I've heard religious people say animals don't have souls, although I view the "soul" as the energy that is within us all, I believe this to be an untrue statement. I would think that we most likely run on the same energy just a different vessel. Was recently in a debate over this and made the points of; does a dog not dream, does it not show affection, does it not have a desire for treats? Ect.. Point being they share the same emotional reactions so I would believe if the "soul" is a real thing I would say animals have one too.
Whatever piece of me that connects with others on a feeling, compassionate level definitely is shared by other species. I'm comfortable calling it a soul for the lack of a better word. It's my non-believer's spirituality.
As an agnostic, I realize that the answer to this question is unknowable at this time. However mankind has seen countless realities become understood that were previously unthinkable. So why should we now assume that we know everything there is to know? It would seem plausible that something could exist beyond our scientific understanding that overlaps what we call life. And why should it have to be limited to the physical realites of this life? If there is something that would roughly meet the standard of "soul", perhaps it may include something like "goodness, or value", When I look into my dog's eyes, I see much more than "a dumb animal" looking back at me. It feels like he has a better chance to have a soul than some human slug like Donald Trump.
Yes on the end of there feet
Their. (-;
read my profile, I'm dylsexic
Humans and animals are sentinent beings. I wouldn't call it a soul as much as a conciousness of self. It wasn't too long ago that many Blacks were said to be soulless which was a given reason why they needed to be enslaved for "their own good." Southern slaveowners said they were raising them up by enslaving them.
I tend to define "soul" as the person's or the animal's personality and quirks that makes them a unique being. As an theist, that is th eonly definition that makes any possible sense to me.
I don't believe in the idea of a pert of an individualor animal livign on after death... other than in oru memories.
If the soul is defined as the thing that makes us unique from each is the energy that sustains us, then yes is my answer. If it is defined as that part of life forms that are immortal then no, I don't think so.
The word soul can have broader meanings, an old soul, the soul of a poet, kind soul, and soulmate which seems to be more commonly used as a descriptive and not indicate that someone may be immortal.
Added thought...Definitions of words from generation to generation have been altered and used as descriptives, "soul", being one of them. Cool, wicked, gay, and even race have had definitions added to them from their original meaning. Just because the word "soul" may have been originally associated with a religious belief doesn't mean it is the only description of the word. Soul searching, soul music, and the soul hero etc are not specifically religious.
It may be an indication that commonly used "religious" words gaining new definitions is a good thing. If we keep giving them new meanings that we can use on a common basis it would take some of the power from their original intentions. Maybe.
We don’t have souls. There is energy in all living things including plants. But not souls.
There’s energy in everything, even empty space.
@indirect76 Energy is a soul
soul
sōl/Submit
noun
the essence or embodiment of a specified quality.
"he was the soul of discretion"
synonyms: embodiment, personification, incarnation, epitome, quintessence, essence; More
I think I've answered this before but here we go. Not only do animals NOT have souls - neither do you. That's right. That amazing science book "The Holley Bibble" declared that man became a living soul. Logic would say you could also be a dead soul. A "soul" was not anything extra that you were given.
Why would man want a soul? So that he could have "dominion" and be better than the animals.
I can't give a consistent answer because it depends on the definition of "soul". Dogs have a certain level of self-awareness and they have emotional needs and responses, so they should not be treated like personal accessories to be color-coordinated with the furnture (and yes, I've actually seen this happen). They should be treated with respect and empathy for their feelings and their feelings and needs should not be devalued because their understanding and self-awareness is at a lower amplitude than ours.
Usually such questions in my experience are asked by people who have such a muddled concept of "soul" that they confuse it with "spirit" and what they really want to know is if their dog will join them in the afterlife. I personally believe that both me and my dog face oblivion, so it's a moot question to me.
"although I view the "soul" as the energy that is within us all"
What would that be exactly?
The micro current in our brains on which our conciousness resides like a program?
A Bio electric current which cannot exist with the bio mass creating that?
To equate dreams and emotions to the prescence of some soul, is to elevate all conscious beings to some esoteric level for which there is simply no evidence, because they have brains capable of dreams and emotions.
Soul
noun
What makes you think there are souls, BUT NOT Zeus, Hera, Thor and so on?
