone of minimizing or even reversing climate change.
@Bushshaker A meltdown literally means that the nuclear fuel melted. It's as simple as that. Those reactors were old by technological standards of the day, and are basically stone age compared to more modern designs.
The major problem with the Fukushima plants was not their design, it was their location. When they were constructed, they thought they would be safe from tsunamis and earthquakes based on the data that was then available. The odds are slim that the US will face a similar catastrophe. One reason we should be building new reactors in the US is so that we can replace our outdated ones, because boiling water reactors are trash.
The warnings seem to be coming in faster all the time. I think most experts are now saying that the tipping point is coming faster than was expected.
Not a time to buy a property on the coast.
CeliaVL
Level 7
June 16, 2019
2
Yes, it's coming faster, due to the feedbacks. All that polar ice has trapped CO2 and methane.
@bingst ive been accused of to much gas but I think you’re right there should an increase of released gases and this poses an even greater danger
Enjoy being online again!
Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.Create your free account
Share this post
Categories
Agnostic does not evaluate or guarantee the accuracy of any content. Read full disclaimer.