I would say to her, "In all due respect, you do not know what in the hell you are talking about.
I know non-religious people who are highly responsible and conscientiously moral people -- by personal choice. You are carelessly and falsely demeaning people with false dispersions."

I have heard that a lot also. Fear of an imagined god has never been a determent to evil. Take a look at the "works" of Hitler. Besides, there are quite a few laws to insure good behavior.

You could start with "That's an interesting and controversial opinion, tell me, why would you think that?"

One of the main objects in teaching faith, is to encourage them to take on what they are taught, without recourse to questioning........Faith is that characteristic you must have, in order for you to come to believe that which is totally unbelievable.

My favourite -- so you are saying that you would be a hedonist if you were not religious? Is the only thing stopping you from murder and theft your religious beliefs? Of course this is a silly and rhetorical question, because morals are derived from empathy. Not like it matters, sounds like your coworker isn't interested in differing world views, and only wants whatever weak argument they can find to not question their own beliefs.

Most everyone would stop a murder if they could. That makes us automatically more moral than god.

If your morals are dependent on your faith. What happens if you lose that faith as so many do? Do you start cheating, lying, stealing or killing?

Even christians do not follow christianity fully. If they did then the US (which has been largely christian) would not spend such vast amounts of money on defence. It would simply turn the other cheek. No true christian could belong to the NRA or the GOP.

More morals are not necessarily higher morals. Are the Amish more moral than her? How about buddhists who will not harm any creature?

"I believe that there was this one guy in this book, who nearly killed his only son all because he had faith in the voices in his head"

ask her why you have got dressed for work and havnt just beat her to death.

"Fuck off before I thump you."
Given her statement that IS civil.

No religious person understands true altruism every good deed is done with the expectation of a reward from god that's not altruism

Only good people wear socks.

My parents were probably closet atheists or agnostics. I didn't know that till the end of their lives. No one is perfect but they were moral/ethical and brought me up that way. Told some clergy that when he trying to sell me on organized religion.

Critical thinking, the other national deficit.
I had an otherwise intelligent person tell me the same thing about morals. He couldn't understand that I could have a "moral compass" without god. Whatever.

Ask if things are moral because god says so (thus arbitrary) or if god says things because they are moral (thus god has no bearing)

It's a variation on the euthyphro dilemma and it can work wonders in these sorts of discussions.

[en.m.wikipedia.org]

Atheism as modern has been for a few centuries, but most of human history humans had faith yet read history, and it full of wars, slavery. Atheism is also a product of western culture. Since in Hinduism and Buddhism they have atheism schools but continue participating in rituals and are part of society. What wrong with a hedonistic lifestyle anyway? A life of pleasure, is only from a Christian point of view that pleasure is related to sin, which is another Christian concept. Where is the morality of Christians with the belief that non believers will be sentenced to eternal torture on hell? Worse kind of people in history are the leader that tortured, killed and sent to concentration camps people that looked, thought or were different and the God they believe will be happy to send people to hell just because they don't believe. In the end her affirmation is an affirmation of her belief system relating morality to faith, and lack of faith to immorality, and morality to lack of sin and sin to pleasure therefore hedonism. If you define morality as compassion and a system of ethics you seek happiness for the benefit of all and you don't discriminate on the basis of faith and you don't define morality as related to lack of pleasure and sin but as having compassion and love for humankind which a hedonistic lifestyle can be closer to it than a fundamentalist person who believes and is okay that people of different belief system will be tortured in hell.

I'd make the case that humans added morals into faith, not the other way around. Also point out that although people say "no, that's just fundamentalists" when confronted with examples of their scriptural law being used, that then surely means that its the fundamentals of the faith that are wrong, when they have to be justified by human reasoning to make them palatable

Tell her you're gonna murder her in the parking lot after work, seeing as how you're devoid of a moral compass and all.
P.S. I'm not one to lay all of society's ills at the feet of religion by any means, but evangelicals voted in a certain US president, so I'm calling copious amounts of bullshit on any claims of moral high ground.

You could invite her to the next idol worship and orgie party at my place and she'd see there's nothing to be alarmed about. There will be refreshments.

I find it absurd that some religious folk think their morals are some how better than mine. It's like they believe that because they can be forgiven, if we commit the same "sin" that I'm somehow more guilty than they. They walk away with no sin and I'm laden with every sin I've ever commited and the more sin I carry the less moral a person I am. Do they really think that at some point my sin level will errupt and I'll start smashing baby heads and flushing puppies down the toilet??

I think you should either not respond or respond without being civil.

Hedonistic life style.....yeah sure, whatever.
However, consensus of right/wrong, and mutual cooperation preceded any religion.
I'm sure they'll have a nonsensical response, which is why I tend away from polite, cutting to the chase of "fuck off with that shit".

Personally, those people are here for our entertainment. It's even more funny when they're jealous of the lifestyle they claim is so wrong. What's so wrong about being a hedonist? We get to really enjoy our experiences. We only get one shot at this life thing. Why spend it pent up, constipated, self-righteous, ignorant & boring? To each their own, though. BTW, I'm a recovering catholic.

The idea that a person without religion can not have "morals" is a common enough one and has been around forever. For my own part, I find that a well-thought scheme of ethics consistently produces more moral behavior than a religion and I believe there are some studies that show I could be right.

What's much more interesting to me is that your coworker is horrified by the idea of "hedonism" -- the idea that it's a bad thing for people to run around having pleasure tells us a lot about what she views as "morality".

Of course we can always pick on Catholics about molester priests, deeply corrupt popes, and sadistic nuns but fact based retorts never succeed in altering a person's worldview -- the more research you show an anti-vaxxer, the more you dig them into their anti-vaxx stance.

If you really want to engage in a discussion that produces as much emotional labor on her part as she's asking on yours, I might start with asking if hedonism is bad, why God puts in physical bodies that are capable of feeling pleasure? What sort of "love" is shown by burning someone for eternity in a fire for feeling good? Why is feeling good inherently amoral? Why does she want to in a religion where feeling good is a bad thing?

Does she know that you do not believe in a god? Was this directed at you or is she just talking to have something to say. You might ask her if she thinks you are evil. That should make her think. Also you might say that her bible tells her that she should not judge.

Does she know that you do not believe in a god? Was this directed at you or is she just talking to have something to say. You might ask her if she thinks you are evil. That should make her think. Also you might say that her bible tells her that she should not judge.