Sometimes a person's day to day existence over decades lend credence to certain ideas for that person. If it can't be proven to your satisfaction, that does not negate the sense of what life is and what it is to be alive.
Honestly people who can live here and not feel any sense of inexplicable connection to the planet or other people sort of amaze me.
@CallMeDave I have that sense of connection of which you speak, it is part an parcel of being human.
That does not make it supernatural in any way shape or form, it is an emotive state of mind. Lots of things can evoke it, this place does for me . . .
To me your just labeling a beautiful feeling "spiritual", when there is no evidence of spirits at all, because religion hijacked the feeling and labeled it eons ago.
Why would the feeling of connectedness lead you to think we are not temporal, like everything else in nature?
Why we would be the sole exception to the rule of change, birth life death decay, new births from decay ad infintum
WHY would we be "souls" that never die?
@Davesnothere
Why would the feeling of connectedness lead you to think we are not temporal, like everything else in nature?
Who proved that everything in Nature is temporal? Where?
Why we would be the sole exception to the rule of change, birth life death decay, new births from decay ad infintum
I have no idea and I did not claim this to be true.
WHY would we be "souls" that never die?
I did not claim that to be true either
@CallMeDave That is the definition of soul
the spiritual or immaterial part of a human being or animal, regarded as immortal.
immaterial and immortal
It seems rather obvious that everything in nature is temporal. Can you think of something it it which is eternal?
Seasons change, Mountains erode and rise up from tectonic shift, all creatures are born, live, reproduce (hopefully) and die, Suns burn out, an endless cycle of change, temporal.
of or relating to time as opposed to eternity.
Why would our shared sense of Awe, Of Wonder, Of connectedness indicate an Immortal Soul. We know these are emotive staes and can see that in real time on brain scans, why would you thin it indicates MORE than that without any evidence OF more than that (a soul itself)?
@Davesnothere I only suggest that the criteria so many atheists use, namely, existence must be proven scientifically, also apply to claim such as this temporalness. Common sense doesn't apply to scientific findings.
@CallMeDave Then it has long been proven. We live and we die, and the issue is not that I have some need to prove temporalness, of which he have the entirety of history and graveyards chock full of evidence (the dead), but rather the Soul itself which must be proven.
Common sense does not apply right?
So existence of the soul needs to be proven scientifically.
@Davesnothere "not apply" might rightfully offend some scientists so maybe Not Overrule would have been better, on my part.
I still think it's a leap from witnessing the death of grass every year to All Nature is Temporal, but I don't claim to have proof of that.
@CallMeDave What have we ever seen in Nature that is ETERNAL?
NOTHING.
As far as we can see, to the Big bang event, which we do not comprehend fully, things begin with a bang and it is constant change.
throughout the universe
Galaxies being born and dying
Black Holes swallowing stars
Stars being born, burning out, collaspsing and exploding into new systems.
On earth the planet has been through 5 extinction events, where life went through a tiny bottleneck.
We are both living in the 6th.
How do you not see this reality as Temporal? Temporary (for Us)
Because we can concieve of Eternal does not mean Eternal exists, it could be that we imagine Eternal presciesely because we can see no evidence of it.
The Concept of the Soul, is what is being proposed to be Eternal.
How very SPECIAL of us, that we Humans, this particular primate on this particular sphere of dirt is so special that it is the only thing which is Eternal in the whole universe?
In religion this is justified by Dogma, God is also Eternal (and invisible) and made us like him.
And yet we have not a shred of evidence to back this idea.
Can you not see the ego in that way of thinking?
Can you not see the fear in it? Fear of death, of the Temporal nature of things?
For thousands of years religious ideas have taught, worldwide, that we are SO SPECIAL that we are not really part OF nature, we are instead "Eternal Souls" housed in Nature.
You don't see that?
@Davesnothere of course but I'm not a dogmatic Christian or any kind of Christian and I think I hope not any kind if dogmatic.
What is eternal? The universe? Whatever happened around or before the Big Bang?
Whatever it is, there is the soul. Maybe.
@CallMeDave What is eternal? NEVERENDING, I find nothing whithout end. Even concieving of such a concept stretch the mind to its breaking point, like contemplating the number of stars or ever expanding space.
