LOL! I just noticed how old this thread is. I replied to it over a year ago. SMH.

@Bobby9 someone who happens to be trans

I believe it's even more about social outlook than anything else. It is about what people will say if they see me with a trans woman. For men, it's a lot of time, does that makes me gay???? The last one i always think it's so funny because my attraction is to straight manly man.
My last boy friend is a british actor and he was very confident with is sexuality and certainly not gay.

I have to agree with Michelle, I know "conservatives" who are pro GLBTQ+

My parents are devout and even think homosexuality is a sin, that's none of their business.

They also make care packages for foster kids and happily make care packages for little boys, little girls and gender neutral care packages.

@educatedredneck I think it depends on where you live.here in the south, conservatives are Evangelical Christians .very ,very few exceptions. I personally have never met a conservative/republican atheist in person ever. if there are any they're totally in the closet and would never admit it to anyone.

@Kojaksmom maybe, I lived on the AL/GA border for a bit and met a handful of conservative atheists. Obviously I can't know how they were with most Christians, but I know one small business owner didn't hid the fact he raised three children to be atheist.

I've also talked with academics who don't feel safe in being public about any conservative leanings.

Maybe conservative atheists face backlash from all sides and many just play it safe?

@Lucifer_M Je ne te parlais pas...... Merci quand même

@Lucifer_M nope

Rx for trans are no different than a cis woman on the pill. Post surgery transgender need only one pill a day that all. Shouldn't be a problem with deployment.

@Michellefrusa It's always possible things have changed or what I read wasn't accurate. What I read is Rx for some post-op trans people requires refrigeration and expires in a few months. Do you think ALL Rx for trans people is not like that today? Do you have a link please? I'm not super smart on birth control, I've never dated a woman on the pill although I do think some Rx birth control does require stable temperatures and you shouldn't take BC that's several months old? Serious questions on all that.

Plus that Rx can impact mood, Rx that impacts emotions automatically negates all weapons training for 90 days. Military docs have no say at first on that, when many drugs are prescribed at first or the script changes slightly, the system automatically bans them from all weapons training. Docs can risk their licenses by negating that exemption after 60 days. So if people are stable on their Rx, regardless of why they're prescribed it, then I'd support them serving.

@educatedredneck at the beginning of transition yes there is an injectable hormone to take and to keep refrigerated, and you take on shot a month, but when your hormones level reach the same level than a cis women you stop taking this kind and take just a pill or stick a weekly patch. There is no need to keep any of those refregirated. An enlisted and deployed person could keep up to 3 or more months in their belongings.
As the mood changes, it not any different than a woman getting in her cycle. Some feel it more than other. Nobody feel the effects the same way. Only in movies you will see a transgender getting bunker because she don't have her hormones. But yes if this was happening for a long period that transgender would get very depressed, somewhat like a woman getting menopausal.

@Michellefrusa thanks for the factual information.

Again, please correct me if I'm wrong on the facts but I believe that beginning period of transition can last over a year? I think medical professionals used to mandate living fully transitioned (forgive me if I don't know the correct lingo) and taking hormone therapy for an extended period of time. Then there's the surgery and recovery from surgery, stabilization on new medication...

That means someone in the military wouldn't be able to train with weapons or deploy to many locations for well over a year, maybe even three years or more?

If I have all the facts correct, then my objection stands. People diagnosed with cancer that medical professionals expect a full recovery in a year also forced out of the military until they're stable and can fulfill all aspects of being in the military. My objection is giving any group special treatment.

There's already policies for individual exemptions. I was given an age waiver but everything else was 100% and medical experts knew my age wouldn't impact my non-combat job. BUT I had to prove I could do every aspect of the new job and there wasn't a special exemption for groups of people that would impact the military as a whole.

If everything you're saying is correct, then post-op people who are stable on their medications should be able to serve in the military. I met a sergeant who claimed to have a M-F Soldier who is a PT stud, but don't know any of the details.

Please correct any of my language if it's wrong

There's one service member whose medical details I know very well had to leave the military for nearly two years bc they were diagnosed with cancer. A full recovery was expected and they came back in as soon as they could. That person has several combat deployments and has been honored for valor in combat.

They came back in a combat, heavy physical job and they're really a scary workout freak now. I hope cancer never comes back, but that's just an example that the military doesn't and shouldn't make special exemptions for entire groups of people.

@Palacinky well I rarely engage people who simply dismiss what's being said as "completely incorrect" without any discussion, especially when Michellefrusa seems to be saying I'm not completely incorrect. I freely acknowledge I'm not an expert on estrogen or Rx for trans people, but I also won't dismiss people or what they say without actual research.

Your "well know secret" about anabolic steroids doesn't remotely fit my experience with the military and I'm betting I have a little more experience in the US military than you do. Military are randomly tested for various drugs including steroids, there have been a few cases where people supervising the UAs have helped cover up drug use and there's also new designer drugs created specifically to dodge UAs.

I'm also curious what you think the rate of suicide and violence is in among men in the military.

If you want to have a respectful dialectic, I'm totally game. Such discussions usually take a long time but IME can be a lot of fun and very informative especially if people acknowledge what they believe they absolutely know v what they merely think is true, then you get into acknowledging what you think is likely valid, likely common but not universal...and all that would be very flexible and open to challenge and acknowledging error. If you merely want to declare thins wrong solely based on what you think, you're welcome to create echo chambers with people who will applaud what you say but I'll mostly ignore what you post.

@Palacinky Btw Michelle already gave me good information on post op Rx, and I thanked her for the factual information. Your personal anecdotal experiences doesn't mean every single trans person will have the same experiences.

Even if we've developed more stable hormone therapy for post-op people, every other point I've made about weapons training, preparation for surgery, recovery from surgery can still be valid.

After a bit of half-hearted research, I'll clarify just a bit but still mostly stand by what I've said.

US military deploys to areas that never get to 50 degrees, places that never get below 90 degrees and places that hit 120 in the day and under 40 at night. I probably should have said consistent temperature for Rx instead of refrigerated. Medical refrigerators have built in monitors that can be programmed to alert if the temp varies by a single degree. I think our fridges when deployed would flash with 1.5 degrees of variance and sound an alarm at 4 degrees.

Medical professionals review every service member for every deployment already. If electricity or mail will be an issue for any deployment, then medical professionals review every person deploying for those issues. Again we don't allow anyone with various medical restrictions from serving in the military.

It seems like controlling temperature is good for some, but not all estrogen, but possibly essential for testosterone. lol and if anyone wants to continue the discussion, I'll provide links. Testosterone can separate into composite ingredients, we're still studying if remixing the ingredients impacts the efficacy of the Rx. I don't know enough about medical issues around transitioning or post-op trans people to say much about people who need estrogen. Considering the impact some bad Rx can have on emotions, it makes sense to err on the side of being cautious and not allow anyone who medical issues can likely interfere with

Again, I don't think there should be special exemptions for groups of people unless we can make similar exemptions for people with similar circumstances. There's existing policies for individual exemptions and I know of several extreme medical exemptions but experts reviewed their medical requirements for the specific job or mission.

If people want links on temperature requirements for testosterone, ingredients/oil separating...I'll be glad to provide them. If someone merely wants to attack, claim I'm "uneducated" and not discuss what I'm actually saying, well that's just nifty and they can get the last self-righteous word and I'll ignore them until someone who wants a genuine discussion comes around.

@Silverwhisper "Many people have a lot of biases and prejudices outside of what religion they might have fallen victim to as well." Where do you think these biases and prejudices are rooted from? People aren't born racists or homophobes. They're learned behaviors.

@Palacinky Agreed. And those religions are typically the ones you find the people who are the most. They either ARE or WERE affiliated with those institutions at some point in their lives, or they lived with people who were affiliated and taught the hate.

I disagree because I have noticed that many people who are anti-trans seem to display a lot of fear - fear that the black and white reality of "only two sexes" is crumbling for them, and the fear makes them angry. They are afraid of living in a reality where sexes are fluid, where they might be "fooled" or "tricked" into thinking one person is a different gender than their DNA, afraid that they cannot automatically identify a person's gender on sight, afraid they might be next to one at any given moment and never really know. And the biggest fear of all - that they might become sexually attracted to someone who is "fooling" them about their gender and that might mean that they themselves are not 100% their own perceived sexual orientation. Few of these people even bring religion into it - they merely want to wipe the transgendered from the face of the earth because it makes them very, very upset and uncomfortable that they exist at all, as it threatens their reality and their notion of "the way things are supposed to be".

@exilesky I can definitely respect that analysis.