"Whatever it is, there is the soul. Maybe."
And what is that exactly? Another mystery, so much so that we ourselves would be that mystery?
Rather than accept what seems evident, that we are just another primate on a backwater planet on the outer spiral arm of a distant galaxy far from galactic Center? That we, like all living things, are born, live, and die?
Somehow we are "Immortal", and in order to deny death we instead postualte this immortal soul for which we have no evidence?
Why isn't just being what we are enough?
Cultural Indoctrination?
Fear of death?
It puzzles me why people feel the need for these fantastical ideas,when we still have all of this yet to explore, to learn. Why do folks need more?
@Davesnothere Could you accept that some people have some such, probably more vague, fantastical ideas without any need for them?
@CallMeDave I can accept that they have such fantastical ideas, even that they are utterly unaware of any need for them, they could be unconcious.
But I see no reason why people would hold to fantastical ideas like eternal souls without some driving impetus, most likely a HOPE, that when they die the soul lives on, somehow, someway, and they never really examine that because it is uncomfortable in the extrme to them in an emotional sense.
I can also accept that people, myself included, hold to entrenched ideas which we grew up with in our societies. We might not even think about them, habitual ways of thinking and believing, and in such ways of thinking people who do not subscrbe to religion or even believe in God will cling to remnants of those Dogmas, Souls, Faith, Life after death; with no real model for what that might look like from a religion but nonetheless have a "faith" in it, a trust it is there.
So yes, people can and do have such things.
It does not make them vaild or rational, and often impossible to prove so because of their fantastic nature.
not in the all dogs go 2 heaven sense, but i do think all living things have some as of yet unexplained by science sort of spark. i don't think it has 2 do with anything a god gave us or any of that, i just think if there is a soul, it can and will eventually be explained by science, it will be another one of those things where for a long time people didnt have an explanation, so they came up with a god story 2 explain it, then eventually we will figure it out, but the uber religious folks probably still won't except it as such
No such thing as a soul strictly speaking in the sense that nothing survives the death of the host body. I would use the term as an adjective though. As something could contain a soulful quality; an intangible meaning or resonance.
@Scotttheshot Is there another word that describes the condition?
If you view the Soul as equaling Sentience then yes. I work with dogs every day professionally and have 3 at home. Each one is different just like we are and have likes, dislikes, and different cognition. I have trained and used my dogs as therapy dogs and have experienced empathic like behavior in more than one of my dogs. One was able to get a stroke victim to speak for the first time in a year. The person later experienced another stroke and passed away. When we went back to the hospital my dog spent a day looking for him and when he didn't find him, refused to go back and do any more therapy visits. My other dog senses the triggering of my PTSD and intervenes without any prompting.
No more and no less than we do. We are also animals.
This! "We are also animals."
As a believer in reincarnation, I believe every animal and human have souls. Look into the eyes and one can see the soul, the sentient being inside. This is how we bond with our pets. Our souls recognize each other.
@SACatWalker as an atheist, do you believe in any afterlife? I'm not intending to argue. I just want to learn about other beliefs.
What are the properties of a 'soul?' If it exists, it must be observable and measurable. When does it manifest itself? At birth? Before that? At a particular level of devlopement? Are there 'less devloped' souls in some, while others have 'more developed' ones? Might a person be without one? Do souls outlast the beings they inhabit? How does this work, in terms of biology and physics?
If we're of the opinion, and that's really all it can be at this point, that souls exist, they would have to be a purely natrual, evolutionary phenonemon, as opposed to something 'divine' or of 'supernatural' origin, correct? And this would imply millions of years of soul evolution, during which time awkard, vestigial souls may have been discarded, in favor of more robust ones. If animals have a soul, surely Lucy did, as she walked the savannah some 3.2 million years ago.
A Nobel Prize awaits the biologist or neurologist (not the metaphysician) who proves, scientifically, the existence of souls.
The thing is you state: People say animals don't have souls. Then you give your definition of soul. I guess that your definition of soul doesn't match with what "People say". To compare you need to agree on the definition.
In this situation I would say that, if people have a soul based on their self-conscious experience of their individuality, animals most likely have a soul too, depending on the quality of their thinking, the measure of self-consciousness and the awareness of individuality.
So, I can't vote here.